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Saga Unpopular Star Wars opinions!

Discussion in 'Star Wars Saga In-Depth' started by Feelicks, Feb 23, 2013.

  1. Darth_Cruiser

    Darth_Cruiser Jedi Padawan

    Registered:
    May 4, 2022
    It doesn't make sense in any way. He's a war hero and a likeable fellow but Mace doesn't trust him....for some reason? It's probably due to how Lucas wrote Anakin as a unsure young Jedi while the TCW version is completely different - a likeable confident war hero.
     
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  2. Watcherwithin

    Watcherwithin Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 9, 2017
    The Clone Wars version is not completely different. They are both the same person and both depictions show case why a conservative like Mace wouldn’t like him
     
  3. Force Nexus

    Force Nexus Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Jun 22, 2022
    Anakin was portrayed as a likeable, confident war hero at the start of Revenge of the Sith.
    Mace's distrust has got absolutely nothing to do with it. Mace doesn't trust Anakin because he is too close to Palpatine. "It's very dangerous putting them together. I don't think the boy can handle it. I don't trust him." It's literally in the movie. Mace is worried where Anakin's allegiances lie and whether he is able to do what needs to be done due to his emotional attachment to Palpatine - his friend and mentor. Anakin is known for expressing allegiance to the people he is attached to over his duty, he's done it multiple times throughout the Clone Wars.
     
  4. Lowly Gungan

    Lowly Gungan Jedi Padawan star 1

    Registered:
    Aug 11, 2022
    To be honest, I think the final seasons of The Clone Wars might have benefitted if they had gone more into Anakin's fall after Ahsoka left. Maybe they could create a parallel between that and the deaths of Shmi and Padmé. One of the most interesting things about Padmé, I find, in the movies is that she provides stability and emotional support for Anakin in the place of his mother. I would have liked to see that more often in The Clone Wars, maybe along with focus on Anakin trusting the Jedi Council less after Ahsoka was kicked out, especially Mace Windu.

    The Clone Wars, I think, improved a lot of characters (granted, I have not seen the show in a while, but I remember I found Yoda, Jar Jar, and possibly Obi-wan to really benefit), but I might have done Anakin a bit differently.
     
  5. Alexrd

    Alexrd Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    What does being a war hero got to do with anything? Being a war hero doesn't make him immune to distrust, specially when he already presented motives to distrust, both in AOTC when he disobeyed a direct order from Mace himself, and in ROTS when he threw a petulant temper tantrum in front of the whole Council. Besides, Mace is very aware of the heavy influence of Palpatine on Anakin.

    Anakin never lacked confidence and he's an established hero in ROTS.
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2022
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  6. gezvader28

    gezvader28 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 22, 2003
    Mace seemed to dislike Anakin from the moment he met him.
     
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  7. Alexrd

    Alexrd Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
  8. Dandelo

    Dandelo SW and Film Music Interview Host star 10 VIP - Game Host

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    Aug 25, 2014
    Mace dislikes everyone the moment he meets them :p

    he's just one of those characters.

    Had he lived a bit longer he'd have become one of those old man shouting at the cloud types.
     
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  9. Alexrd

    Alexrd Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    [​IMG]
    "A Sith Lord?!"
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2022
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  10. Lowly Gungan

    Lowly Gungan Jedi Padawan star 1

    Registered:
    Aug 11, 2022
    That is one of the best descriptions I have ever heard of the character.

    But seriously, there are a couple of things I think they could have done to make Anakin's own continuity clearer. For one thing, his voice sounded different in The Clone Wars.
     
  11. Sarge

    Sarge Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Oct 4, 1998
    Well, to be fair, so did I.
     
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  12. Dandelo

    Dandelo SW and Film Music Interview Host star 10 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Aug 25, 2014
    little kid Anakin, who had just been taken from his mother because he wanted to be a Jedi?

    bit harsh.
     
  13. Saga_Symphony

    Saga_Symphony Force Ghost star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 30, 2010
    I think Mace showed more dislike of Qui-Gon than Anakin in TPM, which probably transferred to Anakin at least somewhat. Mace just seems like a more rule-abiding and traditional Jedi, not to mention he's an authority figure, and that naturally contrasts Jedi like Anakin and Qui-Gon.
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2022
  14. Yoda also doubts about Anakin and the Prophecy during Episode 3
    with Episode 3 came out before TCW show sadly affects TCW since they never mention that Anakin had a Padawan or that Maul was still alive General Grievous was the only threat for the Jedi with the exception of Palpatine if Maul had really been alive he would have been mentioned
    they clearly did not have in mind TCW events when Episode 3 came out TCW retcons the events of the Prequels movies thats why i think that in my opinion the old Dark Horse Clone Wars comics fits better with the original movies but i still like TCW show
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 29, 2022
  15. Darth_Cruiser

    Darth_Cruiser Jedi Padawan

    Registered:
    May 4, 2022
    Why? Because of Lucas dialogue? :p
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2022
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  16. Alexrd

    Alexrd Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    Where are people seeing this dislike from Mace towards Anakin and Qui-Gon?

    Anakin was originally refused to be trained because he was too old and had already much fear in him, not because Mace or any of the Jedi didn't like him.

