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Discussion Will fan backlash affect development of IX?

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Episode IX - Spoilers Allowed' started by BalanceOfTheForce, Dec 18, 2017.

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  1. AndrewPascoe

    AndrewPascoe Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 26, 2014
    They’re talking about kids. That’s generally where you get new fans from. It’s possibly anecdotal but I’d say a large portion of prequel fans grew up around their release. I did, it’s part of the reason why I love Jar Jar.

    So it’s entirely possible that the ST is picking up a ton of new fans in kids whose first Star Wars movies are these ST films. Kids who can’t buy tickets themselves but saw the movie with their family.
     
  2. vaderito

    vaderito Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 5, 2016
    Franchises whose first movie (well, first of Nu SW) makes 2B worldwide don't acquire new fans with sequels and spin-offs. They max out and lose some of that audience because people who turned up the first time figured out it wasn't for them. What's happened to TLJ and RO to a degree is audience reverting to their usual habits. SW has always been strong in traditional markets and TLJ retained that audience. SW has never been strong in new markets and they simply didn't show up for both RO and TLJ after turning up for TFA due to hype, to test if it was for them. It wasn't.

    Likewise, big part of TFA domestic boxoffice were people who usually don't watch SW. They didn't come back. That TLJ was going to drop was expected. We can only argue whether this drop is within studio expectations or below, but TLJ was never going to match or exceed TFA and neither will any other SW movie including IX.

    There's no denying that TLJ was not as liked as previous 2 movies, if we go by the internal muliplier, but no movie ever had an identical market situation to another to compare them one to one. So what factors in the movie itself and among competition led to that is something we will never know for sure. We are not the studio to have exact data.

    Finally, for everyone who's trying to pin the boxoffice drop on one actor or the other. As mentioned in another post by another poster, anecdotal evidence always works that whoever tells the anecdote miraculously runs into people who support their POV. So those who like the movie or actor don't know anyone who doesn't and those who don't like a movie or actor don't know anyone who does. I'm not surprised which posters are pushing for Actor A Responsible For Boxoffice Drop in this thread cause I know their preferences and actor A and character he plays are not among their favorites while their fave got the short end of the stick in this movie. Pure sour grapes. But like all spite/agenda theorizing, that doesn't make it a fact as we know from previous 2 years that ended up with many fans being wrong and now pushing for retcons and/or minimizing actors/characters who walked away with the most acclaim by critics and audience reviews alike (except, of course, the magic anecdotes). That's not how business works.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2018
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  3. Darth_Pevra

    Darth_Pevra Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    May 21, 2008
    Lol I'm not shallow enough to care about Kylo's looks personally - but you can bet that it makes a difference in ticket sales. Why do you think the guys on the covers of romance novels look the way they do? Marketers and publishers or romance novels know exactly what they're doing.

    I've been in the book business and I know a little about how it works. Kylo doesn't really fit into the template.

    I don't think the rules in film are all that different.

    If the goal was to get the attention of teenage girls who are into romance, the attempt was rather weak.

    So you heard from someone who heard something.

    A Leo type in TLJ would have certainly boosted ticket sales.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2018
  4. oncafar

    oncafar Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2017
    Okay wait. The problem with TLJ is that Kylo is not hot enough?

    (Thank goodness the character doesn't look like a piece of plastic off a romance novel cover!)

    Wait, was Anakin piece-of-plastic enough? Or was he too "not hot enough"?

    Are teenage girls only into men who are piece-of-plastic-hot-enough?

    Is Leonardo DiCaprio that? Here I thought only some girls thought he was hot.

    This is all so confusing.

    Maybe where TLJ really truly failed was that JB and OI didn't ALSO have shirtless scenes. If we had three guys to choose from then we could really make these purely hormonal decisions in whether to watch the movie again. It was bad form to only have one man take off his shirt.

    *looks forward to Ep. IX: The Parade of Hunks* (when LFL finally realizes how to stop the "box office decline" in its tracks)
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2018
  5. IncessantRamblings

    IncessantRamblings Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2016
    Did they release a complimentary deodorant??
     
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  6. Birkendoc

    Birkendoc Co-Purveyor of ST Trivia star 4 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Sep 20, 2001
    It’s one of those weird Old Spice scents.
     
  7. Roosterq

    Roosterq Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Feb 6, 2017
    Fan "backlash" will always have an effect on movies set in a trilogy or more, but I don't expect this to have any more effect that any other movie has had in the past. They have decided the direction they want to go in, but they may tweek the script a bit to not hurt the bottom line.
     
  8. A Chorus of Disapproval

    A Chorus of Disapproval New Films Fearless Vampire Killer star 8 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2003
    His chest was glistening and reflecting light to the point of resembling a Ken doll.
     
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  9. oncafar

    oncafar Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2017
    I personally thought it had a sort of slimy look and it reminded me of Rey calling him a snake.

    But yes they tried to make his chest look super impressive. But the overall look isn't a "Ken doll."

    My point stands though, that clearly JB and OI needed to be shirtless too.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2018
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  10. A Chorus of Disapproval

    A Chorus of Disapproval New Films Fearless Vampire Killer star 8 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2003
    Fine, not Ken. GI Joe or anyone else with a shiny plastic chest.
     
  11. oncafar

    oncafar Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2017
    Anyway, if Kylo is actually the perfect plastic representative from romance novel covers, then he wasn't really the problem with TLJ for teenage girls that only watch movies for male character looks. They would have all been super attracted to him because teenage girls all have the same tastes for attraction (according to this idea).
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2018
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  12. Birkendoc

    Birkendoc Co-Purveyor of ST Trivia star 4 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Sep 20, 2001
    What are we blaming a $1B box office grab on now—Driver is too hot, too ugly.

