Senate The 2016 General Presidential Election

Not just a classist narrative, but also a false one that if continued is going to make the Dems crash and burn again: Trump was favored more by voters in higher income brackets; 49% of the voters with incomes between $50,000 and $99,000 supported him, compared to 47% who supported Clinton. Same with 54% of male college graduates.

 

Anyone who thinks that a 30-year Congressional member who accomplished virtually none of his stated positions -- exactly Trump's argument about Hillary Clinton, with fewer years of time doing it -- would be hailed as some sort of "outsider" is fooling themselves, even before the GOP war machine, or Breitbart machine, etc. got up and running.

The public wanted nationalism and to elect someone for the first time in the history of the United States who has never either held office or served in the military. Bernie doesn't fit that. I'm sorry.

I'd have voted for him, because I'm not a moron. There are plenty of morons out there as we just saw.

 

That is part of the reason, but the biggest issue was the lack of turnout by Democrats. Trump got two million less votes then Mitt did in 2012 and Hillary got six million less votes then Obama did in 2012. Like I said earlier, if the President was running, this doesn't happen.

Democrats need to pay attention to the concerns of working class whites in the rust belt, but they need a better crop of candidates for both the presidency and congress.

 

Ok for all you keeping track: dp4m is in the anger stages of grief, whereas KW and V03 are more the denial.

 

The Hero of 400 Years had ended plagues and catastrophe. Brought down a ruler of Egypt, and delivered the people from a moment of turmoil. They had come to accept him, with his wife much darker than what they were accustomed to, with a childhood so divergent from their own. He was, at long last, their leader; he was theirs, and they were his. Now he stood upon the mountaintop. There, he reached for something higher than himself. By trial and inspiration, he had received the contours of a new society. He would be a law giver dedicated to justice and good. A people exemplary on the Earth. He and his built on the dream of a better world.

But the people found idols. They were caught up in the dream of an illusory past. Dazzled with gold and lucre. Willing to believe a lie, if only a pleasant one. What happened to the Hero of 400 Years, the day he came to deliver up a new world? The people had retreated impossibly back to and old one. And the sound of celebration in that camp was nigh indistinguishable from that of violence and bloodshed. We cannot imagine the anguish, to know how close collapse sat. How the specter of internecine conflict was so near. It was an open question of whether the nation should continue at all.

It is a bitter ending. Miserable. But the Hero of 400 Years acknowledged their choice. Acknowledged it, and knew it was wrong. Without surrendering his dream, he descended. The wilderness was ahead. Beyond, though, he might yet teach them of a better world. For victory cannot always be guaranteed, yet hope can be forever sustained. This, at last, is the greatness of the Hero of 400 Years.

 

Trump's primary argument about Hillary Clinton was that she was corrupt. Which was, you know, helped by the fact that she had one DNC Chair rigging the debate schedule while the next in line fed her debate questions. Or that she decided to value a few extra hundred thousand dollars in private speeches over her chances of becoming President of the United States. Or that, after arrogantly ignoring the issue for almost a year, her biggest point about an e-mail set-up that blatantly violated State Department policy was that it wasn't technically a federal crime.

 

Nah, I'm just angry at the stupid hot takes from people who should know better.

I am fully in Depression.

 

You can't afford that, David. It's time to fight.

Or leave for far shores. I wouldn't blame you.

 

So my work day was surreal. Campus was unusually quiet when I got there; everywhere seemed unusually quiet. Pretty much every person of color I talked to expressed dismay and fear unprompted. Groups of students roamed the campus all day holding anti-Trump signs and shouting slogans like "Not my President!" The only solace we have is legalized pot (and plastic bag ban w00t).

 

You set yourself up for the fall though, yeah?

You refused to entertain the idea of her losing, and built he up to near mythic and flawless sentiment.

I agree that people who think Sanders would win are naïve fools or... just Wocky. But he's also right to highlight the specific and fundamental issue with her. The Guardian make the same point too.

I would dare say complicity in the conservatism that the Democrats put forward as the only option possible contributed to the result too.

 

I would definitely say the Pragmatism of the Democratic party is what killed their 2016 chances. Obama was charismatic and likable enough to counterbalance the unpopularity of Incremental Change, but it started long before HRC.

 

I also think there was a shift in argument. Both Obama and Sanders at least talked about systematic change. They were willing to try for big things, even if the end result was only some incremental improvement. By contrast, Clintonites specifically attacked such attempts as naive and foolhardy. They tried to make a virtue out of completely lacking ambition, vision, or boldness. As too many people said at the time, that's just a dim and uninspiring view of things that is no more likely to yield positive results.

 

The issue I have, Wocky, is that populist v populist is a pretty volatile mix. And that's what Sanders v Trump would have been.

 

Good points.
Still, it boggles the mind that millions of people can vote for a hateful, racist, misogynist, megalomaniac with no experience who doesn't pay his taxes, screws over his contractors and lies incessantly. The list goes on...
Just millions of really ******* stupid people, I reckon.