    Mace was skeptic towards some of Qui-Gon's views, he didn't show any dislike towards him or anyone else.

    No, he posits that they could have misread the prophecy by assuming that Anakin is the Chosen One, as opposed to someone else.

    After the death of Dooku, Grievous was the only threat left as far as the war goes. That's what established in the movie. There's also nothing in the movies that excludes the fact that Anakin had a Padawan for a couple of years during the war. And Maul's story was supposed to have closure within the series. And later on have his story continue in the sequel trilogy, where he would be the main bad guy. Just because we didn't get closure on that front doesn't make it inconsistent with the movies.
     
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  17. Force Nexus

    Force Nexus Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Jun 22, 2022
    Ahsoka left the Jedi Order. Anakin no longer had a Padawan. Considering how Anakin treats his own failures and buries them deep within himself, there is no reason she should be mentioned. Ahsoka's departure really wasn't pretty for everyone involved, except Palpatine and Tarkin, of course. And it had no immediate relevance to the plot of Revenge of the Sith, which was centered around Anakin's visions of Padmé's death.

    Maul was a renegade criminal at this point. From the Jedi's point of view, he was not on the priority list compared to the immediate Separatist threat, and the Jedi were spread thin because of the war, and their hands were full in Revenge of the Sith. Events moved extremely quickly and escalated drastically in that movie, with the fates of the Jedi Order and the Republic itself being at stake. They could not be considered with a former Sith Lord criminal having a grip on a neutral star system outside of the Republic — they simply could not afford it.

    Of course, The Clone Wars was made after Revenge of the Sith. But so was the prequel trilogy made after the original trilogy. The original trilogy had no specific mentions of any characters or events of the prequel trilogy (outside of a single off-hand mention of "the clone wars"), because it had no immediate relevance to the story of the OT. What the prequel trilogy did was recontextualize the events and characters of the original trilogy. You look differently at Darth Vader, who is now a pathetic and tragic character. You look differently at the "I am your father" revelation, which is not a twist anymore. You look differently at Vader's redemption. Same with The Clone Wars: it gives you a new perspective and additional context.
     
  18. Lowly Gungan

    Lowly Gungan Jedi Padawan star 1

    Registered:
    Aug 11, 2022
    That does seem a bit harsh for such a young and innocent child…
    In all fairness, Ahsoka was going after Maul at the exact same time.

    But I admit it might have helped if they had set up Mace Windu's mistrust toward Anakin better and maybe shown a bit more of Anakin gradually falling to the Dark Side—he sometimes felt too mature and too heroic in comparison to his movie counterpart. As I said, I think Ahsoka leaving would have been an excellent opportunity to lead into Anakin becoming less controlled and less compassionate, but we don't really see it.
     
  19. Saga_Symphony

    Saga_Symphony Force Ghost star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 30, 2010
    Honestly I would've hated if Ahsoka had had that much impact on Anakin. He never needed her in his story in the first place; he's got the attachment/ loss issues solidified in the movies, don't need to add another. Really, I think I prefer TCW to be in its own contained place that's easy to disregard as canon because of how fanficcy it is.

    I think it's more disapproval than personal dislike, but whatever you call it, it seems pretty obvious Mace wasn't a big fan of Qui-Gon or Anakin, probably because they weren't the most rule-abiding, Council-compliant Jedi.

    Mace flat out says "I don't trust him" regarding Anakin, and in TPM he's sighing and seems to roll his eyes at Qui-Gon's request, as if to say "Here we go again..." The way he acts towards them may not be antagonistic, but it's certainly not positive.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2022
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  20. Alexrd

    Alexrd Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    Yes, disapproval is certainly a better word than dislike.

    But I don't find any of that obvious at all. Like I said, Mace is skeptic towards Qui-Gon's opinion, but he doesn't show any disrespect and acquiesced to his request to test Anakin.

    Mace also flat out praises Anakin in AOTC when Obi-Wan confides his worries in AOTC.

    And not being positive is not the same as actively being negative.
     
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  21. Saga_Symphony

    Saga_Symphony Force Ghost star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 30, 2010
    Yeah, I already said it's not exactly antagonistic, but the things he says, the tone he uses, the expressions he makes, definitely lean more toward him holding a negative opinion than a positive or neutral one. Which doesn't mean he's immune to showing praise at all, but those moments are few, and I think most would agree that in general Mace shows a more critical view of Anakin and Qui-Gon than a supportive one.

    But honestly, I like that about Mace.
     
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  22. christophero30

    christophero30 Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    May 18, 2017
    Mace kind of has a poker face, so he does seem a bit exasperated with Anakin most of the time to me.
     
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  23. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    By that logic things like Sith Lords, Mandalorians, Coruscant and Gungans don't matter since they're not mentioned in the OT. Not everything has to be discussed or referenced.
     
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  24. BlackRanger

    BlackRanger Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 14, 2018
    Of course Tagge says about Vader that "this Sith Lord sent by the Emperor will be our undoing" in a deleted scene in SW 1977. So that was technically there in a sense.
     
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  25. Sarge

    Sarge Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Oct 4, 1998
    Vader was a Lord of the Sith in the novel that was published before the movie was released in 77.
     
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