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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Books Thrawn Ascendancy: Greater Good (book 2) by Timothy Zahn

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Ancient Whills, Oct 29, 2020.

  1. SyndicThrass

    SyndicThrass Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 25, 2016
    They’re keeping it vague, beyond saying “Yeah Thrawn was involved in some event with an alien space ship from Lesser Space and the Vagaari that got Thrass killed.” But my reading is that it’s basically Zahn telling us Outbound Flight happened and it informs Thurfian’s actions somewhat, but they can’t go into it because they don’t want to outright fully canonise a Legends novel wholesale.
     
  2. Ackbar's Fishsticks

    Ackbar's Fishsticks Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 25, 2013
    Ironically this is, to me, one of the same problems the original Professor Moriarty had. The Final Problem has a pretty bad case of telling instead of showing. We're told that Moriarty and Holmes just fought an exhilirating months-long duel across London, but we don't actually get to see it, we come in at the end when Holmes has already pretty much won. We're told that Moriarty is a genius, but we don't really get to see him demonstrate it - "he hired a train to chase after me" is hardly Holmesian level brilliance. It's pretty clear that ACD was done with Holmes, wanted to give him a glowing sendoff, and invented Moriarty as a plot device that would allow Holmes to go out on a high note by dispatching an unprecedented level of bad guy.

    So every time I see a Moriarty clone in fiction whose appeal seems to be over-promised and under-delivered, I'm always like "welp, that kind of comes with the territory."
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2021
  3. AusStig

    AusStig Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 3, 2010
    Thank you.

    Interesting. I wonder why make a race then, why not a gang if you just want one bad guy. Writing smart characters is hard, since if you don't explain how they think (or worse they way they think doesn't make sense to the reader), it can be worse than not showing it at all.
     
  4. SyndicThrass

    SyndicThrass Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 25, 2016
    Jixtus isn’t the main guy behind the Grysk. Impression I get is that he’s their Nom Anor.
     
  5. Daneira

    Daneira Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Jun 30, 2016
    Before he was revealed as a Grysk, I was thinking "Wait... is that Nom Anor?"
     
  6. MercenaryAce

    MercenaryAce Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 10, 2005
    Oh man, now I am imagining a twist where Jixtus actually is Nom Anor and he is actually manipulating the Grysk like the Gyrsk manipulate other peoples.
     
  7. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Nov 15, 2004
    Grysk-ception.

    The Grysk are in-fact allowing Nom Anor to manipulate them so they can manipulate him.
     
  8. Daneira

    Daneira Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Jun 30, 2016
    That's what he wants them to think!
     
  9. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 15, 2004
    Gods I miss Nom Anor.
     
  10. Force Smuggler

    Force Smuggler Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Same here
     
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  11. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
  12. Sauron_18

    Sauron_18 Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 1, 2005
    Is there a general consensus for how book 2 compares to book 1 of this trilogy?

    I read book 1 a few months ago, and I enjoyed the new setting and the different alien factions that were a part of it. I also enjoyed the new Chiss characters and the political/military drama aspect of it. But I’m curious about whether the story slows down or evolves in a satisfying way before I choose to get into book 2 (and eventually book 3).

    While I do like Thrawn himself, I couldn’t go past the middle of Zahn’s first new canon trilogy. I feel like he tended to spend too much time on minor plot points that were part of a puzzle but not necessarily interesting in their own right. For example, Alliances, which I’ve tried getting back to because of the Grysk, kills me with the Clone Wars plotline.

    By contrast, Ascendancy 1 seemed like a very streamlined adventure in a whole new universe. Does book 2 maintain that feel and pace, or does it get bogged down in Zahnisms?
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2021
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  13. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 15, 2004
    Both adventures are pretty streamlined, but both world-build like crazy and the second one does suffer from running a seemingly separate or two plotline through it. But it all neatens up and sets up the finale and it is a middle book.
     
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  14. Daneira

    Daneira Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Jun 30, 2016
    This book is all over the place and I think Thrawn the character's participation in particular is somewhat unsatisfying. There's a lot of separate plots in this book that only briefly intersect, Thrawn's being just one of them. I still haven't gotten over the novelty of the Unknown Regions, though, so it was great just experiencing this new part of the galaxy.
     
