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Senate The Concept of "Bipartisanship" and Alternatives

Discussion in 'Community' started by Emperor Ferus, May 11, 2020.

  1. Emperor Ferus

    Emperor Ferus Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 29, 2016
    I’m curious about what you guys think about bipartisanship, both as a desirable goal and a possibility. I’ve seen mixed opinions on it, and while it seems like an ideal outcome to me, I understand why it doesn’t seem possible. Why compromise when you can go all the way with your beliefs?

    I understand that the left and right have fundamental differences, and sometimes they have to argue it out (I prefer through peaceful means) until one side gets their way. But is it true that the two sides are so irreconcilably split that they can’t function in a democracy anymore?

    For the record, I do think certain beliefs are flat out wrong or immoral, but I’m curious about whether we can remain a stable society despite such differing ideologies.
     
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  2. tom

    tom Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 14, 2004
  3. Jabba-wocky

    Jabba-wocky Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    May 4, 2003
    I think there is a spectrum, dependent on the issue in question. As tom points out, some things are clearly non-negotiable.

    On others, however, I think you’re hard pressed to make that case. Whether one genuinely believes lower taxes or a tighter regulatory regime against abusive inserting would help the economy grow faster, I think we have to be prepared to accept what our side views as “sub-optimal” solutions for the sake of policy-making. That is, even knowing something is wrong and stupid, we let the other side go ahead with it, so long as the human cost is not excessive.

    The key for me is not that there are no non-negotiable. It’s the idea that we can’t declare everything to be one. At some points of domestic or foreign policy, one has to resign themselves to “losing”/being over-ruled about the direction of policy. Anything else promises total war, which isn’t sustainable.
     
  4. Yodaminch

    Yodaminch Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 6, 2002
    I would have said that no, there are some things we all can agree on. But this virus proved that in fact that is not the case.

    You would think all politicians would be pro-constituents living. However, some believe that sacrificing lives to save the economy is necessary. Others believe states should declare bankruptcy. It just seems that one side is so out of touch with reality that you simply cannot get them back. And until they come back down to Earth, you simply cannot reason or compromise. There simply cannot be bipartisanship in a situation like that.

    Now, is it totally dead? Not on an individual level. And not on a state and local level. But as a whole, on a federal level? There is no bipartisanship that can occur if one side views the other as the enemy. Exploiting this crisis to earn political points is despicable on both sides- but only one seems to be content with letting people die. You simply cannot compromise on that.
     
  5. Luke02

    Luke02 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 19, 2002
    When one side sees wearing masks in public as a time to show "defiance" and not do it, the idea of bipartisanship is regrettably laughable.
     
  6. Jedi Master Scorpio

    Jedi Master Scorpio Star Wars Television star 4 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Oct 24, 2015
    Since I'm what you would call a Neutral observer here (I don't support either side these days) I welcome more bi-partisan bills. Unfortunately, I'm not sure it is even possible anymore. It just sucks, because like myself, there are folks who don't align with either side that is caught in the middle of this mess.

    I'll try to remain optimistic but I won't hold my breath.
     
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  7. Alpha-Red

    Alpha-Red Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 25, 2004
    Bipartisanship should not be pursued for its own sake. We did this under Obama, and it just gave Republicans carte blanche to define what bipartisanship was. Republicans moved their party further and further to the right, and when Obama refused their demands they would shriek "look at how partisan the Democrats are!". The Republicans are the ones who killed bipartisanship...not the Democrats. But the media decided that both sides were to blame, because they're attached to this idea that both sides *must* be equally at fault.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2020
  8. TCF-1138

    TCF-1138 Anthology & Fan Films Manager and Ewok Enthusiast star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Sep 20, 2002
    Why would it be a good thing to work and compromise with a far-right, anti-democratic party? Why would this be desirable? I honestly don't understand this.
     
  9. Healer_Leona

    Healer_Leona Squirrel Rangler of Fun & Games star 9 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2000
    If the current administration could learn not to lie, cheat and steal, perhaps bipartisanship might be something worth looking at. Until then, I really don't care, do you?
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2020
  10. anakinfansince1983

    anakinfansince1983 Nightsister of Five Realms star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Mar 4, 2011
    I’ve seen bipartisanship work here at a local level. We even have a popular podcast between a Democratic and a Republican City Council member where they hash out issues in a friendly manner.

    But locally in order to get elected as a Republican you have to be pretty moderate. Bipartisanship is easier when priorities and goals are similar but the methods of funding those goals differ.

