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Saga The Original Sequel Trilogy (original story ideas, treatments, interviews, concepts, etc. by Lucas)

Discussion in 'Star Wars Saga In-Depth' started by InterestingLurker, Dec 23, 2019.

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  1. InterestingLurker

    InterestingLurker Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Jun 15, 2011
    I'm creating this thread as a compilation for the ideas that could've been used in the original sequel trilogy before it was changed by Disney.

    Expect there to be more updates as I gather what I know and have saved to my computer.
     
  2. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 6

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    Jul 7, 2009
    Most of this information has been confirmed by people who had access to the treatments (Lucas, Hidalgo, Hamill, Arndt, concept artists) and to be pre-January 2013 art meeting, where Lucas approved at least two concept (the ancient Jedi Temple and Luke's appearance), after which Lucas ceased to be involved:

    - It was set 30 years after ROTJ.

    - Luke, Leia, Han and Chewie would appear.

    - Luke, being a Jedi, wouldn't be married or have an offspring.

    - It would focus on Anakin's grandchildren (plural).

    - Luke was secluded on an ancient Jedi Temple.

    - It would feature a female protagonist (Thea/Kira) and the son of Han and Leia (Sam/Skyler), both in their 20s.

    - Luke would start training Kira halfway through Episode VII.

    - Han would die in Episode VII.

    - Luke would die in Episode IX.

    - The son would have been seduced/corrupted by Talon (not necessarily Darth Talon as depicted in the EU, but someone with the same look).

    - There would have been pirates.

    - Talon would be under the influence of / or serving someone else (Uber).

    - It would feature the Whills and a 'microbiotic world'.

    - The planet Felucia would be featured.

    - There was no Imperial remnant/First Order.

    - There was no Knights of Ren.

    - There was no Anakin's lightsaber.

    This is from the top of my head. I probably missed some points but I'll post later whenever I've access to the material I saved.
     
  3. oierem

    oierem Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Mar 18, 2009
    Good topic! Just for clarification, though, I guess we are talking about the Sequel Trilogy planned by Lucas around 2011/2012, NOT about the ideas he had developed around 1980 for the ST (because I guess that would've been the Original Original Sequel Trilogy).
     
  4. King Maul

    King Maul Jedi Knight star 1

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    Mar 20, 2016
    Any ideas what this Uber villain was supposed to be?

    Given that the Whills would feature I wonder if this Uber was supposed to be a fallen Whill or something similar to Abeloth.
     
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  5. Deliveranze

    Deliveranze Force Ghost star 6

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    Nov 28, 2015
    Apparently the rival faction to the New Republic was called the Coalition.
     
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  6. DarthWolvo23

    DarthWolvo23 Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Jan 30, 2005
    Do we know what the origins of Kira would have been in this version?

    Was she also going to be a Skywalker or a random?
     
  7. King Maul

    King Maul Jedi Knight star 1

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    Mar 20, 2016
    Sounds like some breakway systems similar to the Confederacy.
     
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  8. Deliveranze

    Deliveranze Force Ghost star 6

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    Nov 28, 2015
    Im not sure if there were details, but maybe they were systems that just downright refused to join the New Republic after the Old Republic's transformation into an Empire.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2019
  9. King Maul

    King Maul Jedi Knight star 1

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    Mar 20, 2016
    Yeah something like that. Mandalorians would be a good candidate to someone refusing to join the Republic.
     
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  10. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 6

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    Jul 7, 2009
    No. Uber is probably just a temporary name too.

    You're referring to the mock up crawl? That's from the virtual sequels fan fiction.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2019
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  11. Eike Starseeker

    Eike Starseeker Jedi Knight star 1

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    Aug 1, 2019
    Maybe we get a comic with George Lucas vision of the sequels some day, like with his first ideas for Star Wars.
    I could imagine that he probably had used some stuff of the EU, like Young Jedi Knights etc, at least that it goes in this direction.
    Whatever he had in his mind, it would have been better than what we got.
     
