main
side
curve
  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Discussion Where does Star Wars go as an IP from here?

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Future Films - Spoilers Allowed' started by 2Cleva, Jan 6, 2020.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. DARTH_BELO

    DARTH_BELO Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2003
    I agree, @The Regular Mustache. If they do films or shows after the events of TROS, it should be well beyond. I think we've spent enough time with the Jedi not being part of the picture. The Jedi were part of what made SW so great, and they've been ultimately absent for all of the new material that has come out under the Disney banner, with the exception of a few Force users, learning-or rag tag Jedi who have remained in hiding here and there. Thank God we have season 7 of TCW coming soon to quench that thirst...

    I do agree that the general public seems to be slowly losing interest in SW. Nowadays it feels like it is no longer the massive phenomenon that is capturing the hearts of younglings, the way the OT and the PT did. Now, it seems SW is simply viewed by joe or Jane casual moviegoer as "just another cool movie franchise," and nothing more-basically on the same level with the MCU films. Whether it's in theaters OR streaming...Among my friends and the many people I'd talked to over the course of 2019, there was much more hype over Avengers: Endgame, than there was for TROS! I knew people (who called themselves SW fans, no less) who didn't even know Solo was coming out at the time!

    Personally, I believe that the only real reason SW is still as successful as it is is mainly cos of the older generations who haven't lost their love for all things SW. Those who were around for the theatrical releases of the OT, and those who were not yet adults when the PT was coming out (like myself). But Star Wars can't survive on nothing but nostalgia forever. Once those generations move on....who will be left to carry the fandom torch? Not THIS generation of kids, as far as I can tell... After all, every series has its "dynasty." It's foolish to expect that Star Wars will always be the massively popular, culturally-impacting franchise it was forever...
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2020
    2Cleva likes this.
  2. Oissan

    Oissan Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 9, 2001
    I don't think that is really true. You are making the past look a whole lot different than it actually was.

    Star Wars wasn't any more (or less) considered to be a massive phenomenon back in the days of the PT than it is right now. Star Wars was not THE franchise during the time of the PT, thus it makes little sense to claim that it somehow dropped from that level now. if anything, that drop happened a very long time ago.

    Not only was Star Wars hardly unbeatable even back in the days of the OT (ET made it to no. 1 alltime, Raiders got past ESB, later on there was Jurassic Park as well) but it never truly dominated afterwards either. Worldwide the franchise couldn't keep up with LOTR or Harry Potter, and to some extend POTC as well. Domestically TPM was a giant, but AOTC and ROTS were just one of the big movies of the time, not dominating the rest.

    Star Wars is right where it has been for a long time, among the most successful franchises in the world. The only true difference is that the development in asia is changing the environment.
     
  3. DARTH_BELO

    DARTH_BELO Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2003
    I get your perspective on that, but I gotta say I don't really agree. Honestly that's a whole conversation that could be had, but as I am at work unfortunately I suppose we'll simply have to agree to disagree for now...
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2020
    2Cleva likes this.
  4. Bor Mullet

    Bor Mullet Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Apr 6, 2018
    This is only maybe, possibly, kinda true if you completely ignore the massive, global, pop cultural phenomenon that is the Mandalorian and Baby Yoda. But don't let me ruin the negative narrative. I'll step out of the way now.
     
  5. DARTH_BELO

    DARTH_BELO Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2003
    It's only my opinion/prediction, based on my observations. That's the point of this forum (and this actual thread). It's okay that I post something other than only positive praise.

    Either way, what you might call a "negative narrative," I would simply call "being realistic." I agree with you that The Mandalorian and baby Yoda are definitely massively popular, but I wouldn't necessarily elevate them to "phenomenon" status. Most of what makes that show so enjoyable seems to mostly really be recognized by fans of previous non-saga material-like Rebels, TCW, etc. In my experience, almost all of the easter eggs in that show completely flew over the heads of Joe or Jane casual moviegoer. I mean, there's memes all over the place showing that! I don't mean to make it sound like I'm splitting hairs here, but still-there's a big difference between being "massively popular with fans," as opposed to "pop-culture phenomenon."

    And that's exactly what I'm talking about here. Based on what I've seen/heard, I don't feel that a single Disney+ series, featuring a cute new character would be enough to single-handedly bring back all that we remember and loved about Star Wars, to the point where it's once again a "pop culture phenomenon." I am sure it will be popular with fans for years to come, but, after all this IS the thread topic, and that's my opinion. If that makes me sound negative, that's okay-I'm just being honest about my realistic point of view regarding SW.