  15. Barriss_Coffee

    Barriss_Coffee Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jun 29, 2003
    ^I agree with Daneira here. I gave it a pretty scathing review a page ago. It's poorly organized -- "all of the place" is a good description. By comparison, I really enjoyed all the other Thrawn books to date. This particular book has some great new characters and interested parts, but the plot is a mess. I got the sense it was rushed.
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2021
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  16. Sauron_18

    Sauron_18 Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 1, 2005
    Thank you, all, for your responses! It sounds like book 2 would probably stall for me too considering my concerns. It sounds like it suffers somewhat from being the middle installment. I’ll wait to hear more about whether book 3 provides an exciting conclusion to this trilogy, as that might still draw me back in either for both the last two books or just for the finale.
     
  17. Jedi Ben

    Jedi Ben Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 1999
    I have to go with the consensus here - it's a good but not great continuation.

    It does suffer from the problem of being a middle book, to a degree it can only spin the wheels. But, even allowing for that, there is a lot of wheel spinning here that makes it a slog to get through.

    There are some interesting concepts here but the execution of them is lacking.

    It does, however, recover well enough to conclude strongly.
     
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  18. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Nov 15, 2004
    It very much does.

    You're on a roll, my friend!
     
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  19. Jedi Ben

    Jedi Ben Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Jul 19, 1999
    Having a week off work does rather help.
     
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  20. Maythe14thBeWithYou

    Maythe14thBeWithYou Jedi Master star 4

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    May 26, 2014
    I gave this book 5/5 stars on Goodreads.

    I thought this was a good sequel and really liked how it was laid out with each character from Thrawn, to Thalias, to Lakphro. It all gelled well. how the political intrigue mixed in with the politics of it all.

    Some may think the politics and intrigue and different families irksome, I don't mind it. I will say the full names are hard to pronounce but luckily they're used only once. Now, Thrawn once again is compelling. He had some close calls to messing up but pulled it out per Thrawn. I really enjoyed his interactions w/Thalias and his crew. The last battle and his ability to work and manipulate the other ships for well the greater good was nice to see. Now, I know some don't like seeing Thrawn always come out on top but he hasn't always. We see that in Rebels.

    Lakinda was a nice addition to the cast of characters and I think complimented Thrawn well. We see someone who is militarily confident yet at the end we see she's also politically aware.

    Haplif and Lakphro were also interesting. It was pretty obvious he killed the fiancé because she wasn't there when they saw Lakuviv. That being said, it didn't ruin the journey of the flashbacks. I will say Haplif getting killed wasn't a foregone conclusion. I thought he'd kill Lakphro but was glad how it ended.

    Jixtus has proven to be a good villain and I'm looking forward to see how the trilogy ends.
     
  21. Xander Vos

    Xander Vos Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 3, 2013
    Book 2 is markedly better than Book 1 IMO especially BECAUSE of that second plot. I enjoy books where I get in the minds' of the villains and understand the plot they're weaving, and this does it so effectively. It's like the old Zahn books of Legends where he sets up a fantastic mystery/plot that all comes together in the finale. It was very well done in my opinion.
     
  22. IG_2000

    IG_2000 Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Aug 5, 2008
    About more than halfway through the audiobook now. I feel like this would have been a slog to read, but makes for a good listen at work.
     
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  23. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 15, 2004
    Book 2 was a slog for me, but I still enjoyed it. I think I enjoyed it more than Alliances, actually. Definitely more than Allegiance.
     
  24. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett Chosen One star 10

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    Feb 18, 2014
    I am curious. Do you listen to the books on normal or are you weird like me and listen at 1.5x speed. The normal reading is just to slow.

    I’ll bump it up to 1.8x if I have the book in front of me.
     
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  25. IG_2000

    IG_2000 Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Aug 5, 2008
    Normal speed.

    I am pretty new to audiobooks, so might change in future if I start dabbling more
     
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