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The Emperor's Pawns article (was: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by jedimasterED, Jun 28, 2001.

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  1. The Gatherer

    The Gatherer Jedi Youngling star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 2, 1999
    Thank God for that.

    Before everyone jumps to interpretations of what Chris said, why not let him answer for himself.
     
  2. Wedge 88

    Wedge 88 Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 16, 1999
    Yeah, Chris, give us an answer? I really thought when you said you got the new gamer you meant 5.
     
  3. Valiento

    Valiento Jedi Knight star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 19, 2000
    Look at the date when chris post was originally posted. It was in the month Gamer 4 was coming out. We had no idea about what gamer #5 would be like.
     
  4. Wedge 88

    Wedge 88 Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 16, 1999
    I know, but the messedge didn't seem to fit gamer 4. And it 4 wasn't new to me when I read the post, so I assumed he meant 5.
     
  5. Valiento

    Valiento Jedi Knight star 7

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    Mar 19, 2000
    Ya it fits kyle's letter in gamer 4, if you read between the lines. Nothing in it fits gamer 5. Gamer 5 wasn't even known about at the time of that post.
     
  6. Valiento

    Valiento Jedi Knight star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 19, 2000
    bad news, we know kyle hunter's, ben harper, and dave land's stance on STar wars tales. Next issue is going to be a Tales themed issue. You know what the means don't you?
     
  7. Wedge 88

    Wedge 88 Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 16, 1999
    Lots of new short stories?

    Dangit, I need this magazine! Everyone else here seems to have it. I run to the mail box everyday looking for it. I'm tired of doing so for over a week. Better be here towmorrow or someone is going to be hurt.
     
  8. Valiento

    Valiento Jedi Knight star 7

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    Mar 19, 2000
    No it means next issue could get the infinities mark, :p
     
  9. Wedge 88

    Wedge 88 Jedi Grand Master star 6

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    Jul 16, 1999
    The stories and stuff about them... ya.
     
  10. Valiento

    Valiento Jedi Knight star 7

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    Mar 19, 2000
    Well, when people like kyle hunter, dave land, and ben harper are in charge, thing with tales in the name everythin in the issue seems to be posted in non-continuity icons. Let's just hope it's true what was said, and WOTC has an apology letter, in the issue explaining that the icon in issue 4, and possible issue 6, only refers to tales comics. Let me say if tales comics in issue 6, are good continuity comics, and because they are "tales comics", they get ignored, So help me, Bah, [face_devil]. Can't they be smarter than that?
     
  11. bongles

    bongles Jedi Youngling star 1

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2001
    Valiento,

    On behalf of all Star Wars fans who can still enjoy the simple pleasure of reading a good story and enjoying it on its own merits...

    On behalf of readers new and old willing to give new directions and risky ventures a chance...

    Heck, on behalf of the tireless freelancers, editors, and writers associated with WOTC and Lucas Books who don't have a forum in which to defend themselves...

    ... I hereby formally invite you to stop reading Star Wars products. In fact, if you provide me with a PO Box, I will PAY for subscriptions to Star Trek Magazine, Star Trek Communicator, the X-Files Magazine and any other franchise publication to better redirect your sour grapes and vitriole.

    At the risk of getting banned for a personal attack (granted, a hopefully eloquent one), I tire of your complaints and can wholeheartedly say that you represent the worst in Star Wars fandom.

    A few years ago, before TPM, in the innocence of the mid-90s, I was walking around in the rosy-hued delusion that Star Wars fans were fun-loving folks, hipper and edgier than your usual fanboy geeks. I proudly proclaimed myself part of the Star Wars Generation because we had the cool fans. Did Trekkers paint their skateboards with images of Gorns and Klingons? Hell, no. Did Dr. Who fans recieve commendations for a bitchin' Dalek tattoo? No, of course not. Did bands like weezer publicly proclaim their love for Space 1999? Never! Star Wars was bitchin'.

    Then the internet proved me incredibly wrong. There were folks like you, throwing the baby away with the bathwater should something not fit a close-minded vision of what an entirely fictional universe could be. There were folks like Curtis Saxton wasting not only precious time, but an incredible wealth of technical knowledge discussing how furry teddy bears should not be alive after the end of a children's movie. Then TPM came out and it all went to hell.

    I saw the stinking masses clotting the movie theater entrances, like mildew gumming up shower tile. And I realized that I did not want to be seen with them. I folded up my Boba Fett t-shirts. I tucked my Star Wars comics behind TIME and Entertainment Weekly. These fans were no different from the rest of the unwashed ilk. Hell, they might as well have been LARPers.

    Today, I cannot wander into the TPM forum without being saddened, looking at legions of fans who invariably, completely and unabashedly miss the whole freakin' point.

    This whole thing is make-believe. This whole thing is fun. If anyone has taken the care to read this far, do me a favor. Say that once again. Hell, say it aloud. You're probably alone anyway. No one will think you odd.

    This whole thing is make-believe. This whole thing is fun.

