The Mandalorian The Mandalorian 2.06 - Chapter 14 - Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

Cheating death is also better when the cheat is plausible. It’s definitely plausible that Boba would survive. I think it makes sense. Perfect sense. That’s why I have and will never have a problem with Boba coming back. I have problems with other characters but not Boba

 

@DarthFixxxer

Right. And as I see it, fan “service” or fan love that naturally fits the story that’s being told without artificially shrinking the universe is simply good world-building.

Well, neither of those characters would have half the love they do among fans, you mean. Casual viewers who are loving this show would likely have fallen in love with Din and Grogu anyway if Din was a likeable masked Ubese and Grogu was a tiny little adorable Nautolan, if the quality of designs, story, visuals and character work were the same. That might have led to fewer immediate fangasms, but the broader audience would love it anyway. Because the beating heart of the show is the wolf and cub story. A hardened faceless warrior falling in love with this little baby and becoming a protective dad is just too wonderful a story to not love. That said, for us fans? All the “fan love” elevates the series to even greater heights. I’m with you there. But it’s not worth generalizing to the broader audience.

 

For me, this season feels like the winks and nods are everywhere. Almost feels like its 2 shows...one for the mainstream audience and one for the hardcore fans. Rather than easter eggs it seems like they are handling over the whole basket. For the most part, the fan service/love hasn't effected anything. Only one that comes to mind was Ahsoka asking where Thrawn is. That scene has WAY more gravitas if you know who he is but the way the scene was done with music, etc assumed everyone knows. He appeared on Rebels but I wouldn't necessarily consider that mainstream. Being on D+ helps some in that regard but there's always a limit to how deep casuals are willing to dig even if digging is a google search. Marvel movies are huge but comic sales are at their lowest in decades, so clearly casuals interest only goes so far.


Not sure how to multi quote...

DarthFixxer, people that think the anakin pod deal was needless are just mad other people like it? That's a ridiculous argument. Maybe, just maybe, some folks have differing opinions and aren't out to ruin your day. I found it needless in an episode that already had R5-D4, Cobb Vanth, Boba Fett's armor, a krayt dragon, tusken raiders riding in single file to hide their numbers, and a bad motivator reference.

 

So ''the Force'' is plausible for you?

 

I totally get that sometimes fan service can be overused but when used properly fannservice can be very effective. Overall I appreciate it as a fan. I found it annoying that there were way too many Womp Rat references in season one; One would’ve been sufficient. And yes, the Anakin pod thing I found a little much as well but overall, I am absolutely loving all the little hints winks and nods to everything in the universe. As an added thought, I think the fan service is just as fun for the folks making the show than it is for the viewers!

 

THANK YOU! I've enjoyed all the fan service/love they've done but it feels overdone at times to me. Its annoying but it's not the bane of my existence by a long shot lol.

 

I think if the fan service was being ‘overdone’ then it would be getting in the way of the actual story that’s being told.

but that’s not the case, what ever fan service people think is too much isn’t getting in the way of the story, casual fans are having no trouble following the story, from what I’ve seen, so clearly the fan service isn’t being overdone

 

Not sure if these have been answered previously, but there are two things that left me wondering about this episode:

- Why didn't Din pick up the jetpack again the moment the Stormtroopers began arriving? Wasn't is still leaning against a rock?

- Why would Boba risk first flying so close to those Dark Troopers and then travel all the way through the atmosphere before becoming aware of the Imperial Cruiser, when Din could see it show up on his scanner, inside his helmet, from ground level? I understand it's for dramatic effect for Boba to slowly realize the "Empire is back", but it those two instances made him come off as someone taking unnecessary risks or being oblivious. We've seen before that the Slave 1 has the capability to be undetectable on scopes (TESB), but it was brought daylight and someone might have seen him looking out a window.