    Bipartisanship is also easier when people are all drawing from the same sources, when both sides believe in educating themselves about the issues and are willing to rely on expertise for information. When one party believes educated people and experts in a field are the enemy, bipartisanship becomes impossible.
     
  11. Lord Vivec

    Lord Vivec Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Apr 17, 2006
    How exactly are you "caught in the middle?" What centrist "values" of yours are not being put in supposed bi-partisan bills that would be if partisanship were to end?
     
  12. Jedi Master Scorpio

    Jedi Master Scorpio Star Wars Television star 4 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Oct 24, 2015
    Does it really matter? I feel that I'm caught in the middle, I don't need to explain myself to nobody.
     
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  13. Lord Vivec

    Lord Vivec Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Apr 17, 2006
    In the middle of what? It's true that you don't *have* to explain but if you want to participate in discussions it generally helps that you do.
     
  14. Jedi Master Scorpio

    Jedi Master Scorpio Star Wars Television star 4 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Oct 24, 2015
    I can participate in any discussion that I want. As long as I'm not bothering anyone, all is well.

    I'm Native American, I belong to Federally Recognized Tribe here in Michigan. And when I say that I feel as though I'm caught in the middle one of the main reasons is because neither party has done much to help my Tribe at least. Sure both sides claim to want to recognize the treaties that were signed, but there still seems to be a constant take, but no give. We have a our Sovreign Rights, but that is about it. My Tribe has to beg both sides to get anything extra.

    So that is why I don't have no allegiances and feel like I'm caught in the middle.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2020
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  15. Lordban

    Lordban Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 9, 2000
    In a two-party system with a right-wing party and a far-right party dominating the scene, I care rather little for bipartisanship beyond the local level.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2020
  16. Alpha-Red

    Alpha-Red Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 25, 2004
    If that's true then you have my sympathies. I don't know what sort of issues you might be facing, or what can be done about it. I still think we need to look at the big picture, and in that one party is clearly better than the other. Perhaps the Democrats don't deserve your allegiance...but you should vote for them anyway (if you can).
     
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  17. Jedi Master Scorpio

    Jedi Master Scorpio Star Wars Television star 4 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Oct 24, 2015
    I have until November to decide.
     
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  18. 3sm1r

    3sm1r Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 27, 2017
    Bipartisanship makes sense if there is a compromise to be made on the issues. You don't do bipartisan stuff just for the sake of bragging about talking to Republicans.

    Bernie, for example, made a legislation with McCain to help veterans and a war powers resolution with Lee to stop the support for the Saudi-led war in Yemen. Both are good things.
     
  19. Lord Vivec

    Lord Vivec Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Apr 17, 2006
    I'm going to posit that you're not caught "in the middle." Democrats and Republicans are essentially the same ideology with a few differences. You're not caught in the middle, you're caught outside.
     
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  20. Sarge

    Sarge Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Oct 4, 1998
    I remember years and years ago, Reagan was making a state-of-the-union speech. He expressly thanked a group he called Reagan Democrats and explained that those were politicians in the Democrat party who chose to vote for policies that were good for the nation, even if those policies were proposed by Republicans. It's been a long long time since I've seen anything like that at the national level.
     
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  21. Lord Vivec

    Lord Vivec Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Apr 17, 2006
    Reagan and his policies were anything but good for the nation
     
  22. Alpha-Red

    Alpha-Red Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 25, 2004
    I understand there's that sentimentality attached to the idea of bipartisanship. But as pointed out by others, bipartisanship isn't always a good thing. Even when it is desirable, compromise needs to be a two-way street. I would argue that Democrats made a good faith attempt to reach out to Republicans, and it was Republicans who refused. Mitch McConnell literally said out loud he wanted to deny Obama any bipartisan accomplishment in order to turn Republican voters against him. That's really cynical and perverse.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2020
  23. Ghost

    Ghost Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Oct 13, 2003
    On issues of morality, sometimes one side just needs to be totally defeated on an issue in order to make progress and finally move past that issue. The most famous of these is Slavery.

    Obama tried to make "Obama Republicans" a thing. And we see how that went.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2020
  24. a star war

    a star war Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 4, 2016
    The problem with bipartisanship is that the right is doing this:
    [​IMG]

    and the American "Left" does this:
    [​IMG]

    And they call that "reaching across the aisle".
     
  25. Juliet316

    Juliet316 Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Apr 27, 2005
    Bipartisanship is dead, and has been dead for decades.
     
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