Lit Zahn's post-TTT novels

Hi all

I wanted to get your feedback and thoughts on Zahn's post-TTT novels (Hand of Thrawn and onwards) and especially -

1. What is your favorite Zahn novel out of these? How does it compare to the original Tharwn Trilogy?

2. What is your *least* favorite novel out of these, and why?

3. Do you think one can read each "series" (Hand of Thrawn, Survivor's Quest/Outbound Flight, Allegiance / Choices of One) without the previous Zahn stories?

4. Can one jump straight from the Tharwn Trilogy to Hand of Thrawn, skipping over the other EU stories? Is anything lost from the overall experience?

thanks!

 

You're missing Scoundrels. As to your Qs:

Yes, but it's better to go by publication order.

Not really, though be aware that Zahn became quite caustic towards the stories that happened in-between, so be wary in how he presents those.

Books that picked up pieces from HoT after it came out were I, Jedi and X-Wing 8 and 9.

 

Thanks Jedi Ben!
Regarding Scoundrels, it's the one Zahn SW novel I haven't read yet. but AFAIK it's basically a standalone story, while all the other Zahn novels post-TTT are duologies (even Thrawn will be part of *at last* a duology) connected in some way, shape or form to Thrawn himself.

 

Yep, it is.

 

I love Hand of Thrawn. It has its flaws, particularly regarding Zahn's unwillingness to present a galaxy that's at all changed over the course of ten years, but it's also a cracker of a romp that closes out the Bantam/New Republic era in style.

Least favourite is Choices of One. It's not just a bad Zahn novel, it's a flat-out awful novel. Its predecessor, Allegiance, is... a book? That's about all I can say for it. It... happened. It was okay.

I enjoyed Outbound Flight a lot more than I expected to. Especially Obi-Wan and Anakin's role in it.

He has a book in the new EU, too --- Thrawn. Came out earlier this year. I thought it was crap. Others here seem to like it.

 

Outbound Flight is the best one. By far. Because it actually shows Thrawn's genius in a believable fashion. None of that art nonsense that was nothing more than a gimmick. The Thrawn in Outbound Flight pays careful attention to everything that he learns and uses that intel to plan incredible ambushes. The final battle at the end of the book is a masterpiece of strategy, and it's completely believable. Zahn also portrays Darth Sidious in a very chilling way. Much, much better than his cameo depictions of Emperor Palpatine in other books.

 

In order of liking

Hand of Thrawn -- great multiple POVs and characterizations. Shows the marvelous L/M teamwork.
Survivor's Quest -- fascinating mission where Luke and Mara shine and ties back to Outbound Flight, which was also a terrific read.
The new Thrawn book was incredibly intriguing, showing his progression as a tactical heavyweight.

 

Outbound Flight and Survivors Quest were my two personal favorites. HoT of course was really good too, and I thought Scoundrels was a really fun read as well.

Allegiance and CoO are... readable I guess... there is some moderately interesting concepts that kind get overshadowed by a bunch of over the top fawning over pet characters at the expense of everyone else.

The Nu cannon Thrawn book isn't bad, reads more like a collection of short Thrawn exploits than anything else. Governor Pryce from Rebels features prominently and to be honest her chapters are probably the best parts of the book.

 

I like pretty much everything Zahn's done. Allegiance and Choices of One are some of my favorite OT-era Legends books. Guess this board's full of Mara haters.

 

1: Outbound Flight, it’s my favourite Zahn Starwars book period. He writes Thrawn in a sympathetic light, while also making it believable that he would turn into the Ruthless Warlord of the TTT. All this while showing Thrawn be brilliantly clever without fawning over him like he did in HoT or Choices
2: Alliegence, The book is boring with a plot about Pirates leading to more pirates. While the OC love with Mara constantly humiliating and even defeating Vader, whose shown to be jealous of her is very hard to take
3: You can but if you read his Tales from the Empire Side Trip 2 parter Story he did with Stackpole, you’d need to read the Xwing novels to know who Corran or Zekka Thyne are.
4: Yes and no, Yes because he makes it feel like a 1 year gap rather than a 10 year gap and characters seem to have a reset button (ie Wedge is back as a Fighter Pilot etc) so for the story you will be fine but your not gonna know what he’s talking about when talks (and takes shots) at the Dark Empire and Jedi Academy stories that he does in the book but that’s the only thing. Everything else would be ok

I completely agree with this. I’d also add that the best bits in the Survivors Quest Novel are when Mara is reflecting and dealing with the fact she served the Empire. None of this she only went after bad people nonsense.
Basically when you take out the OC love that Zahn has for his characters, which really shows in his writing (particularly in regards to Vader) he’s fine.

 

I think Outbound Flight is his best, most entertaining, most competently written Star Wars work, by a wide margin. Vialco's commentary on it is dead on, plus Zahn took C'baoth's trolling to hilarious heights. If you've read TTT, you can read Outbound Flight. Survivor's Quest is okay, and again, if you've read TTT, you can read SQ.

Not a fan of Hand of Thrawn, I don't think it does much of anything well. Disra, Flim and Tierce's storyline is pretty awful, to the point of being an unintentional self-insult.

Spoilers just in case?

Spoiler

Luke and Mara are completely inorganic, especially in HoT. There's no chemistry between them, and the conclusion is entirely forced, out of left field, and really makes no sense. It's really awful that HoT serves as THE story of the love of Luke's life, because there's just nothing to it. There's nothing there. Certainly nothing even remotely romantic.