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-All in all a truly memorable episode for the return of Temuera Morrison as Boba Fett. Loved those "Maori warrior facial expressions" Boba used when taking out enemies. That scene really sold how lethal Tusken Raider weaponry is in the right hands.
Outside of that I found the episode a bit too "video game enemy wave"-y, meaning they didn't use it's running time as effectively as they could have. Stormtroopers being mowed down like that without posing any threat is becoming less and less rewarding. I feel this trend really kicked off with The Force Unleashed and never really faded. Yes, Stormtroopers are good for comedic relief, if used to a certain point, but come on, let them get a shot in once in a while.

-The Empire blowing up the Razor Crest- now that's a demonstration of being a dangerous enemy.

-I liked the formation of the Jedi site. A nice balance between western and space-stonehenge.

-Those landing ships had an 80's DeLorean look to them.

-Modd Gideon is coming off more playful than the impression I got of him from Season 1, where he felt more no-nonsense. However, the "mustache twirling" playful sadist traits do fit in with Star Wars' source inspiration.

-Seeing the Dark Saber in live action is very rewarding. Such a cool design.

 

Agreed. The fan service thing should be a non-issue for casual fans. If they’re not picking up on the little nods and references it doesn’t matter in the slightest because outside knowledge of that stuff doesn’t affect this story. That’s the beauty of the Mandalorian!!

 

I would say yes and no, my wife and mom are casual fans.I would say if I wasn't around they might just watch it and enjoy the show for the baby and visuals. but since I'm there they ask who's this or who's that, this doesn't make sense to me and then I have to explain it to them. which is not a problem for me it's just an observation. I did ask would they ever go back and watch the animated shows my mom straight up said no, my wife said no but would watch one of those recap videos on YouTube and laughed.

I will also add the appearance of Ahsoka confused my mom the most because in her mind she thought all Jedi would dead besides Luke Skywalker at this time and then started questioning was there a time Jump in the show.

She was also confused by Boba Fett, didn't know who that was at the end of episode 1 of the season. So I explained it to her and she said didn't he die then and I was like yeah but they brought him back and she kind of huffed and goes does anybody ever really die in this franchise and I kind of smirked and said no not really.

 

but you don’t have to know who Ahsoka is to follow the story, The Mandalorian is searching for a Jedi to deliver Baby Yoda to, it’s a simple straightforward story, even if someone doesn’t know who Ashoka is they can still follow that.

and if someone thinks Luke is the only Jedi, well the show offers an answer to that as well, Ahsoka says there are few Jedi left, so there’s a few, not just Luke

 

Canon!

 

Not really if all you've ever seen was the original 3, and the sequel Trilogy. you would definitely have questions at first she thought this took place after the sequel trilogy because that was the last thing she saw in theaters. she didnt know the timeline bc Star Wars does like to jump around back and forth between about a hundred yrs of history constantly depending on what show or property you're watching. That doesn't mean she didn't enjoy the episode she just didn't get it completely which is understandable.

On the positive side though when Katie took her helmet off my mom got real excited and jumped out of her chair and said my God that's Starbuck because Battlestar Galactica is her favorite sci-fi franchise behind the original Star Trek 60s show. So I did explain to her who she was in the mando but even if I wasn't there She just assumed it was another Mandalorian out there in the galaxy and thought it was so cool that one of her favorite actors from another property was in the mandalorian.

So in general not just because of Ahsoka there's been a lot of explaining And re explaining timelines and certain things to her. she is 65 and is a very casual viewer but I'm sure there's more fans out there like her.

 

ok, well I can understand someone being confused about where the show fits in with the films, there’s a lot of star wars now

but that’s not an example of fan service making if difficult to follow the plot of the show, I’m talking about the story of just this show, not where it fits in with other Star Wars entries.

 

Honestly, I have no problem with the series having references to other aspects of Star Wars lore. In fact, just because a fan is "casual" doesn't mean he/she should expect to be spoon-fed. Its a Star Wars show in the end, if something intrigues a person, and that motivates her/him to actually deepen themselves in the lore and beginning to know more about Star Wars, then fantastic. In the end, there is nothing so magical about us becoming "hardcore fans" or whatever tag to be applied. We just loved the story so much, that we wanted to get more and more about it. Thats the way novels, comics, video games, articles and soundtracks came to exist.

