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Books The Official Outbound Flight Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by dp4m , Jan 9, 2006.

  1. TheEmpireStrikes

    TheEmpireStrikes Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Jun 11, 2004
    I've always had the personal theory that it did happen, from a certain point of view. I think the Guardian vs Joruus fight was in fact a Joruus vs Joruuus fight as it were. One insane Dark Jedi clone pitted against another to find out which was the stronger.
     
  2. snelson

    snelson Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 21, 2005
    there's something i don't understand is why did thrawn call joruus master c'boath? when he knows he killed him.
     
  3. dp4m

    dp4m JCC Playoff Pick 'Em Winner, Also a Narc star 10 VIP - Game Winner

    Registered:
    Nov 8, 2001
    C'Baoth was the Guardian on Wayland. His killing someone else was his dementia over time.

    This is canonical as of The Heir to the Empire Soucebook.
     
  4. TheEmpireStrikes

    TheEmpireStrikes Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Jun 11, 2004
    Ah yes, but thats my point! It would be a fine little quirk if he WAS the Guardian because there was more than one Joruus.
     
  5. Thrawn McEwok

    Thrawn McEwok Co-Author: Essential Guide to Warfare star 6 VIP

    Registered:
    May 9, 2000
    HttESB is in-universe and unreliable... ;)

    Then again, we're assuming that the Empire put the C'baoth clone there...

    We're even assuming that the C'baoth clone is a clone of C'baoth...

    [face_whistling]

    - The Imperial Ewok
     
  6. Excellence

    Excellence Jedi Knight star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 28, 2002

    Wait a revan, I thought C'baoth's Guardian battle was later said to be conjured?

    And if so, why? Why ruin a chance to show a good fight? The same for the Superstar Intimidator. Why lose the chance to show it, by saying it was just wrecked?
     
  7. Pershing

    Pershing Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Sep 12, 2005
    If the clone of C'Baoth was the guardian all along, did he just order the construction of the crypt on Wayland in one of his more crazy moments?
     
  8. Rogue_Follower

    Rogue_Follower Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 12, 2003
    Palpatine ordered the creation of the crypts, and the rest of the mountain facility. C'Baoth had nothing to do with it.
     
  9. Josh-Halcyon

    Josh-Halcyon Jedi Youngling star 1

    Registered:
    Mar 16, 2005
    :eek: :eek: :eek:

    So I read it, and I was like "okaaaaaaaaaay......" I actually had to go back, re-read survivors quest, then re-read this.

    while i acknowledge the fact that EU writers have to stay within the canon, even after they've written outside it ;-) I must say that i was extremely disappointed with this Zahn work. now, before i get bashed as a Zahn hater, I will state for the record that I LOVED the Heir triology and the Hand duology. Both are classic Zahn.

    The major problems i had with this are as follows:

    1) Car'das???? HERE???? NOW???? If i do the math right from specter of the future, he should already be running his own criminal empire right after having visited Yoda for the life refresher. This totally flies in the face of his previous writings! I saw that first-off and was like "no.........." totally skewed for the rest of the book.

    2) C'Boath: could a jedi master ever seriously throw his weight around as much as he did in the book w/out being viewed more circumspectly by the council? if you watch the council during the entire prequel triology, they're pretty much wringing their hands at the situation in the senate and the galaxy in general. One would think it would behoove the council to keep a jedi master who was "proactive" close at hand.

    2a) (and where did palpy get his sample to clone him?? [Heir to the Empire])

    3) C'boath's apprentice..... :eek: so, she goes from being totally in the shadows of C'boath, unable to make a reasonable decision on her own, to suddenly taking charge when the chips are down, and nobly sacrificing herself at the end? puleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeze.............

    While i recognize all EU'ers need to hear more about Outbound Flight (myself included), I think it could've been done more........ cleanly than it was in the book.
     
