Saga Why is Vader still impressed with power of Dark Side if Padme wasn't saved?

I thought she smelled bad...on the outside!

But seriously I think it’s the problem of saying that means justify the end. In those cases, people often become so enraptured with the means that they forget what the ends ever was.

 

this thread is amazing, i love nerds. so many gems in this one.

-T

 

He views Padme's death as the fault of others (ObiWan, Padme herself), the dark side did help someone cheat death...himself!! He was scorched and there's no way he should have survived.

 

Long ago on an internet far, far away it was my opinion that in the as-yet unfilmed prequel era, Darth vader would seal his turn to the dark side by killing his wife. The movie makes it more complicated. It is clear if you watch episode 3 that Anakin believes Palpatine about the Jedi plot, that they are trying to take over, that this is bad and that Palpatine represents the republic. He also believes (almost certainly correctly) that the Jedi withheld information about the Force from him. In my opinon the thing about saving Padme was the tipping point but it also served as an excuse. Anakin was frustrated that the Jedi were not fostering his desire to become as powerful as he could imagine.

A point I wonder about is this. Did the Jedi ever tell Anakin that he might be the prophesied chosen one? In the films I think the only direct suggestion of this is when Kenobi says to him on the verge of death, "You were the chosen one." Had the Jedi told him about all of this? What else didn't they tell him?

 

They never told him about the whereabouts of his mom and most importantly, Kister

 

… or dear little Greedo.

 

I don't know about that. His hate and his anger may have given him the determination to cling to this mortal coil a little bit longer, but I don't think it helped him cheat death. If it weren't for the technology sustaining his bodily functions at all times, he'd die. The only way he survives is by living a half-life, devoid of humanity.

What Anakin was looking for was the power to stop death in its tracks, permanently. He was looking for the power to conquer death. He didn't find that, because it doesn't really exist--at least not in the way he wanted it to.

 

I think it was said before, but I always believed that since he lost Padme, and their child plus turned against and wiped out most of the Jedi, the Dark Side and Palpatine was all he had left. Plus he believed the part of him that was still Anakin was gone for good.

 

I think he truly believed THE DARK SIDE, to be the most dominant power in the Force and Galaxy.

After Anakin lost to Obi-Wan, it was the Dark Side that kept him alive.

After physically losing most of himself, it was the Dark Side that made Vader 1 of the most powerful beings in the Galaxy.

He also knew how powerful Darth Sidious was, watching him gain everything, at the expense of everyone else

 

Even if it would seem difficult to buy what Palpatine is selling politically/ethically (and I agree with you on that), a couple of things:

Already a psychologically fragile sort, he’s now the child that’s both been told he’s done something terrible (killed Padme), AND outright done terrible things...surely self-defining himself as a horrible person that deserves nothing but the worst. You’re right, he’s not stupid, he still knows proper right and wrong, but he has to skew where he belongs within that reality now, to justify his existence. That’s his emotional justification.

His “logical” justification stems from now more or less living in the vacuum that is the empire’s internal machinations, where “peace and order” truly does exist (which, as others have noted, was always his goal). There are a lot of “peaceful” goings-on within the empire itself; creativity, jobs, people with lives and families that we don’t get to see, but are still there. As the empire is his new family, it is something worth defending.

In an odd way, I could almost see Anakin believing that carrying on, even as an icon of terror, would somehow assure him that his life wasn’t in vain, and as such, that becoming something so profound, would please his mother.

A perverse twisting of things, yes; but people lie to themselves all the time in order to be happy/content.

 

Imo because Vader wanted power he used the idea to save Padme to a excuse to join Palpatine well if you talk about movies only he always wanted to make the Galaxy better

 

In TPM Qui Gon did tell the council he is the chosen one, while Anakin was standing right in front of him. Other than that the only other time I recall it being said in front of him is on mustafar-after it was too late.

 

Anakin and Vader are almost two different personas. Vader seduced Anakin with the power of saving people from death. You think its Sidious but it was mostly Vader. After that point Vader took over and no one other than Luke could reach Anakin. As Vader said ''Anakin Skywalker was weak, and he destroyed him.''

 

1. He had nowhere else to go. He had committed unforgivable acts by Mustafar that had led to thousands of deaths. Palpatine may have shown his true colors as early as Mace Windu's death, but Vader couldn't exactly walk away.
2. Even if he was indifferent to the Sith ideology during the time of ROTS, the dark side is seductive. Over time, he would have genuinely come to believe in the Empire and the Sith, and enjoy the power of the dark side.