    Gamer #4, which ranks in your books, Valiento, as one of the greatest crimes against humanity (you actually called for the dismissal of Kyle Hunter for an editorial he wrote... wow), was to me an awesome issue, and one of the funnest reads I've had in ages. Did I care about the Infinities logo?

    No. Because Jaxxon is no more 'real' if there's a stinking logo on the mag or not.

    I love Star Wars. I love the movies. I love the comics. I love the website. I love the adventure. I love how it inspires me to think about big things. I love how it expands my imagination, not limits it. How it makes me feel like i'm 8 years old again waiting in line for Empire with my dad, or running to my neighborhood comic store, to see if Luke and Threepio have escaped Valance the bounty hunter.

    The only thing I don't love about Star Wars anymore is the fans.

    Your griping is proving to me that you're obviously not enjoying this anymore. I'm asking you to do yourself a favor and end your pain, and let those of us who do like Star Wars enjoy ourselves.

    Awright admins, ban me, I guess. But I really hope that there are SOME Star Wars fans out there that remember how it was before the timeline-crafters and online technical commentary folks squeezed the life out of a fairy tale. And I want to let any WOTC, Dark Horse, Scholastic, LucasB
     
  12. Matthew Trias

    Matthew Trias Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 8, 1999
    And you my friend represnt some of the worst worst in humanity. :p
     
  13. Wedge 88

    Wedge 88 Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 16, 1999
    Some people find enjoyment in the timelines and chronologies, the same enjoyment you find in Star Wars just being fun. You can say they may be hurting Star Wars because they like things you don't, but that dosn't make people agree with you.

    I agree with you that Star Wars is fun. I just don't want that fun spoiled by everything turning into a medicore comedy fest like what we saw in Tales 9.

    I'm still excited about Gamer, I want this issue soooo bad, and I still don't have it!

    And I have enjoyed Timetales and the other great timelines and encyclopedias online. For me its the only way I can find some stories, like WEG and Marvel stories.

    Maybe I read what you said wrong.
     
  14. TalonCard

    TalonCard •Author: Slave Pits of Lorrd •TFN EU Staff star 5 VIP

    Registered:
    Jan 31, 2001
    Holy over-reaction, Batman... (On all sides.) Sheesh...

    TC
     
  15. Wedge 88

    Wedge 88 Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 16, 1999
    I didn't overreact. I replied.

    And I didn't flame.

    Thanks.
     
  16. pat-fett

    pat-fett Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Mar 17, 2001
    I understand what you are saying boungles to a point. In Val's defense and those like him I want to say that to them and even sometimes myself we find it fun to analyz and argue a point about SW in any form. Yes it is a Fairy Tale and make believe. Yes it is a place to let your imagination run wild.Yet it is so much more than that. I find it sad that you look down on people's right to enjoy SW in a way that you do not understand. Not everyone is the same.
     
  17. The Gatherer

    The Gatherer Jedi Youngling star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 2, 1999
    I don't think you have the correct understanding of our purpose when you derise people who enjoy constructing timelines of the Star Wars universe.

    We literally invest thousands of dollars over the years in the many novels and comics that have been produced. I am sure that with such an investment, you would expect a high professional standard. That is why often we get upset when there is a continuity problem, because in our eyes, the powers that be have not paid close enough attention to their own material. Call us nitpicky, but that is part of our enjoyment, to see where things fit and how.

    Please don't let this turn into a flame-fest.
     
  18. Valiento

    Valiento Jedi Knight star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 19, 2000
    <blinks> No comment, except to say others have hit it on the nail.....
     
  19. jedimasterED

    jedimasterED Moderator Emeritus star 4 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 10, 1999
    As Wedge 88 said, fans find different ways to enjoy this epic and expanded Saga we call Star Wars. Some enjoy the fantasy, fairy tale feeling they get when they watch, read, collect, roleplay, etc. Others enjoy certain characteristics of the Saga; from the cool creatures, characters, and technology, to the cohesive story that stretches beyond (what will be) six excellent films.

    Valiento obviously enjoys the Saga more when the attempts at a cohesive continuity mesh well and make sense. I know I do.

    However, (and please read this carefully and in full) the fact that one fan does not share the same vision for enjoying the Saga as you does not make them a bad fan.

    A bad fan would stop caring, stop buying, and stop enjoying. I honestly believe Val and others like him complain about the shortcomings they perceive in the Saga not to tear down the Saga that they love and enjoy, but to find support among like-minded fans, thus a way to enjoy the title they did not enjoy.

    Remember those fans in Major League (the 1st, and only good one)? The fans who complained about how much the Indians sucked, but they were still paying season ticket-holders and they came to every home game? They were finding a way (sure it was an odd way) to enjoy the team they loved. A team they would stick with and love through thick and thin.

    Fans like Val might not make sense to fans who have a different take on the Saga, but it doesn't mean they should not be fans anymore because they upset other fans.

