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The Force Awakens Discussion -There Be Spoilers Here

Discussion in 'Fan Fiction and Writing Resource' started by mavjade , Dec 15, 2015.

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  1. JadeLotus

    JadeLotus Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 27, 2005
    The hyperspace travel times were pretty plot-dependent in the OT and ST

    I'm a person who doesn't bother about the science, so I don't really care about the logistics of the assault on Starkiller Base. I do think there was a lack of downtime, though - a longer scene between Han, Rey and Finn in the Falcon about Luke's disappearance would have gone a long way. The entire Rathtars sequence, along with the space pirates straight out of Farscape was a waste of time, for me.
     
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  2. Briannakin

    Briannakin Grand Moff Darth Fanfic & Costuming/Props Manager star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Feb 25, 2010
    TELL THAT TO KANJIKLUB!

    I kid, because I actually agree. That whole bit was fun, plus we got a great line, but I would have much rather that time allocated elsewhere, like keeping in the Leia scene that basically explained what was going on with the New Republic.
     
  3. JadeLotus

    JadeLotus Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 27, 2005
    That line is the scenes only redeeming factor.

    Yeah, the Kor Sella scene would have been better to keep.
     
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  4. Chyntuck

    Chyntuck Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 11, 2014
    Actually, I thought that the scene with the pirates served a purpose from a narrative perspective -- it was a good way to show that, despite having been a hero of the Rebellion etc etc Han's life took a wrong turn and he's back to square one, dealing with characters who are just as likely to shoot him as to pay him for his work. The rathtar chase on the other hand was really about putting monsters on the screen and nothing more. Okay, it was an opportunity to show that Rey is resourceful and that she's grown very attached to Finn already, but there were subtler ways of doing that.

    In general though my main issue with TFA (and I'm a huge fan of the film, so it's not a big issue, but still...) is the storytelling itself. One aspect of that is JJA's nasty habit of taking narrative shortcuts and explaining them later in interviews (e.g. giving a hint that Artoo was beginning to reboot after BB-8 first talks to him wasn't something that could be skipped, and JJA skipped it). The other is that TFA really sacrificed background in favour of keeping a fast pace throughout. There really was an attempt to fit it in the any-adventure-film mold that is prevalent these days and that doesn't feel starwarsy at all. Even *gasp* the PT didn't do that (and now that I said it, I'm going to run away and hide [face_worried])
     
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  5. Gamiel

    Gamiel Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    You make it sound like PT was bad Chyntuck
     
  6. Chyntuck

    Chyntuck Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 11, 2014
    Oh, I like the PT very much! Some visuals are amazing (like the opening shot of ROTS), the world-building is great, we got some fantastic new characters (Qui-Gon, Dooku, etc) and most importantly we got Ian McDiarmid playing Palpatine ^:)^ However IMO the PT films suffer from much weaker storytelling than the OT -- although in fairness, the OT's plot is pretty straightforward, so its writers had a much easier task. But if you want to build a truly compelling story that is based on a combination of predestination, romance and intrigue, you need better writing and storytelling than what LucasFilm gave us there. The PT story arc is great in that it gives a whole new meaning to the OT, but I find that the storytelling in each segment of the trilogy taken separately is not very good.
     
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  7. JadeLotus

    JadeLotus Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 27, 2005

    True - I did find it amusing to see that Han was still a terrible smuggler (I kid!). Although to be honest I think the Han/Leia separation was a cheap narrative trick to amp up the drama and revert the characters to their OT development so they would be easier to write. It would have been interesting to see Han out there smuggling trying to raise funds for the Resistance or something.
     
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  8. Jedi_Lover

    Jedi_Lover Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 1, 2004
    That would have been a great idea. Much better than having Han and Leia estranged or whatever was going on between the two.
     
  9. Briannakin

    Briannakin Grand Moff Darth Fanfic & Costuming/Props Manager star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Feb 25, 2010
    I think, from a film maker's prospective, the whole rathar/pirates scene stayed while important storyline elements got cut (IE Leia's opening scene or Poe's escape from Jakku), is probably because (a) it was going to be hard to edit out and (b) it really showed JJ was trying to make this Han's last hurrah. I'm not saying it's a good excuse for some weak editing choices, but they probably went "well, we have Carrie and Mark to do scenes explaining anything we need in VIII, but this is our last movie with Harrison, so we really want this to be Han Solo's final film done right."


    I might be alone in this opinion, but I didn't mind Han's reversion back to his smuggling days. One of the things that REALLY bugged me about the EU was the fact that, even after Jacen freaking fell to the dark side, killing his aunt and torturing his cousin (oh, this is sounding possibly familiar...), Han and Leia were still all happy and chummy. TFA showed how Ben's fall (and his fall might prove to be more recent than many of us assume, going off some hints big-wigs have dropped) affected his parents. Han was old and grumpy so went back to a reckless life. However, in the end, all his OT development came out in the fact that he was willing to go to Starkiller base, even though he knew he wasn't coming back.
     
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  10. Jedi_Lover

    Jedi_Lover Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 1, 2004
    I didn't like seeing Han and Leia apart, but that did happen in the EU when Chewie died. Of course, I was opposed to that idea back then. After all that Han and Leia went through I didn't think Han would cut out on her like that. Or if he did I would hope he would communicated with her more often.
     
