Lit "Unlearn what you have learned" - The Jedi Thread

I confess it reminds me of the origins of Catholic celibacy rules. There had always been a pro-chastity movement in the faith but what got it going was the fact that fathers were leaving churches to their sons as property, making people of....questionable vocation.

Something similar may have happened with the Jedi as there were always people who felt it was more spiritual but it was actually more Jedi simply needing to be on call 24-7 for their entire lives due to small numbers.

So, in that completely pragmatic decision, they wouldn't care about celibacy vs. marriage.

Frankly, is it a question in-universe? I thought it was clear she eventually got a job working for Bail Organa and she had gainful employment even in hiding in Ahsoka.

Just in hiding.

 

That remind me of something I wrote some time ago:

 

Fair enough, maybe I've been reading too many X-Men comics and watching too many X-Men films, where we're supposed to believe in Logan that Wolverine couldn't even save up enough money to buy a boat...

And now we have the answer why Luke had so few Jedi after 30 years in new Canon--

Luke: Hi, telepathic, telekinetic jet-setting, rich businessperson, do you want to give up all your money, attachments, declare celibacy, and become a Jedi?

Force sensitive galactic one percenter: Um, no.

 

That's because he also has to pay for his own and Charles medicine and can't/won't really take any jobs that would reveal him.

 

It doesn't help Charles also killed his entire student body, destroyed his fortune, and is probably wanted by a bunch of people.

 

Reading the news and without getting too specific, there are tons of wanted people, who don't have super powers, who have access to tons of money. Unfortunately.

 

Getting back to the central subject, I think the Jedi Knighthood have suffered from the fact they are too often the Knighthood and not the Jedi. The Jedi modified themselves to make themselves a police force for the Old Republic and that requires a fundamentally different mindset and type of skills than being a religious order. The Church of the Force is a separate religion from the Jedi Knighthood despite having the same deity and there's almost no implied relationship between the two.

Indeed, the Jedi Knights have imposed countless rules designed to create the best possible soldiers for the Galactic Republic and directly contravene their chosen tenants (using a slave army, fighting for an unjust cause, propping up the Republic when its in the wrong) because it is what is best for their secular masters.

As Mace Windu said. "He had an attachment to the Republic."

There's also the fact a lot of their extreme interpretation of the Force seems based on their desire to avoid impacting the Old Republic and becoming a dynasty. They sought the perfect and became the enemy of the good. So afraid of the Dark Side were they that they limited the number of Force sensitives in the galaxy by not having children and taking them out of the gene pool. They tried to make sure that every part of their children's lives were controlled to create nearly identical Jedi and thus became predictable.

The thing is, the Jedi are never doing these things evilly. There's no signs of abuse, the children are cared for, they're all (with one exception) very well adjusted. However, you can tell they've bent the rules and done many shady things because the Republic needs their Jedi--and maybe they wouldn't need them AS MUCH if there was a much larger neutral Jedi religion and the Galactic Republic had its own standing military.

 

FIFY

can you expand on this?

 

Separatist and Independence movements in RL are things that are never as cut and dried as STAR WARS conflicts tend to be. This is true in both the EU and canon with the Confederacy. The Jedi know Count Dooku is a Darksider even if I believe they may think he's just a "pretender Sith" (this is speculation on my part) and possibly Darth Maul's master--because that would make things very conveinant for them wouldn't it?

However, for the vast majority of citizens of the CIS, the organization is just a chance to gain greater autonomy in a seemingly nonfunctional bureaucracy. The difference between the Clone Wars and, say, the American Civil War is slavery isn't at stake and thus the moral right of the government to keep a state within its possession is much more nebulous (even if I doubt 100% of the citizenry of Separatist worlds are in-tune with the decision to withdrawal).

Palpatine uses the Clone Wars for more than just killing Jedi Knights by sending them against waves of battle droids. The Clone Wars result in a good chunk of the galaxy becoming subject to military occupation by the future Galactic Empire. It allows a non-democratic apparatus to be set up and plants the seeds for the Regional Governors having direct control over their territories.

Even if we didn't know the Galactic Republic was ALSO under the control of a Sith Lord, the Jedi Knighthood is employing a Clone Army and fully aligned with crushing the Separatists versus seeking a equitable negotiated peace. They arguably couldn't have chosen any differently but that's why Palpatine was destined to win.

One of the ironies is that it's fairly clear that the Jedi Council has some Separatist sympathies prior to the revelation of Count Dooku's fall to the Dark Side. "Political idealist" and "it's not in his character" mean that some Jedi may actually think he has the correct idea.

 

Well, yes, the obvious problem with the EU Jedi is that the more they veer into temporal manners they lose their spiritual authority that gives them the authority to intervene in the first place.

 

I wonder if this will be what happened with Luke in the reverse. Luke was so determined to get it right, none of his students decided to become part of the galaxy.

 

But is not that a bit like saying that the just because some (we don't really see that many) of the people fighting on the side of Saruman and his alliance of Rubber Barons (who don't want to negotiated peace) have some justified grievances so should the Jedi not try to stop them from trying to take over?

No they are leading one, the Republic is employing both the Clone Army and them.

 

The corporations are subsidizing the CIS but aren't actually its leadership, that's the Confederate Senate we see in the cartoon. Officially, most of them are neutral as we see with the Banking Clan. The Jedi are essentially overreacting as what they needed to do was remove Dooku from power (but we know that Palpatine was also in power so it wouldn't have worked). Padme almost succeeded in making a peace treaty too. By herself.

 

I mean, the thing about the CIS is that all it’s complaints were true. They just didn’t actually act in a manner that would have solved their complaints.

 

Just wondering: if we say that you are right here, how do you suggest they do that?

 

They send in Quinlan Vos undercover to partner with Ventress and assassinate him.

 

No, no, they have Obi Wan and Anakin negotiate his return with some pirates that have inexplicably been able to capture him.

 

I almost forgot this TCW episode until this reminded me. Hondo should have been bragging to us at Galaxy's Edge Smuggler's Run about that time he captured Count Dooku...

 

Maybe they have those cool Mandalorian cages from Dark Empire.

 

Of which a version is already canonical.

 

Wasn't that cage an invention of Umak Leth? It wasn't a Mandalorian design, it was made of Mandalorian iron as I recall.

IG: @jedisufism

 

Yes that.

 

https://www.instagram.com/tv/B3aUrNoFE5S/?igshid=1xdl7722dwrxh

This is probably a good place for this. Kanan Jarrus has spoken.

IG: @jedisufism

 

Incredible rant.

 

Unless 9 sheds more light on those Jedi texts, or it or tie in materials define how the philosophy in the texts differ from the PT Jedi, we may not have much more to discuss (other than what we've already discussed) in this thread after 9 comes out.