    As you invited Val above, I invite you to stop participating in discussions that annoy you. I won't go as far as you did and reveal just how much disdain I have for the way you conduct yourself in these forums through sarcastic offers to aide you in finding a solution, but I will say that you can do the same thing you asked Val to do: Stop trying to enjoy these forums, and thus, this Saga. Stop wanting to connect with other fans and get to know just what it is that makes them tick and just how and why they love the Saga. Stop liking Star Wars the way you do.

    Not so easy? Then I suggest you find a better way to interact with those fans who you do not agree with or understand. You might be verbose and better spoken than some here at the JC, but it doesn't make you right. Being rude and derisive, no matter how well put, doesn't make friends or fall in line with the JC posting guidelines. And while I can appreciate the necessity of reminders to relax and not take these fictitious stories quite so seriously, I do not appreciate hypocrisy. Val complained about one aspect of Star Wars as it is today. You tell him he's a bad fan by way of complaining about another aspect of Star Wars as it is today.

    Like I said before, either take your own advice or start trying to find ways to enjoy those aspects you do not currently enjoy.
     
  20. Wedge 88

    Wedge 88 Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 16, 1999
    Yeah, thats about right.
     
  21. virtue1st

    virtue1st Jedi Youngling star 1

    Registered:
    Oct 13, 1998
    Bravo, bongles. Excellent post, and I agree with you 99.99%

    It's all about the fun.
     
  22. Wedge 88

    Wedge 88 Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 16, 1999
    And fun isn't just what you perceive it to be. People can have fun doing stuff you hate.
     
  23. Moridin

    Moridin RPG Author star 3 VIP

    Registered:
    Apr 13, 1999
    Yeah. Uhm. Interesting note on the whole continuity thing.

    I'm in pretty close contact with the guys at WotC. I contacted one of them, JD Wiker (aka JeDi Wiker) regarding this issue. Here's the deal on the Infinities logo on issue #4: The only article in the magazine that is considered Infinities is the "Starhoppers..." article. The rest is considered Official continuity material. The reason the Infinities logo was on the cover was because the Starhoppers were on the cover. From now on, the Infinities logo will appear only on the individual article that is apocryphal, not the whole magazine. So, there you have it. SW Gamer #4 is part of official continuity except the Starhoppers article, which, of course, originated with the already-apocryphal Marvel series.

    Regarding issue six, it is not a Star Wars Tales themed issue from what I have heard. Rather, it is a Tales of the Jedi themed issue. I may be mistaken, but my sources (who are reliable) indicate we'll be seeing TotJ stuff in the next issue.
     
  24. Wedge 88

    Wedge 88 Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 16, 1999
    Cool. Thanks!
     
  25. Valiento

    Valiento Jedi Knight star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 19, 2000
    "I'm in pretty close contact with the guys at WotC. I contacted one of them, JD Wiker (aka JeDi Wiker) regarding this issue. Here's the deal on the Infinities logo on issue #4: The only article in the magazine that is considered Infinities is the "Starhoppers..." article. The rest is considered Official continuity material. The reason the Infinities logo was on the cover was because the Starhoppers were on the cover. From now on, the Infinities logo will appear only on the individual article that is apocryphal, not the whole magazine. So, there you have it. SW Gamer #4 is part of official continuity except the Starhoppers article, which, of course, originated with the already-apocryphal Marvel series. "

    Umm, you got be kidding, you have to be completly wrong for one fact in issue 3, ben harper had this whole big letter, on how marvel is official, and always been official, just some people working in marvel and del rey chose to ignore it. Now they would bring it back. They said only a few issues of marvel are obviously non-continuity, they completly conflict with EU. aduba as far as I know doesn't.

    Secondly the Author of the article, pablo hidalgo of the aduba article visited the forums, and talked about it briefly a few weeks before it was released, and said he meant it to be an incontinuity article. He was most proud of the article. when approached by the fact of the ifinnities logo on the cover only referred to the already infinities "tales" Lurdo comics. He said as far as he knewn he was acknowledged they put in a letter explain that fact in the issue, which of course never happened.

    Honestly your anti-marvel bigotry, shouldn't apply since of what ben harper, and pablo hidalgo has said already about marvel, and that article in particuler. especially what you said would make lurdo's comic part of continuity, and well, that would be pretty hard to fit in, especially since it's the only thing inside the issue to have an infinities logo on it, besides the front of the cover.

    So here's hoping a apology letter in tales 6 comes out and fixes this whole mess. Believe me pablo will probably be upset if they disrepect the article he put all that work into, by saying it's non-continuity.

    "Regarding issue six, it is not a Star Wars Tales themed issue from what I have heard. Rather, it is a Tales of the Jedi themed issue. I may be mistaken, but my sources (who are reliable) indicate we'll be seeing TotJ stuff in the next issue."

    Let's hope your right on this one. but the back of the book really does point to "star wars Tales" Technically Tales of the Jedi, should be completly spelled out to avoid confusion. Unless WOTC/DH, plans on just putting all DH tales products under one heading, and make it all infinities, Perish the thought. So honestly I don't trust your sources exactly. Just have to wait and see.
     
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