  10. Knight_Wanderer

    Knight_Wanderer Jedi Master star 2

    Registered:
    Apr 12, 2004
    Josh-Halcyon:
    1) Car'das???? HERE???? NOW???? If i do the math right from specter of the future, he should already be running his own criminal empire right after having visited Yoda for the life refresher. This totally flies in the face of his previous writings! I saw that first-off and was like "no.........." totally skewed for the rest of the book.

    SOTF was written according to the original prequel/Clone Wars timeline Zahn used in HTTE3. After the prequel movies were released that timeline was nullified. Zahn now has to work with Lucas's timeline, hence the apparent problem.

    2) C'Boath: could a jedi master ever seriously throw his weight around as much as he did in the book w/out being viewed more circumspectly by the council? if you watch the council during the entire prequel triology, they're pretty much wringing their hands at the situation in the senate and the galaxy in general. One would think it would behoove the council to keep a jedi master who was "proactive" close at hand.

    Or would they be happy to get him as far away from the powderkeg as possible? Say, the Unknown Regions, maybe even another galaxy entirely?

    :D

    2a) (and where did palpy get his sample to clone him?? [Heir to the Empire])


    As per page 200 of OBF, all participants were required to give full tissue samples before going onboard, including the Jedi.

    3) C'boath's apprentice..... shock so, she goes from being totally in the shadows of C'boath, unable to make a reasonable decision on her own, to suddenly taking charge when the chips are down, and nobly sacrificing herself at the end? puleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeze.............

    Well, she no longer had the pressure of C'baoth's expectations and disappointment weighing her down. I rather enjoyed her character arc.

    KW
     
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  11. The_Seto

    The_Seto Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    May 31, 2005
    Outbound Flight has made me enjoy good old Thrawn's character that much more; Zahn really really nails it down that Thrawn is an incredible military genius. I mean, he was able to take down several Trade Federation donut ships and their fighter complements with a significantly smaller force. I know that this book is a prequel era book, but at times it felt like the lines between prequel EU and post-ROTJ EU has been blurred, with the inclusion of Thrawn and Car'das and all. Just makes the entire universe seem more cohesive you know? Most of the "faults" that others have mentioned don't really bother me that much, though there was one thing that stuck out like a sore thumb throughout the entire novel.

    The inclusion of Anakin and Obi-wan was pointless.
     
  12. Knight_Wanderer

    Knight_Wanderer Jedi Master star 2

    Registered:
    Apr 12, 2004
    That was my knee-jerk reaction to the idea before I'd read the book. However, having read it, I can see that it wasn't as bad as it could have been. Obi-Wan and Anakin, even if their presences were shoehorned in a bit, still served a purpose. Obi-Wan served as a measuring stick against C'baoth, a counterpoint, and Anakin's near hero-worship embodied the danger of a teacher like C'baoth.

    KW
     
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  13. Takianna

    Takianna Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Apr 22, 2005
    I really liked it. It was just nice to read a book that was written well and flowed nicely. I just appreciated it.
     
  14. Kudzu

    Kudzu Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Jun 18, 2005
    Loved the book. Thrawn was excellent and subtle, as usual. Car'das and his smuggler buddies were great. Doriana was decent - not my favorite book villain, by any means, and without the same antihero-to-root-for factor that Thrawn and Pellaeon had, but a far cry better than, say, Lomi Plo. I liked how the battle over Outbound Flight played out; Thrawn didn't ruthlessly decimate it because he wanted something to blow up, as had been assumed, but was trapped in a situation where the cleanest way out was to have it destroyed. He's not particularly sympathetic, which wouldn't suit him well, but nor is he all, "Weak, pathetic Jedi had it coming to them! Long live the Empire!"

    You can nearly trace Thrawn's fall to "the dark side" ala Anakin Skywalker...

    Also liked the "Far Outsiders" references. Cool stuff.

    Interesting that Thrawn's whereabouts during the Clone Wars are left open, and I'd love to see a short story dealing with him during the Clone Wars.
     