    @Bor Mullet, If you disagree, and you feel that Star Wars is making a comeback and we haven't yet witnessed the best to come, then please-I'd love to hear your points on that!
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2020
  6. The Regular Mustache

    The Regular Mustache Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 22, 2015
    I would definitely say that Star Wars is losing its specialness and could end up being merely yet another big budget popcorn flick especially considering that the OT characters are dead and the ST characters never became as beloved as the OT cast. Plus the next movies are going to be staring over with a whole new cast so they can't build momentum for the next movie off of fan love for Rey, Finn, and Poe since they aren't going to be in the movies.

    After how the ST ended up I personally don't want to see the ST characters again, or at least not for a very long time. That said I think Disney should have taken a page from Marvel and introduced new characters in the ST as a setup for future movies but strangely enough they didn't do that, unless we're going to get a Jannah and Lando movie, (Ha! Yeah right)!

    So now Disney has the job of ushering in a new film without the OT or ST cast involved while also introducing a set of new characters that likely don't have much if any connection to the OT or ST characters. I suppose The Mandalorian did that on some level but not on the level of a big budget theatrical release.
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2020
    Troy_Viszla, 2Cleva and DARTH_BELO like this.
  7. 2Cleva

    2Cleva Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 28, 2002
    Yes - from a marketing POV they are starting over whenever the next release comes out - and that will set the tone for the IP.

    A lot of hope from previous stories that are hinted at or previously told in other mediums in the "What SW films do you want made" thread but those all seem like bad business moves because they imply a need for past SW knowledge imo. They need a fresh start - one the ST did not provide.

    A reboot event based off The Mandalorian and Baby Yoda that provides an alternate timeline still feels like the best way to go for me. Even though that undercuts the ST - they've gotten about all they can from that so far, especially with the rumors of a Galaxy Edge revamp coming.

    Other option is a pure reboot (ala Batman, Transformers coming, etc....) but I doubt that will go over well.

    Just telling stories isn't enough imo to launch an IP - which is where Disney LFL is at.
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2020
    indydefense likes this.
  8. DarthPhilosopher

    DarthPhilosopher Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jan 23, 2011
    I'm fairly sure a new era would suffice. TM has illustrated that new characters and a good story is all the audience needs to be invested. A new story in a new era will easily be a good move.

    I think hoping for an alternative ST at this point is wishful thinking.
     
  9. indydefense

    indydefense Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 2, 2019
    It might as well be a brand new IP. If they had truly wanted to maximize profits, they'd have had some of Luke's students survive Kylo's massacre and show up in TROS.
     
    The Regular Mustache likes this.
  10. 2Cleva

    2Cleva Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 28, 2002
    Or had a real Skywalker survive.

    Rey being the daughter of Luke was a wide open layup and they blew it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2020
  11. Callous Jedi

    Callous Jedi Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2020
    If they are going to make a new Star Wars movie. I like to see something in deep time before episode 1. I am a little tired of the emperor and the empire. I am tired of storm troopers, I am tired of the same ships being used over and over again. Thinking maybe around a 1,000 years in the past or more. There will be many Jedi's and lets see what happen in the past.
     
  12. indydefense

    indydefense Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 2, 2019
    Short of giving Luke a long-lost child at the 11th hour, I'm not sure what they could've done. Luke himself was dead, Leia couldn't be kept alive for obvious reasons, and Kylo/Ben was... a mass murder. The Reylos wanted him to live, but if he had, there's no way he could 've just walked free like nothing happened. He would either be executed or put in a maximum security prison for life.
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2020
    Mostly Handless and 2Cleva like this.
  13. 2Cleva

    2Cleva Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 28, 2002
    I meant the plan from the start or after TFA. Damage was done post-subversion.
     
  14. indydefense

    indydefense Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 2, 2019
    TFA shows Rey being left with Unkar Plutt. I can't imagine Luke doing something like that. If Rey were his daughter, he would've found her a good home like Obi-Wan had for him. I honestly get the feeling that JJ wanted Rey to be a creation of Snoke, but after TLJ happened, he decided to switch Palpatine for Snoke.
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2020
    Mostly Handless likes this.
  15. 2Cleva

    2Cleva Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 28, 2002
    That could have been explained the same way it was in TROS. Rey's parents didn't leave her.

    I don't get that feeling at all about Snoke especially since Snoke didn't know who she was and the indicators from everyone else but its water under the bridge now.
     
