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PT "You have brought hope to those who have none!" = whom?

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by BigAl6ft6, Jun 28, 2018.

?

who has anakin brought hope to?

  1. slaves!

    32 vote(s)
    84.2%
  2. Humans who wanna be pod racers!

    2 vote(s)
    5.3%
  3. Mos Espa folk!

    2 vote(s)
    5.3%
  4. Kitster!

    2 vote(s)
    5.3%
  1. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    If she was specifically talking about Qui-gon and Padme, her statement would be about them. Something like, "Now you'll be able to help our new friends repair their ship." Thus it is about the people and not just one or two in particular.
     
  2. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    It was about them. Shmi and Anakin were informed of their predicament and helplessness and she allowed Anakin to help them. Anakin raced in order to help them. By winning, he did help them. Therefore, he brought hope to those who had none (Qui-Gon, Padmé, Jar Jar and everyone else that they are responsible for). There's literally no other way to read that quote. Who else did Anakin brought hope to by winning the race? Nobody. We were not introduced to anyone who aspired to win a podrace, as far as I'm aware.

    That was not the point. The point was to win money for them to buy the parts they needed. Anyway, you can make up thousands of equivalent quotes. That doesn't deny the point and purpose of the original one as stated by Shmi.

    What people?
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2018
    Mindless Monster likes this.
  3. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Nov 12, 2012
    It probably makes the most sense that she's referring to Qui-Gon's merry band of stranded travelers but I could also see it as a reference to inspiring hope in slaves with his win by beating Sebulba. Although that isn't really established in the film that beating Sebulba would bring hope to anyone. Although could read between the line that Anakin did inspire someone pretty biggly

    Of record, someone watching Annie race was Weazel
    [​IMG]

    Who was a thief but after Annie's win he went on to be a freedom fighter

    [​IMG]

    With Enfy's Nest in an early proto-rebellion cell

    [​IMG]

    So maybe Annie did bring hope to someone, Weazel, who went on to fight a greater cause
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2018
  4. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    She's referring to the people of Mos Espa, the ones who cheered Anakin on during and after the race. His victory showed that anyone can win against a superior opponent. Sebulba always won according to both Anakin and Watto, but Anakin proved that Sebulba was not unbeatable. He gave them hope that they themselves can rise up and overcome the opposition in their lives.

    That's speculation that is what she was talking about. Not proof.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    These people. Everyone outside of Qui-gon and Padme.

    Right, that's the point. It was more about the little people, than the main characters. Otherwise, the dialogue would have directly referred to them. The Weazel story is but one example.
     
  5. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    Who said the people of Mos Espa (assuming all of those were from there) had a 'superior opponent'? Who said they were looking for a sense of "anyone can win against a superior opponent"? Who said the people who cheered for Anakin had no hope (of what)? You're going out of your way to make a bunch of baseless speculation to try justify something that already has a very clear cut answer in the movie.

    What opposition? Why are you merging everyone that supported Anakin into a collective with a common cause other than supporting Anakin?

    It's the logical conclusion based on established premises in the movie. Your speculation isn't.

    We know literally nothing about them. Who said they were hopeless? Hopeless about what? All we know is that they supported Anakin in the race and cheered for him at the end.
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2018
  6. Christus Regnet

    Christus Regnet Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Mar 10, 2016
    What sayeth the novelization?

    The same as the film, but after reading the passage in context, and considering the way Shmi talks, I now feel she was speaking of(and to)Qui Gonn and his gang. It was more than just Qui Gonn and the Queen, but everyone on the silver space yacht stranded during a desperate mission. It might sound weird out of context for her to say that about them(as opposed to Anakin's likely fame among other slave children), but when watching the movie or reading the book, it makes sense.
     
