Senate The US Politics 2.0 Discussion Thread

Of the doctor? I’m so confused.

 

I see a danger lurking in the suicide data, that it could be used to downplay the mental health impacts of the pandemic.

 

No, some people won’t take it. But if you and your loved ones do take it then what’s the problem? I know it’s not as deadly but it’s the same thing with flu shots. Some people don’t take them and get angry when people pass on it. Same thing. You worry about you. If you are vaccinated and stay away from places, etc then there’s a very, very slim chance you’ll catch anything from those that didn’t vaccinate. Being a doctor, I’d expect that you’d understand people rightfully being a little nervous about a rather unknown vaccine that was rushed out. It’s not like "wonder drugs" released before suddenly caused major issues years later. And now they’re talking booster shots needed? The JJ vaccine was pulled. Geesh.

Being tired of covid isn’t exclusive to me. Cmon. This has been quite the twelve months. This isn’t the pandemic thread so maybe we shouldn’t be doing this here. The point is that people have made a lot of sacrifices and most of us have played by the rules and guidelines set forth. Yes, some didn’t. That’s how it works. When is this over? Seems like never since even with vaccines and the high risk being vaccinated the fear mongering is still ramped up. There will be ramifications resulting from the mitigation tactics down the road too. Health problems and who knows what else. But there won’t be any candlelight vigils for those people.

What do you want us to do? Lock back down? I’m asking seriously.

Yes. This happens a lot. The other favorite tactic is when you comment about something and it gets exploded into something hysterical or totally extreme. Like, mentioning that there are programs that truly hungry people can use to get food gets turned into "you hate poor people" garbage. Or, the ridiculous defense of armed robbers as being "just trying to feed their families". Yeah, sure thing.....

 

The best tactic of all is when they refute baseless positions drawn from bumper stickers with an informed counterpoint based upon peer reviewed research and evidence based conclusions.

 

You do realise that some people can’t get vaccinated and rely upon high vaccination rates to be protected...

 

I got my dad a Biden action figure for Christmas last year. He's a hardcore blue collar boomer democrat. And he was incredibly happy Biden won. I wanted to get him something to the effect of a bobble head, but a bobble head, to me, seemed tad too hokey. So I did a little poking around and found a company that makes specialty political official action figures. And my dad being a huge nerd, it was perfect. I got my sister RBG as well. And the pope for my mom. They're good quality action figures. Company is called FCTRY.

 

If they are for fun I can understand. But the idea of collecting action figures of real life political figures seems a bit... weird.

 

My family is super into politics, and we're all nerds. I wanted to get something fun like that but that would also be to their liking. I got them books about each person as well. It wasn't meant for anything serious nor as a way to collect anything like that.

 

Firstly. are you advocating that doctors shouldn't go to hospitals anymore, or do you not grasp your response to a doctor was to tell them they should all stay home?

Beyond that, and this has been repeatedly explained, not everyone can get the vaccine. You're a dime-store eugenicist with your repeated unwillingness to acknowledge that because it boils down to "those with health conditions should be killed off". That's the core message when you say that people who have medical complications do not matter to you by dismissing them repeatedly, even though it's been brought up repeatedly. You no longer have your massive ignorance as an excuse, it's been constantly discussed and so at this point it's willful dismissal of their lives.

They were *always* talking booster shots, your ignorance doesn't equate to a surprise. And the Johnson and Johnson vaccine was paused, and I'd think it's very likely, from the discussion they had Wednesday, that they will be resuming it by the end of the month.

You know where this *wasn't* quite the twelve months? Taiwan, Australia, New Zealand, and Vietnam all countries that managed so well they haven't been dealing with this hanging over them for 12 months. And the situation's also a lot better in places like South Korea and Japan that managed this better to keep things in check with much lower numbers.

And you made none of those sacrifices. That's the problem, many people have sacrificed a whole lot, while a bunch of people have made none and worked primarily to undermine the sacrifices made. You are one of those people, consistently.

When COVID is not spreading in the community (or, alternatively, when tracing is so effective that there isn't untraced community spread). The way that happens is with quick and decisive action. It's like there's a house on fire and you want to fight it with a single squirt gun and then complain that fighting the fire is taking so long. The countries that are basically 'over' when it comes to internal restrictions are the countries that acted decisively and didn't share your apathy for human life.

You're just making things up blindly here. You're unable to present any evidence that the mitigation tactics are going to be harmful, let alone more harmful than COVID is. And you're never going to present that evidence, because to do so would require a numerical comparison and you've long since demonstrated your innumeracy on any topic.

