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Senate The Theist/Atheist Thunderdome™

Discussion in 'Community' started by harpua, Jan 29, 2014.

  1. Lordban

    Lordban Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 9, 2000
    It's a bit odd to bring this up in the wake of that last (two months old) post... :p

    Sometimes, as a person of faith, you're going to find yourself tested about something you've taken very hard despite it ultimately having little import. I never saw it coming, but these boards have taught me a valuable lesson about a Christian virtue: forgiveness.
     
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  2. Rylo Ken

    Rylo Ken Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 19, 2015
    Please forgive the intrusion, speaking of forgiveness: would like to point out that it is neither exclusively nor predominately a Christian virtue.
     
  3. Lordban

    Lordban Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 9, 2000
    Of course it isn't only a Christian virtue :p
     
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  4. Rylo Ken

    Rylo Ken Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 19, 2015
    No need to apologize. I’ve already forgiven you!
     
  5. Lordban

    Lordban Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 9, 2000
    Blblblbl :p

    (I don't have the virtue of maturity, sorry :p )
     
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  6. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett PT Interview Host star 10 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2014
    Forgiveness is the human thing to do. At its core most “Christian morals” are just regular morals that get slapped with Christian because someone wrote it into the Bible or what have you.
     
  7. 3sm1r

    3sm1r Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 27, 2017
    In the world I dream, there is no place for guilt or forgiveness.

    If I fail, once I realize it I do my best to avoid failing again and that's all is needed.

    I see guilt and forgiveness as a religious heritage we are too used to. We don't really need them.
     
  8. Rylo Ken

    Rylo Ken Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 19, 2015
    I have scored one of life's big wins: I've landed on a Christian right mailing list!

    Today, I received a fundraising letter from ALLIANCE DEFENDING FREEDOM tagline: For Faith. For Justice. The "Freedom Insider" newsletter.

    Partial table of contents:

    WILL YOU PRAY?
    - for people of faith and other Americans who are targeted by those pushing cancel culture ideology.

    I HAD PLANS FOR MY LIFE, GOD HAD OTHERS
    My friend and I had started a campus chapter of Students for Life at Fresno State University. But things weren't going well.

    ANGRY FAR LEFT MOB SHUTS DOWN CONSERVATIVE EVENT
    A story out of New York highlights how in peril free speech is on campus, and why your generous support is critical.

    and so on.
     
    harpua likes this.
  9. solojones

    solojones Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Sep 27, 2000
    No it isn't, but I would argue that the notion of forgiveness for anything without needing to do anything but ask for it is, at least among religions, pretty rare. And obviously it is a key virtue of Christianity regardless of where else it appears.
     
  10. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett PT Interview Host star 10 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2014
    The closest I got to this ever wasn’t religious, but it was some call for donating to a “police fundraiser” I just said no. I mean I don’t know why they called in our town as my town is pretty damn left.
     
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  11. Alpha-Red

    Alpha-Red Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 25, 2004
    I think, when it comes to matters of war, politics and conflict...forgiveness is something that we're probably not going to be able to live up to. If you forgive someone too soon, it just means you surrender and the unjust get away scot-free.

    Speaking of not being able to live up to Christian values, I read this article sometime ago that said the very concept of democracy is in a way un-Christian. The early Christians believed that earthly justice was impossible to attain and that we shouldn't try. America's founding fathers made a deliberate choice to move away from that in order to form a more fair and just society. I mean yes, humans are certainly flawed and we know that perfect justice will never be achieved...but would we really want to live in a world where we don't strive for justice?
     
  12. Ghost

    Ghost Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Oct 13, 2003
    While forgiveness obviously isn't exclusive to Christianity, I think the idea of forgiveness that Jesus spreads in the Gospels is still radical even to this day.

    Forgive everyone of everything, if you want any hope of being forgiven by God of everything.
    Turn the other cheek and make it easier for someone to hit you again, instead of fighting back.
    Love your enemies.
    Hate no one.

    Everyone truly means everyone. Literally everyone.

    That no one deserves forgiveness, but everyone should still forgive everyone of everything.
    That no redemption is ever justified, but still everyone should be redeemed.

    It's still quite radical.



    edit:
    @Alpha-Red I'd disagree, and say Jesus tells us to always strive to be better, even while acknowledging we are flawed and imperfect. The true early church was pretty much a commune.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
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  13. solojones

    solojones Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Sep 27, 2000
    Yeah Ghost you put it better than I did. It's the radical level of forgiveness Christ demanded and exhibited that is unique.
     
  14. a star war

    a star war Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 4, 2016
    Well it's too bad no one has ever acquiesced to his demands.
     
  15. Lordban

    Lordban Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 9, 2000
    A lot of people did and still do acquiesce to his demands. Putting that into practice is, however, a lot harder than it looks. Give it a try for a week, you'll see how tall the mountain is.
     
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  16. a star war

    a star war Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 4, 2016
    lol ok sure they do

    Buddy I tried it for 20 years
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
  17. I Are The Internets

    I Are The Internets Shelf of Shame Host - Hangman Winner star 9 VIP - Game Winner VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Forgiveness is pretty hard in all seriousness. It's so easy to be angry and resentful towards someone or something. I'm not a very forgiving person, and that's something I clearly need to work on. We live in a pretty cynical and borderline nihilistic age.
     
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  18. Lordban

    Lordban Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 9, 2000
    Former monastic engagement?

    (Yes, it's a serious question).
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
  19. solojones

    solojones Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Sep 27, 2000
    Ever? I am not sure what you mean. Plenty of people have exhibited radical forgiveness.
     
  20. Ghost

    Ghost Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Oct 13, 2003
    Some off the top of my mind...
    * Pope JP2 forgives man who shot him, and visits and comforts him and prison, and the would-be assassin eventually lays roses on his tomb when the Pope passes away of natural causes decades later
    * Charleston church and relatives forgiving shooter

    Though it's very hard for anyone to do it 100% of the time for the rest of their lives. Which is why they also have sins to be forgiven. Not that they deserve it, but because no one deserves it and forgiveness should be a gift of grace and mercy.
     
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