    BigAl6ft6 likes this.
  7. DARTHLINK

    DARTHLINK Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 24, 2005
    To be fair, I think the dialogue was meant to refer to the people who personally went into Shmi’s hovel and spent the night there. THOSE people. Sure, the crowd is clearly happy for Annie, but it could be for a lot of things. Maybe they’re just happy their guy won? We literally just don’t know — we never had a scene where the other kid (in the background behind Anakin and Qui-Gon) spilled out his life problems and had Anakin swear to win the match for his sake as well.

    To sum up:

    • Maybe they’re just happy their guy won? Anakin is no stranger to these events, so I’m sure a fair number of them decided to throw their lot in for that ‘plucky little kid’.

    • Maybe they’re just amazed this human child managed to win and wanted to congratulate him — even if he wasn’t the one they were rooting for? Hell, it’s what I would do.

    • Maybe some were inspired, as you suggested.

    At the end of the day, we just don’t know so assuming they were all doing it because of xyz is baseless. The movie makes it quite clear that this whole thing is so Qui-Gon and the others can get the parts they need to get off Tatooine and resume their mission. That’s it.
     
  8. Count Yubnub

    Count Yubnub Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 1, 2012
    Padme's response to the line, an agreeing "we owe you everything," doesn't make sense if the line doesn't refer to her.
     
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  9. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    What a "superior opponent" is living in the ass end of space, with almost nothing but hard times. Something that Luke first referred to about living on Tatooine in ANH. You've got Tusken Raiders to the right of you, Sarlaccs to the left of you and the government abandoned you a long time ago to the Hutts. That's about as miserable as you can get. Anakin brings hope by showing the people that they can fight the system and win. Maybe not all the time, but it can happen.

    I didn't. Lucas did by paint a picture of misery on Tatooine going back to the beginning.

    No, that is just an assumption that it is about them.

    Sure it does. If Shmi said nothing, Padme would still say that they owe him for winning the prize money that will pay for the new hyperdrive. The two statements are not dependent on each other.
     
    Mark Pierre likes this.
  10. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    Luke doesn't represent everyone that's on Tatooine. The fact that there's mysery on Tatooine doesn't make everything in it miserable. People are there for a variety of reasons, not necessarily miserable (even assuming that the majority of them are miserable, and that would still be an assumption).

    "Fight the system"?! Where are you getting that from? How is winning a podrace sponsored by the mafia, fighting the system? He's not fighting the system. That's being part of the system.

    Fighting the system, whatever that means, is not part of the equation. His selfless motivation and arrangement with Qui-Gon and the others is private, unknown to virtually everyone. Again, you're going out of your way to find some farfetched and baseless justification while needlessly ignoring what the movie builds upon and points towards so obviously (that Shmi's referring to Qui-Gon, Padmé and Jar Jar's party, as established in the previous scenes).

    Anakin raced to help a group of helpless people that he met. That's all. By winning, he brought hope to those people and those that depend on them.

    I'm seriously baffled that this is suddenly a point of contention.
     
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2018
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  11. teamhansolo

    teamhansolo Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 25, 2018
    I think what she meant is that he brought hope to other slaves, because now they knew that regardless of their slavery they could still be someone.
     
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  12. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    They are someone, slave or not. Anakin winning a podrace doesn't change nor reinforces that fact.
     
  13. ThisIsMe1138

    ThisIsMe1138 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jun 26, 2018
    Yes, it does. Slaves are hidden, in the background. Now, because of Anakin's win, he is recognized and has won his freedom. She didn't say that he'd changed anything for "those who have none", just that she'd given them hope, which Qui-Gon and Padme already had - it's clear that Qui-Gon hasn't lost hope. In my opinion, she'd saying that Anakin has inspired other slaves to be like him.
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2018
  14. heels1785

    heels1785 JCC Manager star 9 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 10, 2003
    Slaves are property. Dehumanization is at the core of the concept of slavery.

    A slave rising above his or her circumstances to achieve something so fantastic and highly visible brings hope not only to those he sought to help (Qui-Gon, Padme, and Jar-Jar), but also serves to indirectly inspire and bring hope to those who share his circumstances.

