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Lit The Essential Atlas and Galactic Cartography: Official Discussion

Discussion in 'Literature' started by CeiranHarmony, Oct 14, 2005.

  1. Mange

    Mange Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 11, 2003
    We can nitpick a bit more.;) I'm surprised that Coruscant's population hasn't grown until the PT-era and still have the same population density as Harrison, NJ (a suburb to Newark, NJ) even if only half the planet is populated.
     
  2. Rouge77

    Rouge77 Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    May 11, 2005
    Some PT estimates I have seen put it's population at only about 800 billion... It could well have fluctuated greatly during the intervening eras and if the Candorian plague reached Coruscant, it might have been really devastating when it comes to the death toll. I wonder whether PT Coruscant might have still been growing after a late New Sith Wars demographic low point?

    But, the planet is not run very efficiently in my opinion. Get rid of the slums, organize things well and the population should be able to grow beyond 1 trillion. Perhaps, at this technological and organizational limit, growth beyond 1 trillion just isn't possible?

    What I find, when faced with these numbers, hard to believe, are again the conquests of Coruscant. How could a planet with such a huge population and the vast planet-wide cityscape ever be truly conquered with the armies we have seen in EU? You would need several billions of soldiers at the minimum to control the planet in my own personal opinion and I doubt whether even that would be enough to control the lower levels...
     
  3. Tzizvvt78

    Tzizvvt78 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jun 12, 2009
    I think Saxton used some estimates for metropolitan center population densities in late 20th century Earth to come up with a population of several thousand trillion.

    Mean radius of Earth: 6,371 km
    Surface area: 510,064,472 km2
    90 % city: 459,058,025 km2
    Pop. density of downtown Perth (20,000) times 200 (due to kilometers of vertical housing): 1,836,232,099,200,000 (1836 trillions).

    Needless to say, whoever wrote and perpetuated the actual canonical number (or numbers) didn't even do a little bit of math. :p

    Using the newest, iirc, radius estimate for Coruscant and assuming it's got only 50% cityscape with people in a density of downtown Perth times 200 (1999-level, when Saxton did his calcs), I get 941,331,744,000,000 or above 941 trillion.

    According to canon lore, then, Coruscant does not have the population density that would cross kilometers vertically, as the buildings on Coruscant and the habitats in the underworld would attest to, is smaller than Earth and has even less surface area actually inhabited...
     
  4. Rogue_Follower

    Rogue_Follower Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 12, 2003
    Tina is weird. I'm not sure if it's intended to be Hoth or not, but it does have a wampa boss. And bipedal polar bear natives that C-3PO can talk to. And a whale that C-3PO can talk to. And a frozen Chewbacca that kisses you when you thaw him out. Make of that what you will.

    This is the same game that has [link=http://strategywiki.org/wiki/Star_Wars_%28Namco%29/Kessell]Kessel[/link] and [link=http://strategywiki.org/wiki/Star_Wars_%28Namco%29/Iscalon]Iskalon[/link] levels...
     
  5. Senator_Cilghal

    Senator_Cilghal Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 2003
    I don't think its Hoth...no clear indication of that. And many ice planets have wampas [Asuin, Rhen Var, Lokondo, Neshtab, Etorasp, Thaldo].

    BTW, since I don't speak Japanese, at first I didn't realize Lord [insert name here] Vader was telling you what animal he was going to turn into, until he said, "I am Wampa Vader!" So apparently the sasori is a scorpion-like Tatooine animal, the gaos a horned skeleton bird from Kessel, and the kurado a shark from Iskalon. Whether those are imaginary species names, or just Japanese words meaning "scorpion", "skeleton bird", and "shark", I can't say.

    Like Yoda Stories and Jedi Power Battles, obviously the game as a whole cannot be canonical, but elements from it can be

    I'm still hoping someone with access to the Lego script can reveal the two new planet names
     
  6. Rogue_Follower

    Rogue_Follower Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 12, 2003
    It's been a while since I did my own quick-and-dirty-and-not-knowing-any-Japanese-at-all translation of the game, but I think that's right. "Sasori" is Japanese for scorpion and "gaos" is a reference to [link=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gyaos]this[/link]. I'm not sure if I could ever find "kurado." At least, I couldn't find it again now.
     
  7. Senator_Cilghal

    Senator_Cilghal Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 2003
    haha, so we have a Gamera character cameo in SW;)

    regarding "Monbanda", who challenges Luke with "You shall not pass!" Gandalf style, I am curious if Monbanda is an individual name or species name...and is it just Japanese for polar bear! or another Gamera monster?

    The extensive oceans, with their sentient whales, seems another reason to regard Tina different from Hoth. Does Hoth even HAVE oceans? Plus, Tina would seem to have more easily detectable surface life and oceanic life than Hoth; Han's line in ESB makes little sense applied to Tina. Hoth's lifeforms seem to be largely subterranean, at least in part and in certain weather; the only liquid water bodies on Hoth I know of are underground (cf. in Super ESB); plus wampas and tauntauns are cave-dwellers, the dragon-slug lives underground, etc. i don't recall Tina having any subterranean environments in the game
     
  8. Rogue_Follower

    Rogue_Follower Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 12, 2003
    Hoth has surface oceans in Super ESB, or at least large water bodies of some kind---you fight the (gigantic) probe droid in one. I've always just assumed that was an equatorial region.
     
