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Senate The US Politics discussion

Discussion in 'Community' started by Ghost, Dec 6, 2012.

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  1. Yoda's_Roomate

    Yoda's_Roomate Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 8, 2000
  2. FatBurt

    FatBurt Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 21, 2003
    I saw this in the UK about 3 hrs ago and couldn't remember the name of the pillock who said it so I didn't post as I had no source.


    The WHO as far as I understand absolutely 100% rule out any idea on Herd immunity through natural measures because nothing like that exists and just leads to thousands dying.

    This policy is effectively the US government saying, screw the elderly, ill/infirm. If you get it tough, you're an acceptable casualty in accruing more dollars.


    You will be close to 400k death by year end by my reckoning. It's abhorrent and is totally avoidable with sensible measures.
    If memory serves, this bloke dismisses a mandatory mask program but then states that mask use will be helpful (or similar)

    I fear for you.
     
  3. Alpha-Red

    Alpha-Red Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 25, 2004
    I think I've heard of this guy like, once, when he appeared on Stephen Colbert's show. If this is the best we can do, we're screwed.
     
  4. Luke02

    Luke02 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 19, 2002
    They. Gave. Up.
     
  5. Runjedirun

    Runjedirun Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 3, 2012
    Exactly. How scary is the situation in this country today?

    Yet the election thread is an argument over if Biden leans left enough. Really? If you are focussed on anything but getting you and your loved ones through this pandemic, I don't get it.
     
  6. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett PT Interview Host/All-Around Good Guy star 10 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2014
    Biden will lead to less deaths. That’s pretty much what it comes down to
     
  7. Luke02

    Luke02 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 19, 2002
    That is one of the reasons why @Runjedirun I will never consider myself a "liberal" or "progressive" beyond the fact I tend to be more moderate on certain issues. I refuse to get into a debate of over who is most "progressive" as I find it utterly insane in any time because you do not get anything done that way but especially in a emergency like this. Biden is a classic liberal. That should be left enough for anyone especially given what the country is facing.

    And not only will @Jedi Knight Fett Biden lead to less deaths but he will also lead to the pandemic ending earlier aka the economy recovers faster. That is the argument the Trump administration is just getting wreck with. We are seeing in Asia that most of those countries are keeping their numbers low therefore their economies continue to recover. Trump at the 11th hour pushing "we cannot control it but it's okay" has to be one of the most insane things ever. I am not a big fan of Michael Moore but he makes a great point. Why Trump is willing to basically kill his own supporters during a campaign will be studied by historians for generations. The only thing I can come up with is:

    1. He knows they won't care as truly it's a cult.
    2. Trump businesses are bleeding money so badly that has no choice but pretend nothing is wrong in the hopes somehow that will turn around.
    3. He doesn't know what to do.

    It will be interesting to see what he does if he loses. I personally think he either try to pardon himself like Mueller's deputy says he will or just resign with about 72 hours to go and have Pence do it/handle all the inauguration stuff.
     
  8. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett PT Interview Host/All-Around Good Guy star 10 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2014
    Trump is a coward, but I think he would rather pardon himself than resign. He’s still screwed by multiple states wanting to charge him after he leaves. My bet is he flees the country.
     
    Juliet316 , Luke02 and Yoda's_Roomate like this.
  9. Yoda's_Roomate

    Yoda's_Roomate Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 8, 2000
    This morning tweet is especially stupid and somewhat confusing



    Is he saying that the media talking about COVID should be outlawed? Or is he saying the media actually has control of the virus and is spreading it to hurt him?

    Either way its just more nonsense from President Crybaby
     
  10. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett PT Interview Host/All-Around Good Guy star 10 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2014
    He’s just mad because the worst because she does with Covid the more people aren’t going to vote for him
     
  11. Vaderize03

    Vaderize03 Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 25, 1999
    I love this article and actually would like to make out with it (but not really).

    In all seriousness, I've been thinking this for awhile; namely, that the judiciary is too powerful and it's time for the elected branches to even it out. Whether by term limits or a broad redefinition of the jurisdictional rules in regards to federal statutes, something needs to change. Interestingly enough, legislation to limit the power of the judiciary probably has the odd distinction of being both the more effective and politically palatable solution (as opposed to packing the Court).

    Thoughts?
     
  12. Lord Vivec

    Lord Vivec Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Apr 17, 2006
    Marbury was the Supreme Court deciding that it gets to decide if laws are unconstitutional, and the rest of the country followed along with that retcon. That's never sat right with me.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2020
  13. blackmyron

    blackmyron Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Oct 29, 2005
    No, he's saying COVID should be outlawed.
    I expect anyone moment a tweet from him demanding that Billy Barr immediately charge and arrest "the Chinese virus" for sabotaging his ratings... I mean, his re-election.
     
  14. Rylo Ken

    Rylo Ken Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 19, 2015
    and that's the great thing about a strict constructionist/textualist/originalist approach; as a jurist you can ignore precedent whenever it doesn't "sit right" with you.
     
  15. Princess_Tina

    Princess_Tina Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    May 10, 2001
    We just better hope the GOP loses the Senate, it's been by far the main instrument for trying to keep Trump beyond the reach of justice.
     
  16. SateleNovelist11

    SateleNovelist11 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2015
    This enrages me.

     
  17. Vaderize03

    Vaderize03 Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 25, 1999
    Agreed.

    We've gotten very used to the idea that the Supreme Court serves as a "check" on the other two branches, while forgetting the opposite is also true. It's time for the legislature to reassert itself, IMHO. At the very least, doing so might help de-politicize the SCOTUS confirmation process.