    I like to think that Shmi meant all of that.
     
  15. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    Says who? No, they are not necessarily "hidden, in the background". That was not the first time Anakin raced either.

    That's irrelevant to what was being discussed. That he happened to be free through his victory is a fact only known to Qui-Gon and Watto. Anakin didn't know that, let alone his supporters. He didn't race for that and his victory, for those not in the know, didn't change his condition as a slave. Had the bet never happened he would still be a slave.

    *sigh*

    What does that even mean, to "be like him"?! To race pods? To win?

    And no, only Qui-Gon (and Shmi) believed he could win. Still, believing in his victory is irrelevant to what Shmi was talking about, which is the group of people that came to her house in a desperate and hopeless situation, and that Anakin chose to help. That's whom she's referring to. Since Anakin won, he brought hope to those who had none. Only after he won did their situation cease to be hopeless, not before. We don't know about the hope or lack thereof of anybody else, let alone that said hope changed because Anakin won a podrace...
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2018
  16. ThisIsMe1138

    ThisIsMe1138 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jun 26, 2018
    Okay, I recognize you have a point. Like I said, it's just my opinion .This is a discussion, not an anybody is right and anybody is wrong. Honestly, none of us know for sure .
     
  17. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett PT Interview Host/All-Around Good Guy star 10 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2014
    Kitster was the one who said that not Anakin.
     
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  18. Christus Regnet

    Christus Regnet Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Mar 10, 2016
    Anakin Spartacus!!!
     
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  19. DARTHLINK

    DARTHLINK Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 24, 2005
    Not to belabor the point here....

    We honestly just don’t know what anyone else thought of this, or why they’re even there. Shmi’s line was meant for the people who literally spent the night in her hovel and spent the previous dinner with her discussing just how boned they are (Qui-Gon told them they were on a top secret mission, but their ship malfunctioned so they’re stranded on Tatooine until they can find the money to get new parts/new parts at all.)

    It’s not that much of a stretch to assume Qui-Gon and the others is what she meant. I thought the film made that pretty clear. Whether this event inspired anyone else to race against Sebulba is irrelevant.
     
  20. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    Precisely. Though it isn't just slaves, but for a lot of people. The reason some don't get it, is because they focuses on the main characters and not the whole of the planet. Bringing hope to those who have none is hope to everyone. One person's actions can affect the whole. Anakin does something positive and it inspires in others to try and do better, which we see with Weazel. He wasn't a slave, but he goes on to do something better with his life twenty years later. Very easy to say he was inspired by Anakin's victory. We see it again following the Battles of Scarif and Yavin 4, where hope is brought to the galaxy by the victories achieved. We see a wider view of it when the news of the victory at Endor spreads across the galaxy.

    Which has nothing to do with Anakin winning the race and inspiring others to look to their lives and have hope where they didn't before.

    I'm baffled that you cannot understand the symbolism.
     
  21. teamhansolo

    teamhansolo Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 25, 2018
    I didn't even know he was supposed to be the same character. That's actually pretty cool.
     
  22. Emperor Ferus

    Emperor Ferus Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 29, 2016
    Even though it may not be shown outright, I like this theory.

    Anakin was a symbol of hope during the Clone Wars as well to many people. Could have started even earlier.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2020
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  23. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    Except for the fact that per the movie, it's clearly referring to those he decided to help: Qui-Gon, Padmé and company. Those are who he actually helped by winning the race, and those are the ones he raced for to begin with. The ones Shmi is aware of and referring to.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2020
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  24. Panakas_Dawg

    Panakas_Dawg Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 29, 2004
    In a general sense, also, it could mean all the backwater losers and malcontents on Tattooine.
     
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  25. DBPirate

    DBPirate Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 20, 2015
    That's what I've always taken it to mean. Kind of a random line to analyze I think though.