Eeermm....just to highlight the inconsistency and outright contradiction in your argument, I'll come back to this at the end of the post.... There could be, I suppose deities or a deity behind those perfectly explicable forces and events...but that kind of thinking is so divorced from the thinking we partake of in any other aspect of our lives that it is, frankly, a non-argument. Let me give you some examples; You're trying to cross a road but there is a lot of traffic. Now..it's possible that you are only imagining the traffic so...why not try? Or, alternatively, you are trying to cross the road but you see no traffic...however, it's possible that there is traffic that you can't see, so you might never cross the road. We base our decisions on the evidence that is available to us, not on some distant, obscure and ultimately meaningless notion of 'possibility'. So, given that we base our decisions on the evidence then..one is left with the question; if there are these deities why do they go to so much effort to give the impression that they don't exist....that things seem to be perfectly explicable without their intervention? Especially when we are, supposedly, to have faith in and praise them. This all seems very....counter-intuitive, don't you think? So.....when I was a kid I used to watch a TV programme called the Herb Garden. There was a lion on this programme called Parsley. He was a very friendly lion. Do you think that, based upon this story, it would be wise for me to approach a lion because it could be a very friendly lion? Or would my best approach, do you think, be to accept what I know about...let's call them 'real lions'....and avoid them? So...I see you've tried to sidestep the issue by pretending that it really is still about 'choices'....except, you started your post with this response "Right, but as Lucas also said, he couldn't beat Palpatine. He can only compete with him. Same with Yoda." ...back to "can't" again...No matter what they chose to do they can't beat Palpatine....so they are without choice. Why? Because, as you said "It was never their destiny to..." - so destiny is here absolutely juxtaposed against choice. Destiny is here in opposition to choice. They are opposite, conflicting, non-commutative concepts.