  11. Ewok Poet

    Ewok Poet Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 31, 2014
    Bad relationships are more common that good relationships. I think this is more realistic.

    Also, I love the PT.
     
  12. Briannakin

    Briannakin Grand Moff Darth Fanfic & Costuming/Props Manager star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Feb 25, 2010
    To, me, Han being a bit cold after Chewie died made sense (blaming Anakin on the other hand, is another story).

    Perhaps I am putting my own 'real world' experiences on this (and you can tell me this is escape fiction and you don't want real-life anywhere near Star Wars and I will totally agree with you). But my parents loved each other, but their marriage didn't work out because of many external issues. My dad always wanted to make sure my mother was happy with her new relationships and my mother cried when my father died. And, with the entirety of the EU wiped out and just going off the knowledge that Ben Solo did some pretty bad shavit, that sort of dynamic works for the Han and Leia of the movies. I liked it. It showed that neither Han nor Leia were ever really "a SW version of a white picket fence couple" and it showed that love is more than sharing your life with someone. In the end, Han was still willing to fight for Leia's cause. He didn't have to go back to set those charges, but he did, even if it meant his death.


    EDIT: I'm currently doing a rewatch of the PT for a fic. I love 78% of the PT :p
     
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  13. Ewok Poet

    Ewok Poet Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 31, 2014
    That is what I liked too, even though I enjoy alternate universes where they remain together (coughleiamoodycough), provided that there are not as many challenges as there were in the Legends universe.

    My mom was the outspoken snarky little woman (and she still is), my dad was a vagabond bohemian type who was slightly prone to too much flirting and swindling. They did remain together until his passing in 2010; but she's kind of...permanently damaged and often a complete monster, unaware of her own behaviour, because of this. I just don't understand the idea of those lalalalailoveyou type of things. There are always obstacles, no matter what.
     
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  14. Briannakin

    Briannakin Grand Moff Darth Fanfic & Costuming/Props Manager star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Feb 25, 2010
    I totally agree that in alternate universes and for legends, it can make sense that Han and Leia to remain together, and I'm happy that they did in Legends (it got damn dark, but there was - more often than not - that relationship between Han and Leia, even if it didn't totally make sense at times). In TFA, Leia says "I should have never have sent [Ben] away. That is when I lost him, that is when I lost you both." Implying that things might have been okay between Han and Leia up until Ben's turn. Plus, we have 30 years between Han and Leia that we really don't know what happened.

    I'm probably one of the few people that will say I am glad my parents' marriage ended. They tried, but they knew it wasn't going to work (kinda like Leia and Han, she worries and stresses out way too much and he just had this calm faith that everything would work), and were happier apart.
     
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  15. brodiew

    brodiew Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 11, 2005
    I wasn't sure where to post this, so feel freeze to chastise me if I'm wrong.

    I thought there used to be a discussion thread related to the Jedi Way. Does this thread still exist? I looked back a few pages with no success.
     
  16. Chyntuck

    Chyntuck Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 11, 2014
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  17. Jedi_Lover

    Jedi_Lover Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 1, 2004
    I don't know if somebody already posted this or not. I thought it was funny.

     
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  18. Lady_Misty

    Lady_Misty Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 21, 2007
    So I've been thinking. You all know how they've said Episode VIII will be different from the other movies and it finally hit me thinking about the recently posted video on both the Official Site and YouTube and what they said at the end.

    What if instead of doing something crazy like time travel (Rey is Shmi) or Rey is Anakin sent to finish what they started at Endor or something equally crazy what if Episode VIII is starting right where Episode VII left off?


    Sent from my iPadd from another galaxy using Tapatalk
     
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  19. Dantana Skywalker

    Dantana Skywalker Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Apr 7, 2002
    It is. They already stated that.
     
  20. Gamiel

    Gamiel Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2012
    Have this been posted? From http://www.comicbookresources.com/article/exclusive-marvel-publish-star-wars-force-awakens-comic-adaptation

     
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  21. Lady_Misty

    Lady_Misty Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 21, 2007

    I know; my point was before they said that lots of people were speculating how Episode VIII was going to be different than the other films. I was also trying to be funny.
     
  22. Dantana Skywalker

    Dantana Skywalker Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Apr 7, 2002
    Oh. Sorry. I've had a headache for six weeks, my comprehension is a little impaired sometimes.
     
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  23. Sith-I-5

    Sith-I-5 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 14, 2002
    So we may find out in the first few minutes, if Rey and Luke are related.

    One downside though, if VIII starts where TFA ends, I cannot see the freshly lightsabre-sliced Finn doing much in the film.
     
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  24. Briannakin

    Briannakin Grand Moff Darth Fanfic & Costuming/Props Manager star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Feb 25, 2010
    If the official filming announcement (which isn't a spoiler, but you might not want to read past this so I am giving people a chance to stop reading)
    is anything to go by, yes, the movie seems like it will pick up directly from where TFA ended, which I am happy about (so we will probably get answers pretty quick), but, my money is on a training montage of Rey training with Luke and Kylo with Snoke, probably with flashbacks of at least Luke telling Rey what happened between ROTJ AND TFA , thenleading to some sort of time skip where Finn will be better
     
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  25. Sith-I-5

    Sith-I-5 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 14, 2002
    Or, if Rey continues to pull Jedi Master skills out of a hat that we don't even see her wearing, maybe she will be able to use Force Healing on the patient.
     
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