Shada is lifeless, as is most of the duology, which is just way too long, needlessly so. I think the only reason it gets any credit is because of its place in the overall story, the fact that it got to be the resolution to Rebels vs Empire in Legends' post-ROTJ EU. Despite the importance of the events, it's really just a long and boring slog.

Never bothered to read Allegiance or Choices of One.

 

His Legends novels rocked. The canon Thrawn was a huge disappointment.

 

The Hand Of Thrawn Duology I think was originally meant to be one book that got stretched into 2 and it showed. To me it was always Zahns version of RTJ, a mix of good and bad.

The scenes of the Imperial infiltration squad from there perspective were great OTOH The Karrade/Shada sub plot could’ve easily been cut down a bit.

Then there is the main plot with the Clone. Why would Thrawn wait 10 years for him to wake up ? a year or so maybe (which book wise is what it feels like) but not 10, that’s a long time. I mean what if the Thrawn Clone has woken up and all the Empire was gone by then.. awkward

While I loath Allegiance I can at least read Choices of one and it’s enjoyable if nothing else.
There is a germ of a good story there even if the Thrawn/Cardas And Palpatine scene is very un Palps whose more like Hux from TFA than even the Palps from RTJ. While the Vader scene at the end is equally Urmm
Nuso Esva is also bit of a pointless villain but all that aside it least there was an adventure story there and it tried to add to the story/characters Which A didn’t do

 

Ah, Zahn books are still some of my favorite in the EU. His books have problems, but I still like them a lot.

By the way, did he actually FotJ: Apology or was that just part of the joke? I haven't read that for a while so I've forgotten by now. Anyway.

1) Hand of Thrawn, particularly Vision of the Future is still one of my favorite Star Wars books. I remember when I picked up the hardcover so many years ago and was surprised at how thick it was (well, compared to Specter). It has its issues, like resetting things 10 years back and a few... scathing references to other books, but I love how it perfectly finishes up the Bantam era while leaving enough ideas for anyone else to run with. Which didn't actually happen, but that's for another thread.

2) Hm, probably Choices of One is his worst book. Allegiance was already weak, a sequel to that made it even worse. A short novella was included with that though that kind of acts as a prequel to the Thrawn trilogy I think.

3) They can probably be read out of order but Survivor's Quest and Outbound Flight fit quite well together. And I'm actually amazed at how well C'baoth (the original, not the clone) fit in with the prequel Jedi. The arrogance, the power, he even gets along well with Anakin, but he's still not as crazy as his clone of course.

4) You can possible read HoT without reading the rest of Bantam, but preferably read the X-wing series (especially the Stackpole ones) at least. Not just because they're great (which they all are) but Zahn and Stackpole worked together a lot and those novels are referenced a lot in HoT.

 

Wookieepedia doesn't mention the novella in Choices of One:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Choices_of_One

are you sure you're not thinking of Crisis of Faith - which is in Heir to the Empire: 20th Anniversary Edition?

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Crisis_of_Faith

 

Whoops, you're right. I got them mixed up. The Crisis of Faith novella serves as a mini-sequel to Choices of One as well as prequel to HttE.

Hm, speaking of that, can we count the 20th Anniversary Edition as a separate book? If only there had been enough demand for a DFR and Last Command Anniversary Edition, but alas. Well, probably low demand and I think the EU was rebooted around then too. Maybe? Something like that.

 

Probably an unpopular opinion but my favourite would be Survivor's Quest. There was just something really cool and novel about it. Luke and Mara in the Unknown Regions, Chiss and Empire of the Hand explored, weird aliens, appearance by Droidekas (at that stage where appearances of Prequel things in past-ROTJ was exciting).

They're all great though. Allegiance and Choices of One probably the weakest for mine. Scoundrels is a good read but a little different from his other stuff.

 

1. What is your favorite Zahn novel out of these? How does it compare to the original Tharwn Trilogy?

For me, nothing quite lives up to the Thrawn Trilogy. In my mind, those books are still 7, 8, and 9.

But as far as Zahn's other work goes, I actually really liked Allegiance. Having three different plots unified in one theme made for a fun read, and I actually like The Hand of Justice troopers a lot.

2. What is your *least* favorite novel out of these, and why?

Specter of the Past, Hand of Thrawn Book 1. It felt like there was a lot of padding and it was just set up for Book 2. I've said it before, but HOT could have easily been one book.

3. Do you think one can read each "series" (Hand of Thrawn, Survivor's Quest/Outbound Flight, Allegiance / Choices of One) without the previous Zahn stories?

I read TTT first and felt like I had more of an appreciation for the characters and ideas that got expanded on, but I think you can read most of those books and still appreciate them without having read TTT 1st, except maybe Hand of Thrawn.

4. Can one jump straight from the Tharwn Trilogy to Hand of Thrawn, skipping over the other EU stories? Is anything lost from the overall experience?

You could skip everything in between and not feel like anything is missing, but there are some gems there in the EU that are worth checking out anyway, so I don't recommend it.

 

Scoundrels was FANTASTIC. Thrawn was a disappointment.

 

The 20th Anniversary is great, has so many great insights into the book.

I'm re-reading LOTF, but after that, or if I get bored, I might re-read Outbound Flight and SQ.