That being said, if such obscure knowledge is enough to hide the plot and make it impossible to follow for the casual fan, its of course a problem. But that is not, in my eyes, what has happened in the Mandalorian up to this point.

 

But even the Thrawn reference simply tells casual audiences that there’s another layer of “bad guy” out there, in the form of this mysterious Grand Admiral Thrawn. It’s an intriguing mystery, and TV shows thrive on intrigue and mystery that gets peeled back slowly over multiple seasons. In that context, I’d argue that the Thrawn line from Ahsoka is more intriguing to casuals than fans. As we already know exactly who he is, and how he went missing. We fans obviously can’t wait to see him, to know what happened to him, and to see how his story plays out, but casuals are also very intrigued. “Who?” is not a bad question to precipitate in an audience. You want them asking questions. That’s how you keep a multi-season show going.

 

Anecdotally, I watch the show a second time around with family that have seen the newer movies once and the ones prior to the Disney purchase maybe three times at most - and don't exactly remember them very well. They have little problem following the show, and the only two things I've had to explain to them is when it takes place in relation to the movies and who that guy at the end of The Marshal is.

 

The fan service in this show objectively has zero impact on non-fans’ ability to follow the story. Zero. That’s not a matter of opinion. It is simply a fact that the show offers all the information viewers need to understand what’s happening. Ergo, fan service is not at all impacting the ability of non-fans to grasp (and enjoy) what’s going on. If you’re getting questions from non-fans, it’s either because a) they know you’re a geek and they know they can get some more detail out of you), and/ or b) they’re interested! Your presence in their life affects the experiment of non-fan reactions to the show. So you can’t use their questions as justification for arguing that non-fans are confused. They’re just asking fans to give them a jump on things before they play out later in the show.

Right! And not knowing that guy at the end of The Marshal has no impact on comprehension of the story. As he’s simply a mysterious dude who appears to be tracking Mando. And...Mando doesn’t know who the guy is either. And then the show pays that moment off by having Boba show up in the 6th episode, and is sensitive to casual fans by having Mando be in their shoes. Are you Jedi? Mando asks. Exactly what casual fans might think, as Grogu just reached out to the Jedi (presumably) and the guy looks all mystical in his robes. Then he asks if he’s a bounty hunter tracking the Child, which a non-fan might also suspect. Only later does he describe who he is to Mando and the audience. That’s a crystal clear example of a character fans know well being presented to audiences in a way that does not assume that casual audiences know. It’s a seamless and natural way to have the fan service serve the story being told, rather than overshadowing or undermining it.

 

Regarding the question of whether or not this show has too much fanservice for general audiences, I would say the proof of the pudding is in the eating. General audiences love this show and it seems like it's a hit with many people who aren't normally into Star Wars. Clearly it's doing something right.

 

I think that’s the one moment I would consider over the top fan service, it requires the audience to make a number of associations from other films. You have to remember they are on Tatooine, you have to remember that that’s the planet Boba Fett was eaten by the Saarlac in the OT, you have to remember that Temuera Morrison plays Jango Fett in the PT and therefore is what Boba Fett looks like without a helmet, you have to remember that Boba and Jango are clones, there’s a lot of associations there that are not explained in the show, so while it doesn’t really affect the main plot it, for the average viewer it’s probably difficult to understand

I mean, I still loved the scene. Morrison has really been excellent in the role, but still...

edit similarly, like @godisawesome just mentioned, I consider Mauls appearance in Solo in the same way.

 

I still say yes and no but that's just me. For instance so far at least in my family of non hardcore fans the names of characters have not stuck whatsoever. the mando is still called the mando nobody remembers his name is Din and even though they do keep trying to shove baby Yodas new name down our throats my family just keeps calling him baby Yoda lol. Also when they mentioned thrawn my mom thought it was Gideon and she was like oh the chicken man from Breaking Bad bc she didnt know his name in this show was gideon. So I had to go down that rabbit hole of thrawn.