  12. Deliveranze

    Deliveranze Force Ghost star 6

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    Nov 28, 2015
    Not sure. I remember it being discussed in the old Georges Sequel Trilogy thread. Do you have a link to these Virtual Sequels crawl?
     
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  13. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 6

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    Jul 7, 2009
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  14. Deliveranze

    Deliveranze Force Ghost star 6

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    Nov 28, 2015
    Wow. Had no idea about this! I dont think this was the source, but I remember it was discussed in the George Lucas Development of the ST around 2015 thread.
     
  15. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 6

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    Jul 7, 2009
    It was just text taken from that 'virtual sequel' for the artist to fill in the crawl for a storyboard sequence. And IIRC, it was done months after George left the project and his treatments were discarded.

    In any case, not part of the original treatments.
     
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  16. Rebel on Toprawa

    Rebel on Toprawa Jedi Youngling

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    Jan 29, 2020
    The original, dark story idea for Return of the Jedi was way better than what we ended up getting. No ewoks, no second Death Star, Han dying, Leia going back to what's left of her people and Luke walking off into the sunset at the end is just so much more interesting. The original story idea for episode VII with Luke searching for his long lost sister would've been infinitely better than what we ended up getting with that disaster as well.
     
  17. Darkslayer

    Darkslayer Chosen One star 7

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    Mar 26, 2013
    You sir, are a true hero. These details are the real Sequel Trilogy!
     
  18. Hernalt

    Hernalt Force Ghost star 4

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    Jun 29, 2000
    Could someone procure and vet the comments, from some video interview, where the ages of the Anakin grandchildren were 18 or 19?
     
  19. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost star 7

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    Nov 12, 2012
    I think a few I've seen that were in Lucas' original treatments was female protagonist, Jedi killer and Luke isolated somewhere. I think the term "Jedi killer" got tagged onto Kylo in the TFA novelization eventually. And there's also the statements Lucas made to James Cameron which weren't on the TV special but were published in a companion book (2nd column)

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2020
  20. cratylus

    cratylus Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 9, 2001
    I'd like to see that one day. But I differ about the ST from some people. I think it has more actual Lucas in it than many people realize. Much of what we got in the ST was built around important concepts that were kept going back to those treatments. Also it's public that Lucas was consulted for Rise of Skywalker. Nobody seems to know what he contributed or removed.

    The thing I like to point out is that Kira literally is Rey. I mean that Daisy Ridley was only told on set that they were changing her character's name to Rey. When she got the role it was still Kira. And of course her helmet says RAEH on it, so we are left to wonder if she has some other original given name. Probably not Kira now that Solo came out. But look at this. The main plot centers on Rey going to Luke at the Temple. Uber became Snoke. Skyler became Kylo. Sam became Finn. It's very changed, but there is a lot of Lucas left over.

    I do think that Lucas would have given characters better names and would have had the freedom or guts to make things happen differently and explore new aesthetics and planets and I really want to know about the Whills. What was he going to do with that?
     
  21. Valiowk

    Valiowk Chosen One star 6

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    Apr 23, 2000
    I agree that there is more Lucas in the ST than many people realise, but would argue that this is only in a superficial, not deep manner. Lucas imbued every scene in his films with meaning; if one lost a scene, one lost part of what he wanted to convey. As a thought experiment, imagine summarising the plot of any of the PT films. Any summary of the plot would necessarily omit some of the more specific details about the film. Now imagine attempting to create a film based only on the summary of the plot, without having watched the original film. I would argue that you would obtain a film that is missing a lot of the original.

    Consider the list of points quoted by Alexrd:
    Already, in these three points, there is so much to explore that the ST completely skipped over. Almost all Star Wars fans criticise the Jedi policy of forbidding marriage, but in the ST that Lucas envisioned, Luke continues this policy. This says so much about Lucas' view on attachments that surely it's worth exploring in detail? Why would Lucas' version of the ST focus on grandchildren in plural? Because Luke and Leia were separated at birth, and one became a Jedi while the other did not, and this is another detail worth exploring. Why was Luke secluded on an ancient Jedi Temple, instead of another place? Because he went there precisely because it was an ancient Jedi Temple, meaning that there was something to be learnt about ancient Jedi practices there. This is what I would have loved to have seen explored in the ST.
     