 

Eh, not really? People forget but there wasn't a field in 2008 either. A bunch of people ran and EVERYONE was out at Iowa, except Kucinich, Richardson and Gravel -- who were never serious contenders at any point, and two of whom dropped out a week or two after.

Edwards was a "viable" alternative, right up until he wasn't -- but it was really a two-horse race in 2008 as well, and the outsider won that one.

 

Yesterday was very exciting, a great day for America, and I know it may not seem that way to some people but I think for people who care about our economy and government spending, you're going to see very, very positive results. Even if you don't like Trump (understandable), you don't like his personality or his commentary, etc., the guy knows how to run a business and the government should be run MUCH MORE like a business and much less like a credit card without a limit. Also, stop throwing around words that anyone who disagrees with you is racist, a bigot, sexist, or whatever else. People just don't like socialists, bottom line, and I think anyone who is a socialist is an idiot too. I think that's actually very clear given that you have to be just stupid to think that you can TAX an economy into prosperity. It has never worked in human history, it doesn't work in Europe, and it doesn't work in Canada, why would you want that here? Move somewhere else if you want to pay 75% of your paycheck to the government. This is the land of the free and we should be lowering taxes, not raising them. Millions of SMART people rose up and overthrew the establishment yesterday while millions of DUMB people are sitting here today whining and moaning about a great win.

There are a lot of words the liberals love to throw around, none of which mean what they think they mean. Of course, it being an election between two VERY white people, there is no "racism" and yet we hear this constantly. This after we elected a black president two terms in a row. Trump is a repudiation of his failed policies and what an absolute disaster -- by all analysis -- ObamaCare has been. It will be shredded and thrown out, just like it should be. Since that terrible garbage went into effect my monthly rate for the worst possible high deductible plan went from $88/month to $233/month for a young guy in perfect shape and no issues. Paying $233/month for something I absolutely never use is ridiculous. At least I drive my car! Even then, I pay much less for it. That despite my insurance company having to pay out $40,000 when an uninsured drunk driver destroyed my fairly new Camaro 2SS special edition (Transformers) car. Medical insurance hasn't ever paid out anything nor do I even go to the doctor almost ever, actually I've officially never seen a Kaiser doctor, only a few nurse visits.

The other one is why don't we try using Google or the dictionary for "nationalism" or "populist" and stop throwing around these great words like they're cuss words. What the heck have you liberal media watchers been smoking lately?! America is the greatest country on earth! NATIONALISM is a GOOD thing and is based around the idea that we take care of our own before we take care of random people in another country. It's the belief in American exceptionalism and that this is the greatest country on earth. And it is, without question. There aren't a lot of other good options, so it's really not even close. There is socialist Europe, a horrible cesspool with high unemployment and high taxes. There is Asia, which is hit or miss (North Korea or China anyone?), and there is Latin America, another garbage dump of lousy countries. So what's the problem with being a nationalist who believes America is the greatest country on earth and we should spend our tax dollars on OUR people and create jobs for OUR people? That's what OUR president SHOULD be doing! I mean this is a no-brainer, it's not even up for debate. It's just simple logic. We don't have one World Order and we're not electing a president of the Earth, we're electing a president of the United States and that person should believe firmly that this is the greatest country ever, in human history, and work to make sure it stays that way.

Trump will erase 8 years of terrible decisions and policies by Obama like they were nothing. The last 8 years felt like a bad hangover with horrible politics, and now at last we'll have the clouds clear and order return. For anyone like myself, a small business owner, I can't wait for Trump to take control with full Republican control of the houses. Bye bye oppressive taxes, bye bye huge corporate income taxes, and hello trillions of dollars that will be repatriated to our economy from overseas. Obama cost me money, a lot of money, and I vote with my wallet. It's that simple. If you run on a platform to raise my taxes, I will vote against you no matter what. Taxes are HIGH ENOUGH, way too high, and Trump knows that. He will directly impact the quality of my life by cutting my taxes and improving the economy. Businesses will be taken care of and those businesses are MY clients as a B2B company owner. I'm a happy camper. It was a great day where America told the liberal elite where to shove it -- right where the sun don't shine!

 

*goes to grab popcorn*

 

Shouldn't you be lifting your IMDB profile somewhere, Bowen?

 

Like this?

 

Hey, you guys bought it. Have fun. Stay on your side of the border, please.

 

It is cute that fiscal conservatives still think the GOP give a crap about spending.

 

Again, dp4m, that's a different thing. The 2008 race turned into a two person slugfest because that's what voters were most interested in. But there many candidates with plausible resumes who had a fair shot at building a campaign and trying to compete. In 2016, many of those who could have competed did not, because people were actively clearing the field for Clinton and hadicapping anyone who dared to defy divine right to the nomination.

 

Because those details are definitely essential to your argument.

 

You know that kind of bragging often leads to a leukemia diagnosis, right Bowen? Karma is a harsh mistress.