  15. Csillan_girl

    Csillan_girl Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    May 6, 2003
    Isn't he in exile during the Clone Wars? IIRC, he was found by Parck soon after the Clone wars ended and the Empire was born?
     
  16. JediLaw

    JediLaw Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Oct 30, 2001
    It's been so long since I read the orginal Thrawn Trilogy that I may re-read them after finishing Outbound Flight.

    Have any of actually read all the Zahn SW novels in sequence?

    Its hard to believe that I was a freshman in Highschool when Heir to the Empire was released.
     
  17. Takianna

    Takianna Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Apr 22, 2005
    JediLaw-
    I was thinking the same thing about the original Zahn books. My mom and I were talking about how long ago that was and how I would get one of those books and then spend the whole summer laying out in the sun reading them and getting a tan. That seems like such a long time ago.

    I plan on re-reading these books too. I just haven't read them in so long that some of the information escapes me.

    *I'm glad there are other old people here too!*
     
  18. Caius

    Caius Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Feb 5, 2006
    I read them in sequence. I still remeber the excitement when I saw 'Specter of the Past' in a bookstore. That felt like mana sent from heaven. I used to drive my Mom crazy with telling her how I could not wait for 'Vision of the Future' to be released.

    Naturally, I thoroughly enjoyed all three short-stories dealing with Thrawn. Mr. Zahn has created quite a SW-universe of its own. With all those different SW books out there it is nice to know at least one part of the saga works well together.

    I must admit, though, I felt rather sad when Outbound Flight came to an end because I was convinced it is the last Thrawn-story. But then again, I thought the same after the Hand of Thrawn books... So hopefully I am wrong again! ;)


    Speaking of which:

    If you could ask Tim Zahn to write another short-story dealing with Thrawn's past, what would it be about?

    Personally, I would be interested in his exile, meeting Palpatine or the first command as an Imperial officer.


    Caius
     
  19. Rouge77

    Rouge77 Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    May 11, 2005
    After reading OF I do think too that the Formbi we see in SQ is not the same as the one in OF, as has been claimed. He really had no good reason - if he hadn´t changed greatly during the decades - of acting as he does in SQ, if one forgets the Vagaari and the military part of the Chiss plan for once. Thrawn on the other hand, would have had a very personal reason to do so... Denning´s Formbi on the other hand in DN is hardly acting on the level that Thrawn would, I think. So Zahn is probably giving hints in his "Outbound duology" that never will be the official truth, but which could be true...
     
  20. thebadge

    thebadge Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 15, 2002
    A better read than I thought.
     
  21. quad_gun_jinn

    quad_gun_jinn Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 13, 2002
    Got it a couple of months earlier than when it was sposed to be out here. Finally. Gonna sit down to read it today. [face_dancing]
     
  22. EwokStromboli

    EwokStromboli Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Aug 4, 2004
    Checks the publication date . . . May 1, 1992. Nope, I was a sophomore.

    Darn, I thought I had discovered a Skywalker twin for a second. ;)
     
  23. EwokStromboli

    EwokStromboli Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Aug 4, 2004
    Speaking of high school, did anyone else pick up on a Gatsby-esque dynamic for a spell during the middle of the book?

    The easiest comps would be Cardas as Nick Carraway and Thrawn as Gatsby. Cardas is captivated by Thrawn but also thinks of him often in a disapproving manner. But he's also willing to assist Thrawn when it appears others won't. Maris (Ferasi) sort of reminded me of Daisy Buchanan for awhile, falling a bit for an idealized version of someone (actually, some people---the ones with whom she was educated) from the past. Quento was sort of the gruff and vaguely jealous Tom Buchanan.

    Doesn't fit perfectly, of course, but it popped in my head.
     
  24. killfire

    killfire Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 6, 2001
    So we beat on, boats against the current, borne back ceaselellly into the past.
     
  25. Merlyn_Gabriel

    Merlyn_Gabriel Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 28, 2005
    okay so I just finished this book.
    and it leaves me with a lot of questions.
    *sigh*