  16. The Regular Mustache

    The Regular Mustache Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 22, 2015
    I don' think they need to set the films far in the past to get away from all that but I agree that it's time to retire the old vehicles, ships, stormtrooers, etc...One of things that made the OT special was that we hand't seen anything exactly like that before. Bringing out the same ships, vehicles, Empire, etc...is an exercise in diminishing returns.
     
  17. Oissan

    Oissan Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 9, 2001
    Not sure what there is to disagree with. These things are based on facts. Star Wars was not the clear cut top dog of all franchises back during the prequels, as evidenced by actual numbers. This didn't change. Your feelings on the matter - or mine for that matter - isn't relevant at all when dealing with that. There are things you can have an opinion about, and there are things that are based strictly on facts, this is a case of the latter. The data clearly shows that there is no change in that regard between the PT and the ST. Acting as if there was some sort of status the prequels held that didn't exist with the sequels anymore just doesn't line up with the evidence.
     
    Jedi Knight Fett likes this.
  18. DARTH_BELO

    DARTH_BELO Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2003
    What facts and data are you referring to?

    If I recall correctly (it was 20 years ago afterall :p), the PT films were the highest grossing films of each of their respective years. The same can't be said now. And at the time, Star Wars merchandise especially was at an all-time high in terms of profit IIRC. Definitely more than what we're witnessing now with the ST merch. But there's more to consider than just those items. But I'm not simply talking about dollars earned. I'm also talking about the general presence of SW and influence it has among the general public. As far as I have seen during the days of the ST, there just isn't that "enthusiasm" for SW among specifically the general public as there had been in years past-before the release of ROTS...

    Anyway, regardless of all that...All I'm really trying to say is that enthusiasm for SW is not going to last forever, and I believe we are now witnessing the beginning of this decline. I'm sure it will be gradual, over the course of many years probably...but no matter which way one tries to spin it, no franchise lasts forever. Such is the nature of the entertainment industry. I mean, I'm sure I will be a hardcore SW fan for my entire life-but even I won't live forever! :cool:
     
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2020
    DarthFixxxer likes this.
  19. DarthPhilosopher

    DarthPhilosopher Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jan 23, 2011
    People have been making these predictions at various points throughout the franchises history: they said it before the birth of the EU, they said it after the end of the PT, and of course people are saying that now. If the history of this franchise has told us anything, it's that well made stories in this universe will sell. We literally have the incredibly popular TM and high anticipation for the Obi-Wan series right now.
     
    Darth Nave likes this.
  20. jedijax

    jedijax Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    May 2, 2013
    They may decide to stray away from big screen SW for a LONG time simply because of one major factor: it has brought a lot of negativity to the property. Much of it has been unwarranted, but for the past 3 years there has been a HUGE negative online presence. TV-not so much. So they may stay there in order to rebuild positivity.
     
  21. The Chalk Jedi

    The Chalk Jedi Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 8, 2019
    I'm looking forward to LFL doing something bigger than Luke Skywalker, Leia, Darth Vader, and Han Solo. I just don't think it's possible with their generic approach to the general audience, which the GA does not care about, imo.

    By looking forward, I mean I'm skeptical of the films ever coming close to the OT's success.

    The TV shows have a better chance, since they care about storytelling and character.
     
  22. Aximili86

    Aximili86 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2018
    Yeah, the guy pointing out that Star Wars wasn't so much the prime hot-**** anymore with the prequels is on the money.

    Obviously people were still going to see them in droves, but The Matrix & Lord Of The Rings seemed to be the big cultural deal at the time. Not being the only big-dog on the block anymore isn't anything new for the series/company.
     
    Mostly Handless and indydefense like this.
  23. The Regular Mustache

    The Regular Mustache Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 22, 2015
    Where does the IP go from here? Somewhere safe and conservative is my guess.
     
    The Chalk Jedi likes this.
  24. IlhamKamaruddin

    IlhamKamaruddin Jedi Master star 2

    Registered:
    Nov 29, 2017
    I thought more of the contrary. The reason why I am so fascinated Rian Johnson's trilogy is the prospect of exploring somewhere completely new. A new time era, a new corner of the Galaxy, new characters.

    What is Star Wars without all the iconography we know of right now? That's the biggest question that needs to be answered.
     
    TK-2814 and indydefense like this.
  25. The Regular Mustache

    The Regular Mustache Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 22, 2015
    I definitely welcome a break from the OT iconography that the ST basically recycled and look forward to seeing what that world looks like but I won't be shocked if the narrative boils down to "a small band of good guys faces overwhelming odds and a Sith type big bad who threaten the fate of the galaxy, plus there's one Jedi who will save the day."
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.