PT Why some people hate "Padme dying of Sadness" ?

OK, a fair point about ObiWan raising Anakin. But hes not his biological father and thats also a factor. The subconscious bond between parent and child is probably stronger than something adoptive or like a Padawan would be. At least in my opinion. Padme didnt "wilt". Although the explanation given by that droid does leave a lot of questions her character was strong throughout the entire trilogy. But, feel as you wish.

Star Wars is the last film saga Id bring up if I was discussing "weak" women. Not even close.

 

Call it what you will. I will certainly no longer participate in this pointless "is SW sexist?" debate. Frankly, I simply couldn't care less. Had some laughs, but I guess I'm out of this thread.

 

Padme's death is a serious case of unfortunate implications.

All the male characters endure their intense grief and betrayal without losing their will to live. The only female character is the one who loses her will to live.

- Obi-Wan is forced to battle, maim and leave for death the brother that he basically raised since the latter was a child. He witnessed that self-same brother murder children, try to murder his pregnant wife and bring about the death of the Jedi Order. He is forced to go into hiding. Obi-Wan does not lose the will to live.

- Yoda loses the only life that he has ever known, he senses the death of every member of that Order attacked during Order 66, and has to exile himself to a lonely and isolated swamp planet. Yoda does not lose the will to live.

- Padme loses her husband who has turned into a monster and who attacks her when she refuses him. Nonetheless, she still believes there is hope for him and she gives birth to two healthy children that she clearly loves. Padme loses the will to live.

Padme, who has the most to live for out of the three, is the one who loses the will to live.

They could have mitigated the issue by saying that injuries caused by Anakin coupled with the difficulty of early labor and childbirth was too much for her body. Also, maybe, they don't have the time to get her to a proper facility that could have stabilized her condition.

I didn't mention Padme losing the Republic because Padme was already aware that the Republic was falling. She has a great line about it in the second film: "So this is how liberty dies... with a thunderous applause."

 

Yes - as other posts have brought up some of the same items, they do have some merit. I still cannot buy the sexism had anything to do with this. It can and apparently has been interpreted that way which is fine. Everyone has a "take". Her death does remain elusive as to what really happened. The droids explanation is a little iffy for sure. I detailed autopsy would have been great here, right? . But sans that, we have to go with that it was just too overwhelming for her. Believe me I wish there was more there and you correctly point out that they could have mitigated some of it with better reasons. But, Im good with it as it is. It breaks my heart but it works.

Her character remains pivotal to the prequels & she always behaved in a strong, intelligent manner. Never a damsel-in-distress, IMO.

 

I think there's a difference between the jedi's loss and Padme's: Jedi already have the perception of non attachment.

 

That’s a good point. I still think more information about her death could have helped this entire situation. However, as sad as it is I am fine with it. Even just a mention about the stress of the early childbirth, as the other quoted poster mentions would have helped. Just a line or two extra and we aren’t having this discussion.

 

Its fair to say Padme's death was meant to be a fairy tale death. and i have never really had an issue with it because i always kinda seen it as Lucas being inspired by old fairy tales.

 

I think its kinda like the Padme's Ruminations scene. I don't question how Padme, a non-Force sensitive, can sense Anakin from miles away, because I get the metaphor that their love is strong enough that they can feel each other's presence. I forget if it was a novel, but I remember hearing that Padme gained Force sensitivity because of being pregnant with Luke and Leia, but that always felt like an overtly EU-like justification that I didn't really need.

I'm ok with the ambiguity of Padme's death, and while I don't like the "she died of a broken heart" explanation, I think the film gives enough leeway to argue it is much more complicated than the medical droid's diagnosis.

 

Yes, your last sentence sums it up nicely. There is enough leeway and it’s possibly implied that she didn’t die literally of a broken heart but rather many factors.

 

You can actually die of broken heart IRL, even though it is very rare.

"Broken heart syndrome, also called stress-induced cardiomyopathy or takotsubo cardiomyopathy, can strike even if you’re healthy. Women are more likely than men to experience the sudden, intense chest pain — the reaction to a surge of stress hormones — that can be caused by an emotionally stressful event. It could be the death of a loved one or even a divorce, breakup or physical separation, betrayal or romantic rejection."

https://www.heart.org/en/health-top...pathy-in-adults/is-broken-heart-syndrome-real

 

And there it is. Stress and what you posted very well could have played a role in Padmes death. Again, the film was a little too quick with that droids explanation but I still find no issues with it outside of that. Her death was tragic and I’m OK with it even though it crushes me every time I watch ROTS!

