JCC Embrace The FU - Formerly the STAR WARS IS BAD thread

Why so salty?

 

Watching Batman & Robin

 

Visceral. You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

 

Visceral = vomit inducing??


news to me

 

Dear, poor Lucas. He really thought he could do it.

His friends had made Important Films. Coppolla: the Godfather, Apocalypse Now. Spielberg: Schindler's List, Saving Private Ryan. And he? What had he done lately? Indiana Jones and Howard the Duck.

He was going to show them. He would make a trilogy of movies, showing how someone can slowly corrupt a government. He called his creation a myth, he spoke of rhyme and poetry, he divided his trilogy like you would an opera.

There was just one problem. He sucked at that.

I know what a compelling story about a corrupting politician should be like. He should surprise you (didn't). His plans should be smart (weren't). It should be relatable (wasn't). And most of all: it should make some sense. Attack Of The Clones featured the following story device: the scheming politician leads the supernatural galactic police people to a hidden army, by way of an assassin who tried to murder a senator. The supernatural police just happens to be in need of an army, so what the hell! Let's take it. No questions asked, even if we're supernatural.

He shoulda stuck with zap zap.

 

How were Palpatine's plans not smart?

He fooled the smartest people in the galaxy into fighting a war against himself, and they had no idea until he'd put his plans in place for their destruction.

So either he's a genius or everyone else is immeasurably dumb. Wouldn't give me much confidence in a supposedly wise & just Order if they fell for that.

 

I've said it before.

Lucas - Great idea's man. Get him to provide the outline of a story with the key beats but then give it to a good director (Kirshner)

Ask him to implement his ideas and he'll struggle and will get lost in his own idea's as he builds further and further on it without creating a satisfying resolution.

 

I think the truly awful thing is that you skip over the ten worst things about the story flow.

 

I mean @SuperWatto made it clear why the plan was not smart. He relied upon happenstance.

 

I don't see how.

The Jedi went where he wanted them to go, to find an army he'd created for a situation he'd engineered (Separatists)
Nothing was coincidence. It was all manipulation.

The Jedi didn't need an army, they're not soldiers. The Republic needed one to fight the increasing threat.

And who is the leader of the Republic?
Who would then happen to utilize this army that conveniently was created 10 years ago, starting a war against himself?

I agree more questions should have been asked, the whole Syfo Dyas thing never got resolved in the movies which was silly because it's of the main plot points.
Clone Wars had to resolve it.

 

it was awful

stop attempting to defend awful



badly

 

Well, the Jedi take utterly stupid decisions, so if they're the smartest, it must just be a dumb galaxy.

That could work. But it's not immediately apparant. Everything is brought with such ponderous gravity. They even got Christopher Lee. That would be a miscast then.

 

You yourself said Lucas has good ideas.

Palpatine's manipulation is a brilliant idea, just poorly executed in many ways.
Like the romance & most other parts of the PT that are essential to making the story work well.

A decent screenwriter could have made Lucas' plan awesome, the seeds were there.
That's the most frustrating aspect of the Prequels, there are good ideas in it that never get fully realised.

 

Watto. laid. It. Out.

How do they know how to go? A tip from Dexter. How did he come up with that tip? From a dart Jango used to kill whatever her name is. Why was whatever name is get killed? She failed to get away from Fannyquin and Kenobi? Why was she running? She failed her attempted assassination.

It’s the definition of happenstance. Because let’s face it, Palps “everything is proceeding as I have foreseen it” is dodgy at best.

Unless you believe in #richielogic

 

Yes Lucas has good ideas.

I then said give it to a good director.



I personally believe I have great story ideas. I can't however put them to paper to make a book.


Lucas has the idea, provided the key beats then his best films were when someone else managed the narrative.


The prequels could have been great if Lucas had taken a step or two back.


Instead we got what we got.

 

QFT. I can't buy into a character's genius when his plans rely on his opponents making stupid decisions.

 

Spoiler: Part 1 NSFW - Language

Part 2

 

Richie.

It's post-brexit. An EU politician, let's say Frans Timmermans, is the target of an assassination attempt. His bodyguard follows the trail - it's Boris Johnson.

The bodyguard stumbles upon a whole army of Boris Johnson clones. Its creators claim to be working for a dead old EU representative. Then, Frans Timmermans and the bodyguard are captured. They're to be executed, along with some other whiner.

You're the EU. What do you do? You have no army. Do you file a protest? Or are you going to have your security men command an army of shady Boris Johnson clones?

 

The EU has armies, lots of them. And the assistance of NATO.

I never said everything worked well, AOTC has obviously got issues with execution.

I'm simply against the idea everything happened accidentally or by coincidence.
It didn't. Everyone was exactly where they were supposed to be & followed the trail Palpatine set up.

But it could have been done better.
Especially without having to do the whole bit where Obi Wan goes to Dex's diner.

 

Oh ****...does Richie have on ignore.

 

I definitely agree that there were some good ideas that sometimes challenged the perceptions of the OT-- e.g. instead of the romanticized samurai Obi-Wan described the Jedi were a bunch of stuffy monks. But Lucas lacked the ability to properly flesh it out or he just didn't care enough.

 

Was always weird to me that the robes Obi Wan wore in ANH weren't simply something he wore to be inconspicuous on Tatooine but actually the clothes all Jedi wore.
Which you'd think might make him stand out in a galaxy where Jedi are hunted. Especially in a busy space port occupied by the Empire.

 

Would Yodas robes not dispel this notion?