    The Democrats would be far better served over the long-term by legislatively passing their priorities (such as protecting voting/reproductive/LGBTQ/workers' rights) rather than rely on the courts to do so. A conservative SCOTUS that strikes down longstanding Constitutional protects might provide the catalyst for just such a conversation and hopefully, action.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2020
  18. Yoda's_Roomate

    Yoda's_Roomate Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 8, 2000
    Its time to do something no one will ever agree to: its time to draft a new Constitution.

    There's nothing wrong with it. The problem is the American mindset: the document is so holy it cannot be touched, and this just comes from romanticizing it, not from a practical point of view. In that way its the same thing as what religious people do with the Bible: they refuse to see that it is outdated because life and our way of thinking has changed so much you need to move on to something new (doesnt mean you cant preserve some good ole fashioned principles).
     
  19. Emperor Ferus

    Emperor Ferus Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 29, 2016
    I used to feel about the Constitution how you describe, but I agree @Yoda's_Roomate

    As much as I hate to admit it, the current Constitution was founded on class elitism, imperialism and white supremacy.


    Unfortunately, I don't see that happening without violence and without people in favor of discarding it disagreeing severely on what should replace it. I am hopeful for a dialogue if we do have the opportunity to make the much needed changes to the structure of our government.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2020
  20. blackmyron

    blackmyron Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Oct 29, 2005
    Why a document that says "eh, slavery's all right, you just can't import more slaves. Eventually" is consider holy is beyond me.

    ... and before someone goes "...but.. but... amendments!", remember that Amy Barrett isn't sure that the amendment effectively ending slavery and is the foundation of civil rights laws is 'legal'.
     
  21. Emperor Ferus

    Emperor Ferus Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 29, 2016
    She doesn't seem to realize that in the most originalist sense of the Constitution, she had no vote.


    Not confirming Barrett was a lost cause from the beginning though. If the Republicans control the Senate, it is their prerogative to advance the conservative ideology's impact in government and policy. There was never a chance of McConnell and company playing fair.

    This kind of thing convinces me that the fundamental structure of our government needs to change. Not only that, but (and this is as close to endorsing communism as I will get) the left and the right should probably break up into separate countries Korea/Soviet Germany style. If the Koreas can coexist without a lot of violence for six decades, I say it's worth a shot. I have no doubt that most of the international community will favor the left-wing half. They can keep their constitution and we can make a new one with a government that from the beginning intended to serve all the people rather than favoring aristocratic interests.
    Either way, the amount of time that the left and the right in the United States can live together is finite.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2020
    blackmyron likes this.
  22. Luke02

    Luke02 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 19, 2002
    I definitely think @Jedi Knight Fett he will try to pardon himself but there is a lot of legal debate if well that will even work therefore I think in the end he won't risk it and resign with about 3-6 days before inauguration. That way Pence can give him a full pardon plus as you said the man is a coward therefore I fully expect him to not be in the WH by the time the Bidens pull up for inauguration. He will let Pence handle that.

    At this point he just does not know @blackmyron about COVID-19 though as one senator said, it honestly would been best had the Trump administration done nothing. Truly. Had Trump not done a thing and left the playbook left behind by GWB & Obama play out, we would be so much better off and so would he. People keep saying, "Trump might be winning if it weren't COVID'. Totally wrong. If it weren't for COVID-19, him and Biden would basically be a coin flip. But COVID-19 actually gave a golden opportunity as again the country almost always rallies behind the president in emergency

    And this will be awkward for FNC to explain especially with a week to go in the election :

     
  23. mnjedi

    mnjedi Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 4, 2012
    I disagree with the notion that the administration is giving up fighting COVID because it carries with it the implication that at some point they were actually attempting to stop it. From the get go the administrations plan has been knowingly throwing hundreds of thousands of innocent lives onto a pyre of human greed. What they’ve really given up on is even pretending to obfuscate that.
     
  24. Darth Nerdling

    Darth Nerdling Force Ghost star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 20, 2013
    In Marbury v Madison, Supreme Court claimed for itself the power that it could overrule the other branches, but the thing is, its own decision in Marbury v Madison undermines the idea that it's the ultimate arbiter. It claimed to have the power to overrule Madison, but it didn't. Marbury lost. They ruled against him on a technicality, and they used this loophole because they knew that if they directly ruled against Madison, he would've simply ignored the ruling. It was more about preserving the illusion of the absolute right of judicial review than establishing it as an ironclad rule.

    Then, in multiple cases since then, the Supreme Court has had the chance to overrule the actions of presidents and they've almost always deferred, finding more technicalities as outs or just stalling for time. This preserves the illusion of an absolute power of review, but at the same time, in practice, the Supreme Court will only overrule Congress, not the Presidential excesses. The real world effect of this is that the President gets to go unchecked. In this way, the illusion of absolute judicial review merely transfers power from Congress, the ones who actually write the laws, to the President, and Supreme Court has really just hoped the President would rely on the norms of the office, which Trump, W, and others simply regularly ignored.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2020
  25. Yoda's_Roomate

    Yoda's_Roomate Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 8, 2000
    11 rallies in 48 hours? If he comes out of that with no health issues the dude clearly made a deal with the devil himself.

    https://www.huffpost.com/entry/trum...wing-virus-worries_n_5f96f0e1c5b6f0775235c0ec

    Trump is expected to hit nearly a dozen states in his last-ditch effort to recover ground from Democrat Joe Biden, including Sunday’s trip to Maine and Tuesday’s to Nebraska. Both states award electoral votes by congressional district and could be crucial in a tight election. Trump will hold 11 rallies in the final 48 hours alone.
     
    Juliet316 likes this.
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