  22. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 6

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    Jul 7, 2009
    Lucas always made it clear that the Jedi rules make sense, they aren't arbitrary or meant to be changed. The Jedi embody selflessness and their ways serve that purpose. They let go of personal attachments and gratification and dedicate their lives to an higher cause. So they let go of everything and foment compassion. In order to be a Jedi, one must abide by their ways and those premises.

    Sadly, a lot of people think the Jedi are wrong and in need of reform (they even go as far as blaming them for everything wrong that happened in the movies) when that's the opposite of what Lucas was going for as made evident on many interviews and comments on the matter.

    As far as his ST, I would love to see how he would expand (or complete) the mythology of his universe, dealing with the Whills and all.
     
  23. Valiowk

    Valiowk Chosen One star 6

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    Apr 23, 2000
    It was personally easy for me to understand what Lucas intended and why the Jedi rules make sense, although that may be because I am Buddhist. I think a lot of people get stuck for example trying to understand why Jedi were forbidden to marry, when the prohibition isn't actually on marriage in itself, but on the attachment that usually comes with marriage. I would think that theoretically, if the love between two Jedi were so pure as to transcend attachment, that marriage could be allowed between them. But of course, by that time, they would have attained this higher state of mind that they would consider marriage between them to be unnecessary. That being the case, there would be no need to make exceptions for them, because once an exception is made, there's always the danger of a slippery slope where others challenge where the cutoff lies. The rules are really intended for those who haven't attained that state of mind yet, and they are meant to ease matters by pointing out a direction towards which to work.

    One of the decisions Lucas made in the Star Wars saga that I found most interesting was that he chose to include a prophecy that comes true, a Chosen One in a day and age when people like to believe in free will. This is probably related to what Lucas said in the statements that BigAl6ft6 posted above: 'To make you look and see that we aren't the boss.' Yet, if one thinks about all that Obi-Wan, Luke and Yoda went through in the OT, Anakin becomes, in comparison, merely someone who was in the right place at the right time to fulfil the prophecy, and the strength of the prophecy becomes almost worthless in comparison to the effort of people. And yet, at the same time, it is an enormous prophecy for the fate of the galaxy. It feels like a tilting doll toy where the ending state is determined by the laws of physics, but the process is determined by the person playing with it, which is analogous to what Lucas mentions about symbiotic relationships, an ecosystem and 'we [are] just cars, vehicles, for the Whills to travel around it.... We're vessels for them.' So I would also love to see how he would have interpreted the Whills.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2020
  24. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 6

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    Jul 7, 2009
    Yes, there's the issue of attachment, of being bound to someone, but there's also the issue of duty and commitment. Being a Jedi is its own commitment, a selfless commitment, and marriage is incompatible with that. You can't serve both what's required of a Jedi and marriage. It's the same basic concept of monasticism, where those that choose that path have to let go of the self (that means marriage, family, possessions and personal goals) and dedicate their lives to a certain spiritual way of life.

    Like Lucas once said to Rinzler, "Jedi don't marry, they take vows."

    Lucas once explained that we all have a destiny, but we also have free will. And that free will allows one to accept or refuse to discover, follow and fulfill that destiny. That one's existence has a purpose. Anakin simply had his destiny spelled out from the beginning through a prophecy. At least for those that believed he was the one being referred to.
     
  25. Valiowk

    Valiowk Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 23, 2000
    Ah, yes. I had only been thinking about the attachment, not the commitment aspect of marriage when I composed that reply.

    Thank you for this explanation! It answers a question that I had been thinking about for a long time. Might you know the source of Lucas' original words?
     
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