I feel as though the Star Destroyer shot at the end of ROTS symbolizes Vader's resignation to his fate as a Sith Lord and post-Padme life, and he has embraced this fully by the time of the OT.

 

I had written a few fanfiction stories about what would happen to Anakin if he had turned his back on the Sith during his duel against Obi-Wan on Mustafar.

I don't agree. Both Anakin and Vader were always one and the same. The change of one's moral compass does not mean the core of his or her personality changes. On that regard, Obi-Wan was wrong.

 

The thing is - this is actually the answer. Anakin is portrayed as a clueless dupe. Whether or not that was the intention is another topic, but that's how he comes off.

 

He made a mistake and doubled down on his existence.

 

Which information was this?

 

The dark side did give him power, even if it wasn't the power he was initially seeking.

 

It's possible that he thinks the problem isn't the Dark Side, but the person wielding it. Palpatine just didn't have the ability, or the desire, to use it to the full and truly stop death (beyond his own miserable existence). So, Vader figures that once someone is in charge with the proper ability to use the Dark Side (like, say, himself), then all will be made right. It's just a matter of waiting for the right time to bump off the old tyrant. And, with his son's help, the war will end, the galaxy will be at peace, and the real harnessing of the Dark Side's power will begin.
Doesn't quite work out that way, though...

 

If you're going by the new canon, in the comics Vader seemed impressed and fearful of the Emperor's power. I also think, Vader felt he had nowhere to go and was irredeemable after what he has done. He felt Palpatine was the only person he could turn to

 

The thing that’s always bothered me about Anakin’s turn is how abrupt it is. After Mace is thrown from the window, the first thing that Anakin does is express emotional distress and regret.

But then as Sidious starts telling him to become his apprentice and gives him the name Darth Vader, Anakin seems to become calm, almost hypnotized as his agrees with and thanks his new master.

When Palpatine tells Anakin his friend Obi-Wan is now a traitor and every Jedi is a traitor, Anakin is just all in.

In RotJ, Palpatine similar assures Luke that if he is struck down with hatred, Luke will fall. That was something I never quite understood. Palpatine is sitting there actively giving the order for the Death Star to fire on the fleet. Luke seems well within his right to cut Palpatine down, and yet it’s framed as a bad thing, with Luke constantly having to deactivate his lightsaber and refuse to fight.

Now in RoS, as problematic as that movie is, one thing it establishes is the notion that once Rey kills Palpatine in anger and pledges herself to the Sith, the Sith spirits will inhabit her body. And this will all happen, even if Rey is coerced into doing so in order to save her friends. He can twist her arm into relinquishing her soul, it need not be something Rey desires.

I don’t know if anything similar to that concept was in Lucas’ mind while writing Vader’s fall to the Dark Side, but at least in the new canon, it seems like to pledge oneself to the Sith is akin to selling your soul to the devil. Who Anakin was pre- and post pledge are fundamentally different as the Dark Side went to work instantly twisting his mind the moment he pledged himself to Sidious.

So Anakin May have pledged his loyalty in desperation just to save Padme’s life, but the moment he did so his mind started to twist and he was no longer the same person.

Anakin can slaughter Tuskens and yet not fall. Realizing it was wrong. He can behead a defenseless Dooku, yet not fall. Again, realizing it was wrong. He can betray Mace and instantly express regret. But then once he pledged himself, there’s no going back and now he’s killing kids and his old comrades and choking Padme.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I think Vader was impressed by the dark side’s power, how it played him, how it flowed from his Master’s finger tips via Force Lightning, and how it taught him sacrifice is its nature, you cannot hold tight to anyone or thing, not your family, your limbs, or anything. This is intriguing because Anakin’s nature was to hold on to people, and try stop them from dying. The dark side taught Anakin holding in is futile, and trust is fragile.

 

He was forced to the Dark Side by Palpatine. And he became to strong in the Dark Side than he was in the Light Side. This may be reason that he was still impressed in the Dark Side.

 

In the Disney era comics they do Estonia is possible to bring someone back from the dead as Darth Vader is tricked by the spirit of an ancient Sith named Momin to resurrect him (after which Vader kills him again). So at the very least Vader has seen that the Dark Side can return those long dead to life, he was just tricked into resurrecting Momin instead of Padme.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk