Games The 26th Jedi Draft - Congratulations to our victor, KenKenobi!

Me, having finally compiled Ventress's full resume only for her to hit a forfeit:



Also, not getting a dino vs. dino match between Desann and Thon:




Anyway, Lumi/Barriss are the tightest trump in the game. Desann/Tavion have...never been depicted fighting together. Sorry this gif doesn't involve Keanu:

 

Yeah, but Barriss and Lumi are pretty much the Alabama of the Jedi Draft - they ain't played nobody.

Lumi's best showing is as a hologram, leading Kanan Jarrus into a trap, and Barriss's best showings are either non-combat (framing Ahoska) or speculated bad showings (I subscribe to the theory that she's Sarah Michelle Geller in Rebels).

Otherwise, what do they got? Showings against clankers? Losses to other members of my team?

Spoiler

and yes, that opening line is get @KenKenobi to fight himself as he struggles with defending his pairing and defending Alabama, during college football season

 

Inty is the Big Ten b/c he's late to the Lumi/Barriss party.

Ain't played nobody?



Nobody?



(She has vision in one eye here btw)


Barriss also beats ya girl Ahsoka twice. The Temple framing is "non-combat" in the way Fichigan's recent record against Ohio State is "non-embarrassing"--



...and is all the more impressive given she had to A) also ensure to explode those canisters to alert authorities, and B) dominate to the point she could force her into the precise area near the nano-droids (for when said authorities arrived).


Meanwhile, the dino hangs his rep on a single Force push on Luke, like he's Nebraska talking about the glory days. Tavion might as well be a D3 school (w/o a full scholarship).

In summary: Lumi/B are gonna trash Desann/T like they're Rutgers and I AM NOT NICK SABAN WTF

YOU WERE MY BROTHER INTYKIN

 

God dammit, why are my Jedi trump hitting Ben Solo again. I still can’t believe I lost that last time, and I don’t believe I’m about to lose it again. This trump is definitely better than last time though...

 

I want to add a little more incase votes happen while I sleep. I’m sleepy so sorry if it’s a mess.

I know the argument will be made that my four Jedi died in silly ways. But to be fair, Palpatine sliced Saesee Tiin in seconds, yet he also tossed Ben Solo away down an abyss with the lift of his hand. So I don’t really see that argument helping.

Also, the other three died on their own. Ki-Adi against a squad of Clones who caught him off guard. Plo Koon randomly shot from behind in his ship, which can’t have been predicted. And Adi Gallia against Savage, which she only lost by trying to make it physical - something she won’t have an issue with against Ben.

So all four of them together, against one single opponent without a large reputation - they’re not going to drop like flies. Ben’s only opponents are Rey, Rey, Rey, and some of Luke’s Padawans. I mean really... It’s not a lot to go by. He’s never faced a real threat. Mine all have.

Asajj Ventress, Savage Opress, and General Grievous are just three opponents this lot has experience against, which all except Adi survived. I’d confidently say all three of these villains are more impressive than Ben, based on their duelling history and reputation.

Last time I lost when Agen and Eeth were here instead of Ki-Adi and Plo. I feel like Ki-Adi should be the deciding factor here, as he’s the most impressive of my bottom field Jedi. An argument can be made for Ben being the strongest in the Force, but Mundi literally leaves craters behind when he attempts to Force push his opponents, as seen in his duel with Grievous. So I’d say the two of them are pretty equal in this field.

Surely... surely they’d be able to take Ben down together. On their own, no. In a pair, maybe not. But all together, definitely! Find me something, anything, that says Ben could take down four experienced Jedi Masters who are all fighting cohesively together. They have the experience, the skill, and are strong in the Force. On their own they don’t have a lot of wins, but combined they could take down a fair amount of reputable Sith. You’ve got this Jedi!

 

I'll (for sure) have a response for that either tomorrow or Monday. Shouldn't take me too long, but I just can't tonight.

