Senate Understanding Islam (and reading the Qur'an chapter by chapter)

The anglicized names makes it easier for everyone to understand who is being talked about, so I prefer that. It might be difficult for outsiders to know that Yahya is John the Baptist, for instance. I don't know how anyone would understand that Qabil and Habil is supposed to be Cain and Abel.

 

Agreed. Keep the anglicized names.They make it more comprehensible.

 

In addition to what others said... My Qur'an also just doesn't give those names, and it would be a lot of work to look up each one.. But thanks for the feedback!

 

The Qur'an sounds better in the original Arabic, even though I don't know much Arabic at all. One of my professors knows Arabic so well. It's amazing when you read the Qur'an and hear some lessons that you don't hear in the Bible. Indeed, there are more women named in the Qur'an than in the Bible. I always tell people that sexism against women is a cultural problem that exists in all societies. Just because Islam is an ancient religion does not mean that all Muslims are sexists. Look at how many Christian leaders mistreat women and want to control them! My 2008-2009 university student body president was Muslim and she is one of the best advocates for women's rights I have ever met. She's not in-your-face about it, but she stands up for feminism, human rights, the Palestinians, and other causes in such a great way. She is an attorney now. Her worst enemy was one of her cabinet officers who was a Baptist. He persecuted her for her faith, her womanhood, and for her intellect. But she didn't lose her job or anything.

In 2010, my friends and I read from the Qur'an at our university in protest against those who wanted to burn it. I never would want to burn this book. I am not a believer in any faith, since I am a universalist and essentially a Shakta who worships women (no joke), but ever since 2003 I have done my best to stand up for liberal Islam. The way that Donald Trump is scaring my Muslim sisters and brothers here breaks my heart. I feel that now more than ever it is our responsibility to stand up for the oppressed. I don't see Muslims as the enemy. I see people like Trump and Cruz as the actual threats to American stability.

 

After a month with no computer, I finally got it back repaired a couple days ago! Hope to update soon and start doing regular updates again. Please continue to comment and offer feedback.

 

That point where you realise the post above had nothing to do with Islam, but everything to do with reminding you through drawn out anecdote that someone on these boards went to Texas Weslyan and did stuff there.

Ghost, please find a way to make the Qu'ran relevant to personal anecdotes from people who claim to have read it, but cannot demonstrate anything akin to familiarity with its content in future. Thanks.

 

Sura 3: "The Family of Imran"

Imran is the father of Mary, grandfather of Jesus Christ.

This is another Medinan sura, from when Mohammed was already ruling in Yathrib/Medina, in the last 10 years of his life.






Confirmation of the Torah and the Gospel

It begins like the others, and also confirms that the Bible ("the Torah and the Gospel") did come from God.

Ayah 1-4:

In the name of God, the Lord of Mercy, the Giver of Mercy!

Alif Lam Mim

God: there is no god but Him, the Ever Live, the Ever Watchful.

Step by step, He has sent the Scripture down to you [Prophet] with the Truth, confirming what went before: He sent down the Torah and the Gospel earlier as a guide for people and he has sent down the distinction [between right and wrong].






The Qur'an says not all of the Qur'an (or earlier scriptures) are meant to be taken literally

After reaffirming the Last Day, the power and knowledge of God, how he shaped us in the Womb, there comes this, beginning in Ayah 7:

Some of [the Scriptures'] verses are definite in meaning -- these are the cornerstone[mother] of the Scripture -- and others are ambiguous. The perverse at heart eagerly pursue the ambiguous in their attempt to make trouble and to pin down a specific meaning of their own: only God knows the true meaning.

Those firmly grounded in knowledge say, 'We believe in it: it is all from our Lord' -- only those with real perception will take heed.






Definition of "True Religion" and Islam

It then again recounts the Last Day of Judgment, the folly of prosperity on Earth in possessions/spouses/children if you're sent to the Fire, how much greater the Garden is compared to the pleasures of this world, how God knows the difference between true devotion and false devotion, and a comparison to the Pharaoh who opposed Moses.

Then, in Ayah 19:

True Religion, in God's eyes, is "islam" [Arabic for: "devotion to Him alone"].

As I said in the introduction, the Qur'an tends to repeat many points, especially about God and the Last Day, and even stories to events also found in the Bible. I'll be skimming over them now at this point, with the occasional reference, unless there's a new twist or perspective on it. Such as this on the Last Day, which is written a little differently this time:

On the Day when every soul finds all the good it has done present before it, it will wish all the bad it has done to be far, far away. God warns you to beware of Him, but God is compassionate towards His servants. Say, 'If you love God, and God will forgive you and forgive your sins; God is most forgiving, most merciful.'