But if I'm being completely honest I do wish Star Wars would handle time in general better. Not just for casual viewers but for the hardcore fans as well. For instance we have no idea how long the Mando has been out there with the baby. we have no idea how long it takes to go from place to place, it goes all the way back to how much training did Luke actually receive from Obi-Wan on the Millennium Falcon we really don't know. And I do think the creators should handle placement of different shows better for General audiences as far as time and place goes. I could easily see why my mom thought this took place after the sequel trilogy, it all kind of looks the same

So what I think I'm arguing more so is not about fanservice but how the fanservice is introduced. I think one of the problems at large with Jedi in general is that everything past the prequel trilogy has treated Jedi like mythical creatures. what I mean is characters across all different platforms, from TV shows, the books, video games, and the ST act like either they never even heard of a Jedi or like there's some kind of folklore creature like Santa Claus. that's a little unbelievable considering the Jedi Order was around less than 50 years ago, it's not like they've been gone for five hundred years. And I know the counter-argument to that is well it is a huge Galaxy... but it does become unbelievable and I think that would have helped ease the transition of bringing back other Jedi post OT, if you had a couple characters over the yrs be like yeah most of the Jedi are extinct but there are a couple left.

 

Thats obviously the way they favour it. to say the Jedi and to an extend the Mandalorians are rare. that makes it even more special when 1 does turn up.

 

I have written this before and I will write it again: Boba Fett more than looked cool but for some reason people that don’t like the character don’t appreciate the art of subtlety when it comes to Boba Fett. or maybe we’ve just lost that ability to appreciate subtlety. Anyway, here you go....

1. In the line up of bounty hunters it was only Boba Fett that Vader felt needed a tug on his leash by telling him “no disintegration.” Even Fett’s reply, “as you wish” can be interpreted as being bad ass. He is calm, cool, and collected—he isn’t worried that his best weapon has just been yanked from his list of options. So he tells Vader, sure, whatever dude, I’ll catch them whatever way you want in effect.
2. Fett is the only person to figure out what Solo is up to. None of the other bounty hunters do and neither does Darth Vader or any of the imperials. He then tracks the Falcon for a bit and then arrives BEFORE the Falcon after tipping off the Empire that Fett knows where the Falcon must be limping toward. If Fett is nothing special why is he the only person, among many, who manages this?
3. During the melee in the carbon freezing chamber Chewbacca makes quite a fuss. Fett raises his blaster to put the Wookiee down only for Vader to grab his blaster and shove it down. Fett immediately turns to Vader, clearly displeased. Most underlings would have gotten an butt whooping for this sort of attitude but it appears Fett isn’t much concerned with this potential threat from Vader.
4. When Fett is escorting Solo’s carbon frozen body and Luke pursues he holds Luke back. most importantly, he knows Luke is there from the start. As the scene begins you see Fett walk by, turn his head toward where Luke is a walk by. Luke follows and is quickly met with laser blasts from Boba Fett. Fett likely knows the plan however, so he engages him only enough to keep him away from Solo, but the pursuit continues until Luke ends up diverted to the carbon freezing chamber. Again, Fett has dealt with a major hero and a Jedi (albeit in training) with ease.

There is actually a bit more but I’ll leave it at that. If you compare what Fett accomplishes in his little screen time compared to, say, Luke, he compares quite well. The simple fact is that needing to see someone lay waste to dozens of human beings (or whatever alien is there) wasn’t always necessary to indicate that someone was dangerous or their reputation for being a badass was warranted. Nowadays we need to see a body count and have lost the ability to read subtlety on the screen, but no one doubted that Vader was insanely dangerous and it isn’t like he had a huge body count in the OT. As I type this I am pretty confident in saying that Vader killed fewer people in the OT than Fett did in the last episode of the Mandalorian. Does that mean we all thought Vader was only cool because of his suit? I’d argue that that was part of what made him special, but it was much more.

 

re: the above, I personally don’t particularly like Boba Fett as character. But I am huge fan of Temuera Morrison’s acting and portrayal of the character