 

PS get HYPE for a Starfighter Draft soon (or just this game)

If anyone has an Xbox we should make a squadron and wreck ****. @ma_petite this means you're required to get an Xbox.

 

I'm going to be so terrible at that game

 

Yeah, this trump isn't significantly better than the last one Ben faced. If anything, I'd say ever so slightly better, but that's as far as I'll go.

Look, I had Ki-Adi last time. I know good and hell well just how thin his rap sheet really is. I initially wanted to use him and Aayla as a tandem and pair them with Dark Woman, which I thought would be a pretty cool little trio, but that fell through and instead tandem'd him with Oppo. And it was Oppo who was the clear cut MVP of that pairing, with his battle meditation. And BM aside, his showing right before his death against the assassins is a good deal more impressive than anything we've ever seen from Mundi. Hell, I remember arguing Mundi/Oppo and Kit/Aayla over Bane of all dudes (an argument I stand by), but again, Oppo was the MVP. Without his BM, I could not have made the case at all convincingly. Kit and Aayla were crucial. Mundi was just kinda... there. He was that final warm body that pushed it over the edge and made the argument possible, I suppose. I could never find anything substantial. I tried spinning his super short and inconclusive duel against Ventress as a feat, but I believe it was DE who (correctly) pointed out that Ventress only ran from him because she had a mission of her own to complete. It's such a nothing duel and that was about the best I could muster. He's not terrible. He isn't undraftable or anything. He's an okay complimentary piece, but there's just so little there.

Ditto for Plo Koon. Can't help but notice that you didn't say anything about him. That's because there isn't anything! Okay... there almost isn't anything. I'm not a fan of him being useless here. I always thought he had potential to be a badass, but they just never did anything with him. We've got a reputation for him and very, very little else. His "respect thread" is borderline pathetic. When some of the best you can muster for a respect thread is blurbs from the back of an action figure, you're in trouble. I love how there's a section for him being able to use Force push, with a few pretty unimpressive displays for us to look at... like being able to use basic Force push against some droids and thugs is somehow worthy of respect. Like, "Hey, here's Plo Koon doing something pretty much every Jedi ever (aside from Corran Horn, I guess) can do! Respect him!".

I also like how they mention him disarming "Noted Jedi Killer" Aurra Sing, while ignoring the fact that, in the Nu-canon universe that happened in, Aurra Sing isn't even Force-sensitive! Seeing through your smoke screen, respect thread dudes.

His fight with Savage was a couple panels long and then he got his mask knocked off. His fight with Ventress was slightly better, but totally inconclusive. It's something. It ain't much, but it is at least something.

I just fail to see how these two are all that much better than Agen and Eeth. A little bit. I'll grant you just a little bit, but I still defer to Inty's 3rd rule of drafting. Plo Koon sucks. He just does. I mean, you do have a Starfighter Draft trump here that could take out nearly anyone. But that's there and this is here.

Adi only lost against Savage because she tried to "make it physical"? No. She lost because she was out-everything'd. At no point was she in control. Savage handled her completely and thoroughly. She has nothing. No good wins.

Tiin has nothing.

These guys suck. Not all PT Jedi suck (Kit and Aayla are really good, but they're not taking Cade), but these do. Some a little less than others here, but they all suck to varying degrees. Together they form a Voltron of "Well, I guess they're a challenge due to sheer numbers, BUT THEY ALL JUST SUCK".

Rey isn't a threat? Rey sucks? Stop. Just stop. No, her w/prep over Kenobi would not have been my call, and even though she's no first-rounder (neither is Ben for that matter), she is WELL beyond this group. I'd put her over this group as well (but less convincingly, if only because Ben has been fleshed out more), because she out-powers all of them by a country mile.

Look, if the best you have for power in this trump is "Mundi leaves craters with his Force push", we're done here. People need to stop with that series. It's... it's one of my favorite pieces of EU material, but it's just so bananas. The craters are just due to the style of the animation and it's extremely over the top. The way I've always looked at it is that it's like... an exaggerated, dramatized holo-net version of the events that actually took place. Like they happened, but just not exactly like that.