The Family of Imran... the special birth of Mary, Zachariah, the coming of John the Baptist's birth, and the coming of the Messiah

Ayah 33:

God chose Adam, Noah, Abraham's family, and the family of 'Imran, over all other people, in one line of descent -- God hears and knows all.

Then there is the story of a special birth... the birth of Mary... and the prayers of Imran's Wife (mother of Mary) to protect Mary from the evil one. She was then placed in the care of a man named Zachariah.

After Zachariah became convinced of Mary's special bond with God, he prayed, and was told he would have a son who would confirm a Word from God and be a noble prophet: John the Baptist. Zachariah is at first in disbelief, because he is old and his wife is barren.

Then we get more about Mary being unique, and the announcement of Jesus' birth:

The angels said to Mary: 'Mary, God has chosen you and made you pure: He has truly chosen you above all women.
[...]
The angels said, 'Mary, God gives you news of a Word from Him, whose name will be the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, who will be held in honor in this world and the next, who will be one of those brought near to God.
[...]
She said, 'My Lord, how can I have a son when no man has touched me?' The angel said, 'This is how God creates what He will: when He has ordained something, He only says, "Be", and it is. He will teach him the Scripture and wisdom, the Torah and the Gospel. He will send him as a messenger to the Children of Israel:
'I have come to you with a sign from your Lord: I will make the shape of a bird for you out of clay, then breathe into it and, with God's permission, it will become a real bird; I will heal the blind and the leper, and bring the dead back to life with God's permission; I will tell you what you may eat and what you may store up in your houses. There truly is a sign for you in this, if you are believers. I have come to confirm the truth of the Torah which preceded me, and to make some things lawful to you which used to be forbidden. I have come to you with a sign from your Lord. Be mindful of God, obey me. God is my Lord and your Lord, so serve Him -- that is a straight path."'

It then goes on to introduce the disciples of Jesus, to help him in his cause.

Here, it is confirmed in Islam that Jesus was the son of Mary alone, like it is in the Bible. The Qur'an also explicitly called Jesus the Messiah, and shows that he has powers (with the permission of God) that only God has ever had: the creation of life, the resurrection of the dead, and even the authority to change what used to be forbidden.

The Qur'an goes out of its way to confirm that Jesus, and Mary, are very, very special and closer to God than all other humans. Islam does not even treat Mohammed in the way that it treats Jesus.

It then continues, in Ayah 55:

God said, "Jesus, I will take you back and raise you up to Me: I will purify you of the disbelievers. To the Day of Resurrection I will make those who followed you superior to those who disbelieved. Then you will all return to Me and I will judge between you regarding your differences.

Again affirming the truth in Jesus and his followers, while acknowledging there are differences.

Then there's this direct quote, Ayah 58 and onwards:

We relate to you [Mohammed] this revelation, a decisive statement. In God's eyes Jesus is just like Adam: He created him from dust, and said to him, 'Be', and he was. This is the truth from your Lord, so do not be one of those who doubt.

If anyone disputes this with you, now that you have been given this knowledge, say, "come, let us gather our sons and your sons, our women and your women, ourselves and yourselves, and let us pray earnestly and invoke God's rejection on those of us who are lying.

This is the truth of the matter: there is no god but God; God is the Exalted, the Decider.

If they turn away, [know that] God is well aware of anyone who causes corruption. Say, 'People of the Book, let us arrive at a statement that is common to us all: we worship God alone, we ascribe no partner to Him, and none of us takes others beside God as lords.'

I think this is very interesting, a plea from God and Mohammed that basically says: Christians and Muslims, you both worship God, agree on that and be at peace. It then brings up the example of Abraham, and how Christians wondered if he was saved or not, and the Qur'an answers that he was faithful to God in his own time even if he was neither Jew nor Christian, so let it be. To stop worrying about technicalities: good people have nothing to fear.






Again confirming previous Scriptures and Prophets, people condemn themselves, the importance of Reason and Forgiveness, Struggle, Deception, Women and Refugees

In Ayah 79:

No person to whom God had given the Scripture, wisdom, and prophethood would ever say to people, "Be my servants, not God's.'

Ayah 81:

God took a pledge from the prophets, saying, 'If, after I have bestowed Scripture and wisdom upon you, a messenger comes confirming what you have been given, you must believe in him and support him.
[...]
Say [Mohammed], 'We [Muslims] believe in God and in what has been sent down before us and to Abraham, Ishmael, Isaac, Jacob, and the Tribes. We believe in what has been given to Moses, and the Prophets from their Lord. We do not make a distinction between any of them. It is to Him we devote ourselves.'

Later, in Ayah 116-117, it's explained that those who become "companions in the Fire" are not wronged by God... they wronged themselves to be there:
It was not God who wronged them; they wronged themselves.