  9. Senator_Cilghal

    Senator_Cilghal Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 2003
    i recall the giant probot; forgot he was over water...I had overlooked that, thanks for pointing it out.

    still, the sentient polar bears and sentient whales seem unlikely residents of Hoth, which barely has room for those little pig people; it is hard to imagine Han and Ozzel both overlooking THREE resident sentient species
     
  10. Senator_Cilghal

    Senator_Cilghal Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 2003
    just when I thought this episode of CW was continuity-clean, I caught the wording of the intro ala the episode guide...
    Aleen is called a Mid Rim planet, whereas previous sources placed it in Inner Rim


    sigh...Rodia all over again
     
  11. jasonfry

    jasonfry VIP star 4 VIP

    Registered:
    Nov 11, 2003
    Yeah, discussed that one with LFL a while back. Old Aleen = Aleen Minor. We'll add to next appendix update.
     
  12. Sock2008

    Sock2008 Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 15, 2008
    Nice to know. Can we get the same with Mon Cal of two suns and Dac of one sun? *Pleads desperately* ;)
     
  13. eddie1969

    eddie1969 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 3, 2005
    I am surprised to hear that there will be a next appendix update. Is this still going to happen over at the new sw.com?
     
  14. CeiranHarmony

    CeiranHarmony Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    May 10, 2004

    yub there. Atlas never ceased to exist in its expanded form there after the new "worse" sitedesign went online.
     
  15. Senator_Cilghal

    Senator_Cilghal Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 2003
    so the Mid rim Planet I assume =Aleena homeworld, Inner Rim's Aleen Minor =Aleena colony?

    although I assume the sagcatcher and scatalpen are from the Mid Rim planet now, since IIRC Aleena EVOLVED to escape those predators

    I'm now picturing the Inner Rim world as a colony wealthy Aleena went to to escape their nightmarish backwater of a homeworld, with its bloodthirsty Wonderland residents, earthquakes, inexplicable reptilian Greek goddesses, etc.
     
  16. Tzizvvt78

    Tzizvvt78 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jun 12, 2009
    I assume every physical characteristics previously attributed Aleen would remain in the new canon, apart from the galactic coordinates.
     
  17. Senator_Cilghal

    Senator_Cilghal Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 2003
    right...but my point is all the established stuff should be for Aleen in Mid Rim, not Aleen Minor, since the species's evolution must have taken place on original homeworld.

    speaking of Aleena evolution, ever notice the variety of Aleena body types mentioned in NEG Characters? And how that is reflected NOWHERE else? [although at least other sources do show some variety of color] No other sources shows nor mentions tailed or long-necked Aleena variants for example.
     
  18. Tzizvvt78

    Tzizvvt78 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jun 12, 2009
    Right, which is what I said. :p
    Sorry if it wasn't clear which planet I was referring to.

    Never heard about this before. I wonder, didn't we see a couple of different CG models this episode? Not as extreme as that, but they were trying...
     
  19. TalonCard

    TalonCard •Author: Slave Pits of Lorrd •TFN EU Staff star 5 VIP

    Registered:
    Jan 31, 2001
    I was amused to note that a chart of the Moddell Sector made the Ewok Line presentation in How I Met Your Mother today:

    http://www.cbs.com/shows/how_i_met_your_mother/video/2150684675/how-i-met-your-mother-the-ewok-line-presentation

    Anyone interested in verifying the rest of Barney's Ewok facts? IIRC, he claimed that Endor was the "second moon" of Endor, but I'm pretty sure that's not right...

    EDIT: Okay, so some of this stuff is clearly made-up. (And some of it needs to be canonized: "Machook builds first Ewok village", "Kintaka Brothers invent flight at Kittiwok, North Karolina".) But some of it is legit. I think this is the first time Caedus has made network TV...

    TC
     
  20. Senator_Cilghal

    Senator_Cilghal Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 2003
    apparently, NOBODY has heard it before;) but go check the Podracer Pilot entry, and there it is; both Wookieepedia and Cuswe have overlooked it, and the WOTC Aleena stats don't reflect it, nor does the accompanying blurb mention it

    PS I found something Atlas is missing: http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Abek%27s_Station

    Should be in Tharin Sector (Periphery)
     
  21. Havac

    Havac Former Moderator star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 29, 2005
    [image=http://www.comboutique.com/shop/products/inprint_small/USR54420/20100728154410_legendary_barney.jpg]
     
  22. jasonfry

    jasonfry VIP star 4 VIP

    Registered:
    Nov 11, 2003
    Howdy folks. If any of you are going to New York Comic-Con, I'll be signing books at the DK booth from 1 to 2 on Sunday, and then on the Del Rey panel at 245p that same day. If you're around, come say hi!
     
  23. SheaHublin

    SheaHublin Jedi Master star 2

    Registered:
    Feb 15, 2008
    I was recently looking at the entry for MSE-6 "mouse droids" on pg 86 of the old Imperial Sourcebook, and it mentions that they were promoted with a "400-sector promotional support campaign". That just made me wonder, have at least that many Sectors been established by the Sector maps that have gone up so far?
     
  24. AdmiralNick22

    AdmiralNick22 Fleet Admiral of Literature star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    May 28, 2003
    Well, the Outer Rim and Mid Rim sectors are already done, but I am pretty sure the hard part starts now. ;)

    By the time Jason gets to the Colonie and Core Worlds, sectors get so small that he will probably go crazy. :p

    --Adm. Nick
     
  25. jasonfry

    jasonfry VIP star 4 VIP

    Registered:
    Nov 11, 2003
    Bah. The Inner Rim will kill me before then.

    A while ago I plotted out sector numbers for the regions, aiming for 1,024 + X amount for Imperial expansion, changes, etc. The numbers start getting intimidating, in raw size and in terms of how little has been established, in the Inner Rim.

    OTOH, I already did about 1/3 of the Expansion Region for a WARFARE map. So that region will probably get done before I go insane and can do no more.