Okay, lemme see if I can sum that particular issue up with a simple question.

Can Mace Windu fly?

Of course he can't. No Jedi can. Not even Luke. For that matter, no Jedi can Force leap multiple miles in a single leap. It just doesn't work that way.

Except it does in the Tartakovsky Clone Wars series.

Here is it in all its glory:



I started it at the most relevant part, but maybe watch the whole thing. I mean, it's great, right? It's so much fun! It's also total bull****. The most obvious question it begs is, if Mace could do this to an army of battle droids the whole time, then why did he let so many Jedi die on Geonosis while holding all this back? It's because he can't do this because the Tartakovsky series, while unbelievably fun, is pure bull****. Everything is cranked up to 11.

But again, just check out where I started the video. You see the scale of the gigantic Separatist piston-crushy thingy, and where he lands... is that like 10 miles away? It's at least 5! NO! Force leaps don't work like that! I don't care if you're Mace or Yoda or Luke or Sidious or ANYONE! THEY DON'T WORK LIKE THAT! IT'S AT LEAST 5 MILES AWAY AND IT'S ALL UPWARDS TRAJECTORY AND IT'S TOTALLY CASUAL AND HE TAKES A SIP OF WATER AND THEN FLIES (NO, LITERALLY, FLIES) BACK INTO THE FRAY LIKE IT'S NOTHING. NO.

NO. Bull****. And we all know it.

So I don't care if Ki-Adi leaves craters with his Force push here. He hasn't shown that kind of power anywhere else, and even if he did... even if he did...



11:30. Nothing Ki-Adi or ANYONE else in the trump has shown can even begin to compare to this. Absolutely nothing. And this was when Ben was a scared, conflicted whelp of a padawan. Far removed from his peak.

I covered all of this already, including the dismissal of when Paps tosses him. It's back on page 35. I know it's been a while, but maybe a refresher is in order. I covered all of it. None of these four are draining his Dyad-ness, rendering him weak and helpless. He out-powers all of these Jedi by orders of magnitude, and they don't have a significant enough skill edge to close that gap.

They.

Suck.

As a conglomerate, they suck less, but not enough to beat Ben. And he's not even a first-rounder and is only arguably a second-rounder, but you don't HAVE TO BE that to beat these four. If they had some battle meditation on their side, then sure, but they don't.

They're turrible.

 

Why wouldn't Luke be able to jump like that given he's a Sky Walker? *rimshot* *groans*

Other examples do exist though-- Teneniel talks about the Nightsisters climbing mountains that way in Courtship of Princess Leia, which is maybe the first time CoPL's been mentioned since @Mikaboshi was introducing Gethzerion lol. Anyway all of this is reminding me of the physics professor who broke down Rey's weird backflip in RoS, which is worth the read.

EDIT: PS not that it monumentally affects this match, but again Rise of Kylo Ren Chapter 3 was published after we started.

 

Yeah, but those are Nightsisters. Nightsisters are their own weird thing.

And I guess I don't see the RoKR thing being a problem because it's just fleshing out his past, not granting him a new peak mid-draft. He's got plenty of power feats in the films that are perfectly in line with anything shown during RoKR, and redeemed Ben Solo is his peak, no matter what's shown during these comics that take place when he's younger.

Say tomorrow they published a comic series focused on Jacen during... let's say the Force Heretic trilogy. And maybe it shows him kicking all kinds of ass. I'd personally have no problem (and not just because he's on my team) taking it into account here, because ultimately it wouldn't change anything. It's more feats for the pile, but it doesn't matter because LotF Jacen would annihilate Jacen circa Force Heretic no matter how many accomplishments are added to that time period.

Or whatever example you'd want to use with a character that's not on my team. Mace. Same deal. If we got a novel tomorrow about the exploits of a young, freshly-Knighted Mace Windu, great, add it to the pile. Wouldn't really change anything.