And in Ayah 118, there's this interesting passage:
We made Our revelations clear for you; will you not use your reason?

The importance of Forgiving Others in Ayah 133:
Hurry towards your Lord's forgiveness and a Garden as wide as the heavens and earth prepared for the righteous, who give, both in prosperity and adversity, who restrain their anger and pardon people -- God loves those who do good.

It then reminds people to be steadfast, in bad times as well as good times, to stand firm in righteousness even when it's not easy. That struggle proves true faith. With many allusions to a battle that had recently happened.

Then there's a quick word on how some who received the Scripture altered or hid it, those who deceive the truth, in Ayah 187:
God took a pledge from those who were given the Scripture -- 'Make it known to people, do not conceal it' -- but they tossed the pledge over their shoulders, they bartered it for a small price: what a bad bargain they made! Do not think [Prophet] that those who exult in what they have done and seek praise for things they have not done will escape the torment; agonizing torment awaits them'

An affirmation of male/female equality in the eyes of God in Ayah 195, and also of Immigrants and Refugees:
Their Lord answered them: 'I will not allow the deeds of any one of you to be lost, whether you are male or female, each is like the other [you come from each other, you are equal]. I will certainly wipe out the bad deeds of those who emigrated and were driven out of their homes, who suffered harm for My cause, who fought and were killed. I will certainly admit them to the Gardens graced with flowing streams, as a reward from God: the best reward is with God.'





And that concludes Sura 3: the Children of Imran!

Next will be Sura 4: Women, which takes it name from the many references to women throughout the sura, as well as covering social justice, fairness I'm marriage and inheritance, and defending the weak and helpless in times of war.

 

For something different, before my next entry on the Qur'an, here's a study comparing Violence in the Qur'an versus Violence in the Bible.

http://news.yahoo.com/heres-happens-compare-violence-quran-210900952.html

 

One thing I really dislike about the perception of some people when it comes to Islam is that it's strictly a 'brown person' religion when the Muslim population is extremely diverse. There are 'White' Muslims (Albanians, Bosniaks, Circassians, Russians etc.), 'Black' Muslims (Nigerians, Ethiopians, Eritreans etc.), 'Brown' Muslims (Algerians, Pakistanis, Gulf Arabs etc.), 'Yellow' Muslims (Indonesians, Malaysians, Chinese etc.). There has to be a group of Indigenous American Muslims there, there has to be.

Nice mate, nice.

 

Ok, so I was planning on posting "Sura 4: Women" at the end of January, beginning of February... was breezing through the chapter... then I hit a roadblock about one-third of the way through Sura 4, which made me decide to take a break from it for a little while.

I still haven't continued the chapter yet, but these are the notes I made up until that point, so this is commentary/summary of the first third of this chapter.







Sura 4: "Women"

This is also a Medinan sura.


Orphans, Marriage, Inheritance, True Repentance


Ayah 1-2:
In the name of God, the Lord of Mercy, the Giver of Mercy

People, be mindful of your Lord, who created you from a single soul, and from it [the same essence] created its mate, and from the pair of them spread countless men and women far and wide; be mindful of God, in whose name you make requests of one another. Beware of severing the ties of kinship: God is always watching over you.


It goes on to say, in summary, to treat orphans and brides fairly, and be kind and gentle to those with mental disabilities. It especially warns against the practice of marrying orphan girls in order to take their rightful inheritance. It also guarantees that women may inherit property of their own right. It then details rules of fair inheritance, and includes how important the use of witnesses is. And more reminders of "the Gardens graced with flowing streams" versus the blaze of the humiliating "Fire." And then a warning against "lewd acts", and how forgiveness can come if there is true repentance, not fake repentance, and how much sin is from ignorance and easier to repent from.


Ayah 19-21:

You who believe, it is not lawful for you to inherit women against their will,
nor should you treat your wives harshly, hoping to take back some of the bride-gift you gave them, unless they are guilty of something clearly outrageous.
Live with them in accordance to what is fair and kind:
if you dislike them, it may be well that you dislike something in which God has put much good.
If you wish to replace one wife with another, do not take back any of her bride-gift, even if you have given her a great amount of gold. How can you take it when this is unjust and a blatant sin? How can you take it when you have lain with each other and they have taken a solemn pledge from you?


Here, we see how Mohammed and the Qur'an elevated the status of women, saying they couldn't be inherited, or treated harshly, or have their bride-gift taken back by their husbands, and stating God has put much good in them.

It goes on to outlaw forms of incest, and state that a gift to the bride is obligatory in order to marry. And says not to give into lust and take slave-women as mistresses, but as wives, with the consent of her people and in accordance to her people's customs.