 

I like this idea. It's the sort of thing I'd see in a fantasy story.

Star Wars is literally a story about space wizards, lol.

 

I don't "hate" the way Padme's death plays out, but I agree with the general criticism that it's sexist. As presented, I think it assumes that "princess" frameworks are in play, that her love for her man was the most important thing in her life and she can't live without it. It's one of the few instances in the PT where I think Lucas got lazy with the writing, and his usually careful use of ambiguity doesn't quite work.

In my head canon, she died because the dark side somehow poisoned her, not because she "chose" to die or "gave up". It would have been very interesting to see her live on, but her death is appropriate for cementing the tragic narrative imo, because it means there's nothing left for Anakin to hold on to, he's lost everything.

 

Ill say, in comparison to Leia's death, there is at least a pinpoint in Padme's: Vader's Force choke on Mustafar. For Leia, it's just that she decides to die at that specific moment and the movie does an even worse job of explaining.

Then again, Leia really is BARELY a character in the ST, so maybe I just found her whole death to kinda fall flatter in the context of the sequel trilogy compared to Padme (who I'd argue was a more developed character than Leia in both the OT and ST).

 

Ya know, as much as I love Leia, you do make some valid points here. Out of the main three OT characters she has the least "arc" of the group and her limited use in the sequels does add to this problem. Of course, Carries tragic death didn’t help and I thought I did read that originally she was going to be more a part of the sequels in early scripts. Yet another missed opportunity for the sequels. Meh.

Padme was a more developed overall character. I’d agree with that. Leia was tough as nails and that toughness was refreshing. But she was sort of one note. I also don’t care for how Leias only real force use is that Mary Poppins stuff in Last Jedi.

 

It'd have been better IMO if they hadn't had the line "medically she's COMPLETELY healthy" Imply that a broken heart may have played a role but that she also died from the complications of birthing two force sensitive babies.

 

Honestly, I think it would have been a better decision to let her live, but dye later in the original trilogy. Luke and Leia would have to deal with the same thing Anakin dealt with, Luke would stay on the light side.

 

You're leaving out Anakin. Anakin loses his will to live.

Lucas wanted to make it clear that she died specifically because she was heartbroken. He says that's what happened in the new Archives book. That's why he put that line there. Because he didn't want us to think it was for any other reason.

It has to be because of Anakin--and it has to be because he destroyed everything she believed in, for her, and then, after all of it, decided he actually cared more about his own power than her life. So all this slaughter, all this destruction, it was all done out of love for her, and then very love was slaughtered and thrown onto the pile like everything else, like it never even mattered. That's an inconceivably nightmarish reality to be confronted with.

 

Anakin doesn't die and it's debatable if he's lost the will to live considering that he goes on to live a life as an active agent of the Empire with his own ambitions for the future that include schemes to overthrow the Emperor and take his place. That's generally not the behavior of someone who has lost the will to live.

But you are right that I forgot about Anakin. He does belong on the list as an example.

All the male characters endure their intense grief and betrayal without losing their will to live. The only female character is the one who loses her will to live.

- Obi-Wan is forced to battle, maim and leave for death the brother that he basically raised since the latter was a child. He witnessed that self-same brother murder children, try to murder his pregnant wife and bring about the death of the Jedi Order. He is forced to go into hiding. Obi-Wan does not lose the will to live.

- Yoda loses the only life that he has ever known, he senses the death of every member of that Order attacked during Order 66, and has to exile himself to a lonely and isolated swamp planet. Yoda does not lose the will to live.

- Anakin thinks he's murdered his pregnant wife and is overcome by grief. He has no family or friends left. He has lost all his limbs and is so severely burnt that he cannot live without the aid of an artificial respiration system. Anakin does not lose the will to live.

- Padme loses her husband who has turned into a monster and who attacks her when she refuses him. Nonetheless, she still believes there is hope for him and she gives birth to two healthy children that she clearly loves. Padme loses the will to live.

Padme, who has the most to live for out of the three, is the one who loses the will to live.

 

^ And don't forget Bail, who watched the system he so faithfully serve fall and be perverted to the point where it's no longer recognizable. He now gets to enjoy going to work in an Imperial senate that answers to an emperor. And everywhere he looks, he sees stark reminders of what once was. Yet he somehow managed to not shoot himself in the head with a blaster.

So why do they get to live despite their traumas, but Padme dies?