Those comics just show that, yes, Ben does have battle experience beyond just Rey. And yes, he was always extremely powerful, even in his younger days.

Speaking of his "younger days", until recently I had no idea Ben was supposed to be like 30 years old. Like... was he conceived literally the same night that RotJ ended? Was it like, big happy group shot at the end, roll credits and then Han and Leia politely excuse themselves?

 

TBH, I'm more concerned about the fact that during a mother****ing war, he's just okay accepting a sip of liquid from some random kid.

How did Sidious not get word of this, and start to weaponize kids everywhere to try to kill some of the most problematic Jedi. You telling me he wouldn't try to poison Yoda? Windu? Kenobi (though, to be fair, that would require poison that would survive being in alcohol, because we all know Kenobi is a drunk and lives on a BAL north of .25).

Are we supposed to just accept that the seemingly all knowing Dark Lord of the Sith somehow doesn't know this? Or that the win at all cost Emperor-to-be wouldn't reduce himself to weaponizing small children?

 

Huh... you're not wrong! I just watched it again, only this time I imagined that the music was the Emperor's Theme and right at the end there's the faintest echo of the trademark Sheev cackle. Totally works. Yet another reason Palps is a moron.

 

I mean, it doesn't matter what you "personally have no problem with" lol, I personally have no problem with X2 carrying 40 rocket launchers but #rules amirite?

But aside from busting your balls, just gotta ensure we don't cherry pick what to include past a publication date. You can keep trying to slip in that material, but you then you also gotta deal with things like material revealing Rey actively assisted Ben against the Knights of Ren (beyond just giving him the saber), similar to the Praetorian Guard. All one big canon family. (<— has this phrase ever even been typed before)

And Inty, Palps is one step ahead of you. Cue his next reincarnation via BROOMSTICK KID

 

Anyone else want a short where Yoda, Kenobi, and Windu are taken through the world between worlds to see Sheev's greatest hits, just so we can get Windu quipping "how in the hell were we outsmarted by this mother****er?"

In the new trilogy novel from Timothy Zahn ... Grand Admiral Thrawn has awakened on Canto Bight. But how did he survive being sucked into space by hyperspace whales? and what ... or who ... summoned him here?

 

He hears a strange broadcast...but only b/c the child with a broomstick near him is playing Fortnite...

 

Ugh, of course I don’t have an Xbox


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

...yet

 

Playoffs Round 2 Match 2

@Jordan1Kenobi (2) vs. @Wang Chi (1)

1. Kit Fisto / Aayla Secura vs. Cade Skywalker
5. Ki-Adi-Mundi / Plo Koon / Adi Gallia / Saesee Tiin (Trump) vs. Ben Solo - I'm inclined to go with Ben here. I was already leaning to him, but the Jedi's lack of high level feats speak for themselves, and Wang pointed out that Ben is a top third pick now. The comics are reinforcing that and will only continue to do so I think as Disney are hell bent on making him more Kylo than Ben. Either way, his aggression and Force power would prevail here.
9. Galen Marek vs. Ferus Olin

@KenKenobi (2) vs. @DarthIntegral (1)

1. Darth Jadus/Darth Nyriss vs. Savage Opress TRUMPED with Darth Maul
5. Asajj Ventress vs. Darth Ma ul TRUMPED with Savage Opress (FORFEIT)
9. Luminara Unduli/Bariss Offee vs. Desann/Tavion - This was never a thing.

@Point Given @cubman987

 

Thank you for having me! I am always spectating, but I am sorry I could not be more present. I really wish I could - these things are so much fun! Maybe next time will be mine..... (though I count the muggle draft as like 20% of a win for me)

 

You def got an invite to the porg float for that. Inty deserves one for 2006.

Which is why this current match is truly:

 

Really glad this match is taking place while I'm still in Denver, so I can have claim to the high ground