How about for a start close state borders to any travel by someone who isn't vaccinated, mandate vaccines for schools and any other large events, and allow businesses to require vaccinations if they so choose? Plus nationwide mask mandate for public areas that comes with something significant, like, say, $1000 on the spot fine. Serious measures so that we're making rapid progress, and so that when one area progresses enough it can't be simply undermined by a bunch of travel to and from a state that has either lost control or is intentionally run by morons.

 

He doesn't realize or care, he's already blaming people for not "staying away from places" to avoid those who haven't vaccinated. As if most people have the luxury of avoiding crowds, particularly those with jobs that require them to work with people. He'd probably blame them for not having better jobs at that point.

QGM probably drives straight through red lights- he's weary of traffic laws and other people will just get out of his way, so it works out great for him. Good thing he's not in charge of a war effort, he'd probably surrender to the enemy in a week after he got bored. Conservatives complain about people not pulling themselves up by the bootstraps but they're so lazy about actually solving problems (nothing you can do about mass shootings- and that is the official line of the Republican party).

Well, at least he certainly lives down to our expectations. @Vaderize03 , thank you for your work and for explaining, though it turns out as expected.

 

I understand prioritizing greater danger, but I think we can remain vigilant about COVID while addressing the mental health consequences of isolation. Plus, as you insinuated, suicide is not the only tracer of suicide. How has drug overdose rates changed?

 

To be honest, I was principally thinking of macho bastard politicians who would cite it as proof there's no mental health impact from Covid because suicides have reduced.

 

I completely agree, but I want to add that if/when vaccine mandates are put in place, I hope it's significantly easier to obtain one for anyone of any age.

 

Not like real numbers would matter to them or their base anyway, whatever those numbers are.

 

Fair point.

 

If it will stop further spread, then absolutely, yes.

If we had undergone a strict, 30-day nationwide lockdown at the outset, with a robust federal testing and contact-tracing program put immediately into place, then as Dr. Birx has stated, we would've likely only have lost arond 100-150,000. The previous administration laid the foundation for what we're dealing with now. Gutting the pandemic response office for no other reason than it was set up by Obama was nothing short of criminal.

But let's decide we're done with the virus because "it's been a rough 12 months". You don't have to tell me that, Mike. I've lived it. I've seen what this virus can do. I've watched people die from it. And if another lockdown will save lives, then I'm all for it.

 

Im sure some folks cant get vaccinated. Most probably can. Those that are high risk & cannot get vaccinated need to take extra precautions on top of the usual ones. The best policy for each family is to get vaccinated if/when you can. Then, mask up in public. Be cognizant of your surroundings. That seems to work.

Jesus wasnt affiliated with any political party, was he? Not sure why thats directed at me. Im a registered independent & not religious. But Ill take your word for it.

All right - how long for this lockdown would you like to see? What about the residual/collateral damage that lockdowns do? I get that being in your position makes it so your perspective will be different than others on this. I can respect that. But it appears that the "30-day nationwide lockdown at the outset" period has long passed. We cant go back. And these arbitrary shutdowns appear to possibly do more harm than good in some cases. Most wont go for it anyways. I agree that the orange-haired guy didnt do enough with this at the beginning. The entire Govt. has some blame here. If we had better systems in place to support people and businesses during lockdowns that would have helped to. But, we didnt.

So, the right choice, IMO is to stay as open as we can with the guidelines in place. Do what you can to protect you and your close people.

 

I understand that. And I understand why it keeps being said. But there are hundreds of human rights organizations, women’s rights organizations, and other groups across the country, who are literally and explicitly asking for NATO forces to stay until the Taliban negotiating position is weaker. I’m not really sure how else to get that across without annoyingly repeating it.

It’s nearly impossible to discuss US foreign policy without being met with strawman after strawman about imperialism. I would like the US out of Aghanistan and Iraq. But the former situation is very complicated, and hundreds of thousands of Afghan lives can be destroyed if the withdrawal follows the logic of US domestic political pressure rather than the requests of significant portions of the Afghan public. I say this from an Afghan humanitarian perspective, not a US perspective, nor a NATO perspective, and certainly not an imperialist one.

Bosnia might also have an issue with that statement. Or France.

 

You're just saying that because you're a medical professional that has dealt with the pandemic up close. It's just your 'perspective'. Why can't you understand the equally valid perspective of someone that doesn't like experts that tell him what he doesn't want to hear and can't stand the idea of being mildly inconvenienced just so some randos he doesn't know don't die or suffer lifelong complications from an illness?