Then we transition, and are subject to sort-of a recap of some of the ten commandments:

This is for those of you who fear that you will sin; it is better for you to practice self-restraint. God is most forgiving and merciful, He wishes to make His laws clear to you and guide you to the righteous ways of those who went before you. He wishes to turn towards you in mercy -- He is all knowing, all wise -- He wishes to turn towards you, but those who follow their lusts want you to go far astray. God wishes to lighten your burden; man was created weak.

You who believe, do not wrongfully consume each other's wealth but trade by mutual consent. Do not kill each other, for God is merciful to you. If any of you does these things, out of hostility and injustice, We shall make him suffer Fire: that is easy for God. But if you avoid the great sins you have been forbidden, We shall wipe out your minor misdeeds and let you in through the entrance of honor.

Do not covet what God has given to some of you more than others -- men have the portion they have earned; and women have the portion that they have earned -- you should rather ask God for some of His bounty: He has full knowledge of everything.






To be continued...

 

Well, I know I'm really behind in this, but I figured it's important to bring this thread back up to be able to read and discuss what Islam is really about... considering President Trump's recent actions.

 

Sorry, Ghost, but I disagree 100% for one simple reason. You're only covering half of islam. Actually, less than half. Islam is not based solely upon the koran like other religions with a single holy book, i.e., Christianity and Judaism. Islam is also heavily based upon the hadiths of mohammed, more so than the koran, most of which is where the call for jihad against infidels comes from, and the proclamation for muslims to follow taqiya. This is also where the repugnant ideology of child-brides comes from, as well as the subjugation and denigration of women. To present any discourse on islam without presenting all of islam is dishonest and manipulative.

And if you would like to do a study on violence compared to verses in the bible, I challenge you to do the study of the bible (the only holy book of Christendom) versus the koran and the hadiths. I guarantee your chart would look quite a bit different.

I would like to just mention the existence of the video Why We Are Afraid by Dr. Bill Warner, which breaks islam down to statistical facts outside the realm of political opinion. It is based entirely upon what the hadiths and the koran say about muslims, and upon their collective actions over the last 1400 years. Since I'm not trying to flame anyone (no, really), I will embed the video in spoiler tags at the bottom. I highly, highly, highly recommend everyone watch the whole thing and then think about it for a few days before commenting to mentally digest it. It's only 45 minutes long or so.

As for President Trump, he is merely repeating the actions of what has already been done in the past with zero flack, and now, he has simply become a lightning rod for political mud slinging because it is convenient to do so. He didn't ban muslims. He banned and/or restricted entry from known terrorist-sponsoring nations, exactly as did George Bush after 2001, and Jimmy Carter did in the late 70s. Why all the fuss now? And it isn't a perma-ban. It is in place until there are better vetting procedures available.

Yes, there are a majority of muslims who are peaceful and don't practice taqiya or the other repugnant ideologies in islam, but they, unfortunately, are irrelevant, just as the majority of Germans who were peaceful during WWII were irrelevant--because the actions of the few destroyed the image of the many. And that, perhaps, is the ultimate tragedy because those people who are peaceful are caught in the middle.

I am not asking you to turn this into a hate thread. We really have quite enough of that in the world as it is. I'm only asking you to present the hadiths, which form the spine of islam, alongside the koran, which is only the surface.

Spoiler

[\Spoiler]

 

I used that quote without permission from Brigitte Gabriel. lol

 

I googled Brigitte Gabriel. She posted the following today: "The battle lines have been drawn. On one side, a bunch of anti-American, radical Islamic enablers. On the other, peaceful and patriotic citizens."

 

She is right about the need to get rid of "political correctness." That strangles free speech and free thought in a more insidious fashion because it teaches people they are "wrong" to have opinions that go against the political majority.

 

The only decent way to mention this woman is to denounce her positions, twowolves.
Don't obfuscate by bringing political correctness into it. And using the quote marks only makes your statement more offensive.

 

Sorry, but I don't disagree with her. As an American citizen, I want my country safe from the scourge of radical islam. I don't want to see the streets of the US resemble those in Germany after they let in all those refugees. Or the streets of France. And if that means a temporary ban on anyone coming from known terrorist sponsoring countries, so be it. Until we have a way to sift the radicals from the ranks of refugees, then they do not have a God-given right to expect that we're just going to let them in simply because they are a "refugee," when in fact, they could be a terrorist. Time to shore up our borders and border security. Only once our own doorstep is swept clean can we afford to worry about letting others in. America first.

 

I fear you have been fed some very, very subjective information. This is the real problem in America, and to an extent, in the rest of the Western world. It's a shame, we could have been great.

 

The correct response was:

"I may disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."
--Voltaire

 

^

 

Nobody said you have no right to say anything... say whatever the **** you want. We're allowed to tell you that your words sound pretty vile, though.