I see your point but I don't believe the perspective of die-hard SW fans is enough to move that needle. Not that many of us (and anyone posting on a SW board is as die-hard as they come).

The General Audience is where the money is at. The appeal there that can spread to licensing and merchandising. That's how Disney makes its money - not from BO.

Like you said - we know of KOTOR or Thrawn but the average person watching Baby Yoda on Disney+ has no clue. Disney+ had nearly 87 million subscribers by end of year 1 when they expected 90 million in year 4. That popularity is of course partially due to pandemic but a lot to do with Baby Yoda. And I highly doubt most of them know that level of SW detail.

I look at SW from the business side first. From outside we can only guess where the story goes but the business plan is pretty typical. The ST wasn't typical but we didn't know that. If it was clear from the start that they were going in without a plan and each director doing their own thing - most of us would have expected TROS to be what it was before TFA even came out. A lot of decisions made in the ST was bad for business and it's no longer controversial to say Disney agrees with that too.

I think its a great ideal that the story drives all but that's not the reality of businesses, especially as big as Disney. Once they find a formula they stick to it.

This is tongue in cheek but on point as usual - Disney gonna feed us cake.

 

Yep, except some were were expecting JJ to avoid Reylo, make Rey a Skywalker by blood, make Luke come back to life, etc. Did anything of that happen?

So not sure what is the point in expecting new authors will come and adapt an already told story so it fits your preferences, when the track record of your expectations on this regard is so poor.

 

With respect, I think Filoni might be right. There is an abundance of literature and material across canon and legends that describe the Jedi and Jedi Order as a quasi-religious-martial organisation, with recruits, ranked members, and ex-members who have either left or have been expelled. I think then that "ex-Jedi" (and not a Dark Sider) could actually be a thing.

 

Attacking posters instead of replying to points of posts isn't a good look.

Criticizing predictions when even JJ didn't finish the story until pre-production and reports of Disney changing things from what JJ had is funny to me.

As far as my point - I've made it clearly.

 

Jedi isn't a race. It's a creed.

But seriously, I don't think once someone becomes a Jedi, they are a Jedi forever even if they lead the Order. Tarkin and Motti both refer to the Jedi way as a religion and in real life people can leave religions. It's right there in the dialogue:

Mace Windu: "You know, m'lady, that Count Dooku was once a Jedi."

Ahsoka Tano: "I'm no Jedi!"

etc.

 

That is how I understand it. Jedi Master Eeth Koth is removed from the Council and subsequently leaves the Jedi order / Jedi ways in the Darth Vader comics by Charles Soule.

 

I like the rephrasing of it in the Mandalorian:

That screamed to me - whatever you want to call it - it is what it is.

Side note - I would like to see more Force users who aren't Jedi/Sith - but that seems like a topic for another thread.

 

Ahsoka may live her life that way, but more as a kind of Ronin, or independent (which is how Filoni described her in the Vanity Fair interview he did)

She left behind (and didn’t actually even become a Jedi within) the formal Jedi religion to which Jedi belong. Much like Catholics to the Catholic Church, other Christian type denominations don’t identify as Catholic just because they live similar devout lives and go to church.

I don’t think it is semantics. Being a Jedi describes specifically being an adherent to that particular creed and organisation.

Another example is Eeth Koth. In the Darth Vader comic series, he leaves behind the Jedi and the Jedi Order and becomes a priest in another religious organization altogether, the Church of the Ganthic Enlightenment.

 

It’s all good. Nice talking with you. MTFBWY

 

To be fair to her detractors, I wouldn't say that she followed them better than the Council, but she could see that the Council wasn't all that wise to begin with or that there was something fundamentally wrong with them.

That being said, there's also the "emotional" aspect of it all; many people seem to have this idea that Force-users or Jedi can "blunt" their emotions, but there's nothing in-canon really saying that. They may be used to dealing with them in some senses, but they're just as prone to emotional outbursts and impulsiveness as, well, the average Joe on Earth or in Star Wars. So the argument that "Ahsoka should've been less prone to emotionalism due to the Force like all Jedi" doesn't sit well with me because, in the actual canon at least, that's technically not what we're shown (I'm talking about the back then when the original episodes had aired and people were arguing back and forth on it).

^ lol I'm rambling but this convo got me thinking about this stuff again (after a long time, mind you). Don't mean to derail or anything. Let's get back to the topic at hand, I suppose.

 

https://www.ocregister.com/2021/02/...for-star-wars-trading-post-in-downtown-disney

Think this shows that Disney is still interested in exploring ST content through theme parks and live experiences.

 

The source article from OC Register has even more details:

https://www.ocregister.com/2021/02/...to-a-star-wars-rebel-base-in-downtown-disney/

 

Sorry was just giving you the heads up as per below -

 

LOL. That store is representing a move away from the ST focus of GE. Before the F&F SW-verse has its event, I bet GE will be fully away from the ST timeline outside of the Rise of the Resistance ride.

 

There is no F&F SW-verse. It’s just Star Wars, all one timeline and canon.

You’re whole argument has been Disney and LFL want to move away from the ST. Time and time again we provide evidence to the contrary - setting Rogue Squadron post ST, selling out of brand new ST funko pops, setting the holiday special in the ST, creating restaurants with an ST theme and all you can do is be snarky and deflect.

By all means continue to deflect but don’t expect to be taken seriously.

 

You crack me up. I'll save that with the D&D and RJ trilogies are definitely coming takes.

Nothing to deflect. We all see what's happening and where the money is going.

This is the Way.

 

Thank you for proving my point so succinctly. Glad I could provide a laugh I guess.

 

*sigh* This argument has surely run its course, no? The collection of silo echo chambers that is the internet has ensured that the entrenched positions on either side of this debate will never see the other's position as legitimate, or even real. Which is a shame. I am firmly on the pro-ST side, but it pains me that I am forced to "take sides" at all. It often makes these boards unpleasant. The notions promulgated here and elsewhere that "Mando good, ST bad," and "F&F amazing, KK evil," are so reductive. When I was a kid, I didn't like JarJar or the fart jokes that infiltrated the PT, but I still loved those movies desperately. It was Star Wars! NEW Star Wars!!! Now, I'm not advocating a complete suspension of critical faculties--Star Wars is a popular art form, and therefore open to critique like any other cultural expression. But, c'mon--it's not black and white! The new films and TV shows--just like the older ones--have things to recommend them, elements that are not so great, and everything in between. So why the need to absolutely disavow elements of the franchise we don't like? And denigrate those fans who take a position contrary to our own? As I said, it's a shame. And it breeds negativity and contempt. Why not simply revel in this time--such a great time to be a fan!! There's literally something for every taste.

 

Go back to the very beginning of the Jedi Order.....the Prime Jedi. What was his story like before becoming a Jedi, why become a Jedi? Were the Jedi the 1st force faction?

 

According to c.1974/75 Lucas, the first jedi were grandchildren: they were preceded by 'the Holy man named Skywaker' and his 12 sons. Maybe he had the 12 tribes of Israel on his mind, with the holy man as Jacob, who was called Israel after wrestling with an angel, or maybe with God himself, and holding his own against them as it were. (The jedi council had 12 seats, and Luke had a dozen students, and there are 11 jedi voices+Leia at the end)

As for the 'prime jedi'...'prime' means first, but also 'most powerful'. That's Satan.

Thirteen is a prime number. And bad luck, or so they say.

 

Apologies for jumping in...

Has 12 not been the number of a council or quorum since biblical times? The most famous 12 being Jesus' loyal disciples and the 13th being his betrayer, Judas and where we get 13 being bad luck.