    As this is turning into a Blame Driver thread, I’ll contribute.

    Curse you Adam Driver, it’s your fault the stock market dipped 1100 points since Thursday!
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2018
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  13. MasterPrince713

    MasterPrince713 Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Sep 13, 2017
    Technically Finn was in that bacta-suit without a shirt, so....Yeah...
     
  14. oncafar

    oncafar Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2017
    I'm just kind of bummed that my own standards of attraction aren't reflected by this thread. I didn't find LC in Titanic hot. It came out when I was a teenager. And I didn't even watch it in theater. Perhaps I just was not the right kind of teenage girl. I also didn't really focus much on who was hot or not. I even feel uncomfortable using the word to describe people in any serious way.

    Yeah, but the suit was covering his chest and water was spurting everywhere and people have complained about it being a comic relief scene in this undignified way. Like he needed to tear that suit from him before he wandered the halls. It was a missed opportunity.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2018
  15. vaderito

    vaderito Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 5, 2016
    Did someone say Kylo Ken? [face_love]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    He's ripped when you take off his clothes, like Ken should be. I have the top Rey and Kylo Ken and Barbie set. [face_party]
     
  16. oncafar

    oncafar Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 10, 2017
    I think FOD Rey looks like Barbie. The rest of them aren't Mattel enough. (Although I'm out of the loop with Mattel. Perhaps they have been diversifying features on dolls more.)
     
  17. Nipuhanipera

    Nipuhanipera Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    May 25, 2014
    Probably. They release all kinds of merchandise.
     
    IncessantRamblings likes this.
  18. vaderito

    vaderito Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 5, 2016
    I guess they don't have problem with Adam afer all or maybe it's all Daisy appeal? Teen girls have spoken (or whoever rules Tumblr) - Reylo is the top ship for 8 straight weeks:

    Fandometrics - Ships

    Week Ending February 5th, 2018

    1. Reylo
      Rey & Kylo Ren, the Star Wars universe

    2. Klance
      Keith & Lance, Voltron: Legendary Defender
    3. Phan +1
      Daniel Howell & Phil Lester, YouTubers
    4. Jikook −1
      Park Jimin & Jeon Jungkook, BTS
    5. Bughead +3
      Betty Cooper & Jughead Jones, Riverdale
    6. Supercorp −1
      Kara Danvers & Lena Luthor, Supergirl
    7. Destiel +4
      Dean Winchester & Castiel, Supernatural
    8. Sheith +4
      Keith & Shiro, Voltron: Legendary Defender
    9. McHanzo −3
      Jesse McCree & Hanzo Shimada, Overwatch
    10. Taekook +4
      Kim Taehyung & Jeon Jungkook, BTS
    11. Reddie −4
      Richie Tozier & Eddie Kaspbrak, It
    12. Yoonmin −3
      Min Yoongi & Park Jimin, BTS
    13. Malec
      Magnus Bane & Alec Lightwood, Shadowhunters
    14. Kylux −4
      Kylo Ren & General Hux, the Star Wars universe
    15. Victuuri +3
      Victor Nikiforov & Yuri Katsuki, Yuri!!! on Ice
    16. Drarry +1
      Draco Malfoy & Harry Potter, the Harry Potter universe
    17. Camren −1
      Camila Cabello & Lauren Jauregui, Fifth Harmony
    18. Sprousehart +1
      Lili Reinhart & Cole Sprouse, actors
    19. Tododeku −4
      Todoroki Shouto & Midoriya Izuku, Boku No Hero Academia
    20. Yoonseok
      Min Yoongi & Jung Hoseok, BTS
     
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  19. BalanceOfTheForce

    BalanceOfTheForce Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Dec 18, 2016
    Kylo Ken
     
  20. bluealien1

    bluealien1 Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Aug 14, 2015
    hey supercorp nearly made it in to the top five......[face_whistling].....don't look at me like that.
     
  21. vaderito

    vaderito Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 5, 2016
    It was in Top 5 the previous week (-1 means one spot down from last week).
     
  22. Strongbow

    Strongbow Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2014
    I'm perfectly happy to lose "fans" like that. Driver is perfect for Kylo, imo. The point of that character is not his looks... and I personally deplore any move in that direction. I think one reason Lucas picked HC for Anakin was his pretty boy looks, and that was a mistake, imo.
     
  23. Oissan

    Oissan Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 9, 2001
    I'd say if it is wrong for someone to think that Driver isn't a good fit for Kylo Ren, then it is equally wrong to just assume that Hayden Christensen was choosen because of his looks, when there is no proof for that whatsoever. Baseless speculation doesn't really have a spot in any argument like this.

    Not that I disagree with your general point about Kylo Ren and Adam Driver ;)
     
    wobbits likes this.
  24. Blastaar

    Blastaar Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 25, 2015

    JB already had a "diapers" scene, so he's covered. Who's gonna get the slave suit bikini for the last one?



    I never got the impression that they were trying to hide the fact that they wanted to cast a "heart throb" type for the role of anakin. I'm not saying hayden was chosen just for his looks, but they def played a role in him getting the part. Wasn't leo dicaprio also briefly considered?
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2018
  25. Oissan

    Oissan Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 9, 2001
    There were rumours about him, yes. Another actor that got mentioned was Ryan Philippe.
    So yes, some sort of attractiveness might have played a part for the general direction they went it, but one can't really claim that Hayden Christensen was chosen for his looks, when all the other candidates had similar looks as well. Having suitable looks may put you onto the list of candidates, but it doesn't really get you the role when competing with actors who are also on that list.
     
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