CT Leia Organa's Personal Flaws

The last one wasn't so bad it at least attempted to have an actual story instead of them just stripping. But I get why many female fans gravitate towards these films.

 

Whenever I see the metal bikini I can't help but think of this...

 

bossy, rude, self centered, self righteous, etc, etc. Still one of my favorite SW characters period.

 

I prefer women like this to women who are passive.

 

Also, Leia's sometimes harsh exterior may well have belied a more hidden softer side. Words can sometimes be deceptive.

 

I think feminist arguments get way more complicated when you get into the realm of escapism/fantasy/wish-fulfillment. It is undeniably the case that looks/sex/age/race etc shouldn't matter at all if you're hiring an engineer, police officer, pilot, whatever.

However, Hollywood, at least in part, is presenting a fantasy world for people to escape into where people are more glamorous, attractive, engaging, clever etc. So it's very hard to say that appearance doesn't matter, or shouldn't be factored in, when that is exactly what Hollywood is giving us and that's what we want from Hollywood.

A very close female friend of mine who is definitely a feminist (knows feminist philosophy backwards and forwards) in part preferred Henry Cavill's Superman in MOS to Brandon Routh's Superman in Superman Returns because she found Henry Cavill cute but not Routh. That wasn't the only reason why, but that was part of why she liked Henry Cavill's version of Superman more so than Routh's (but less so than Reeves' in part because of Reeves' better performance). Now imagine Dom Deluise as Supes. Even if he could nail that part as an actor, he would fail simply because of the way he looks.

Every good guy lead actor in The Avengers, the OT, the PT, the ST is more attractive than the average person in our world, and I don't think people should be criticized for admitting they like an actor/actress in part because he/she is attractive.

And let's be honest, most people, regardless of the sex, have "liked" or "been interested in" (most likely in a lustful way) someone purely for their appearance alone -- i.e. basically, the only reason you are interested in that person is that you like what you see when get a chance to see them with very little clothing on or dressed in clothing that accentuates their shape: Wow, I really like the way that person looks! Let's look at some more images of said person on the Internet!

If slave Leia perks up someone's interest in Leia in this base/lustful way, I'm not going to judge. That's human nature.

If someone, however, can only identify with a character based on their looks, then that person probably is pretty shallow because it would seem pretty likely that that person judges people in real life in much the same manner.

So, when someone says -- "I like to see an attractive person with an attractive body in situations that actually allow me to see that person's attractive face/body," then I have absolutely no problem with it whether it be a bathing suit clad Halle Berry or Daniel Craig rising out of the water or Carrie Fischer in a slave bikini. That "voyeur" is only admitting to having basic human drives.


Again, what I'm talking about is totally different from the choice to put Leia in the metal bikini. It may have been inappropriate to put her in that outfit. Since this argument isn't the easiest of calls, I'll go with another example -- JJ's choice to show scientist Carol Markus (Alice Eve) in her underwear in Into Darkness. That was totally an example of inappropriate and gratuitous female objectification. That served no plot purpose whatsoever.

So, here's my reaction to that scene. Did I find Alice Eve attractive to look at there? Yep.

Now, was that scene appropriate? No, it certainly wasn't. She was presented in a way that was solely meant for us, as the audience, to see her as a sex object and it reduced her as a character.

So, for me, a scene like that leaves me with a conflicted response: I certainly find her attractive, but at the same time, I'm kind of icked out because I find it inappropriate. That conflicted response also doesn't change my overall opinion of the scene. It feel it was definitely wrong to include that scene.


For slave Leia or Magic Mike, I think the same logic comes into play. If you think the depiction is inappropriate, then you're likely to have a conflicted response. If you think the story justifies that choice, then you won't feel conflicted.


But again, for someone to say that he/she likes to see an attractive actor/actress in a state of dress that makes it easy to see how attractive that person is rather than dressed in parka and snow gear from head to toe. That's sort of a no-brainer, and I totally agree, and I don't think there's thing to be ashamed about when admitting so.

 

Can i get a Hallelujah!

Seriously i dont think its sexist or degrading if she owns it like Carrie Fischer did. The whole point is that Jabba has his slave women dress like that because he sees their sexuality as their primary/only value. The guy is a 'vile gangster'and Leia takes him down like the badass she is. The whole rescue is fresh take on the classic 'Damsel in Distress' thing but with the genders reversed. Han is the damsel, Leia comes to his rescue. To me its more important what shes doing than what shes wearing. Drax the destroyer never wears a shirt.

 

I totally agree. I think this is most particularly true of comic books. In old Hollywood, it's a little different but often just as bad. There's not a lot of skin, but many times the worth of woman is only her attractiveness. I'm glad Hollywood is giving us Ripley, Katniss, Sarah Connor, Divergent girl, Rey, female X-men mutants, etc.

I don't follow what you mean.

I agree that harshly bashing an actor/actress/director for their appearance is inappropriate ala Donald Turmp/Rosis O'Donnell (she's an ugly fat pig), but would you say that a comment like the following is inappropriate -- "Dom Deluise is a horrible casting choice for Superman. He doesn't look the part."?

Also, are you saying that you personally disagree with such an opinion or that you would erase a post that expressed such an opinion and warn its poster in your role as a mod?

 

So not only is slave leia merchandise being banned, even talking about the ban is banned. lol Got it.

 

I appreciate you response. Personally, I think threads like -- "Who is the hottest male/female in Star Wars" -- are okay. (Maybe people are so likely to say inappropriate things in such a thread that Mods figure they're bound to be closed anyway.) I'm still not entirely sure if "Hottest People" threads are acceptable or not, but it's not a big deal to me either way. Again, thanks for your explanation of the rules.


RETURNING TO TOPIC

To me, Leia in ANH seems elitist, snobby, speciesist, rude, and strangely complacent soon after the destruction of Alderaan. I don't find her particularly likable in the film. Most of these negative qualities seem to diminish in TESB, and her biggest flaw there seems to be that she's not in touch with her emotions. By the end of TESB and through ROTJ she really doesn't seem to have any major flaws.

 

I appreciate you response. Personally, I think threads like -- "Who is the hottest male/female in Star Wars" -- are okay.
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I think if there were to be such threads, they should be appropriately worded. I would have no problem with "who is the most attractive person in the saga to you?" as long as it

1) stayed on this side of decency and respect
2) it included both sexes.

sorry for derailing the thread.

 

Her holding it together after seeing Alderaan blow up showed great strength on her part, IMO. Another major reason that Leia isn't in the best mood after she's rescued is that she clearly is annoyed by Han's freewheeling style. I mean, he's obviously making it up as he goes along, which was probably a far cry from the professionalism Leia was accustomed to. She then has to take charge of her own rescue mission, which was an awesome moment for her I thought.

 

I always thought the 'hotness' threads were fine and I was a regular contributor, even as a mod. Occasionally someone would overstep the line but for the most part people contributed appropriately and in good humour. People think people are hot. It's a fact of life and it's okay. It's when there's an attitude that a person should be judged entirely on their hotness, or lack of it, or that they should have to conform to some kind of formula, that there's a problem.

 

The "walking carpet" line is her biggest flaw. It's chuckle-worthy in a hokey 70s sci-fi way, but in-universe it's pretty shockingly rude coming from a cultured leader of a rebellion trying to take down an oppressive regime.

 

Yeah. It's a not very well thought through, dated piece of dialogue.

 

Based on all the posts I have read relating to this topic, it appears all of Leia's personal, positive attributes should actually be credited to the man who created this female character. And all of the personal flaws such as emotional, spiritual and ******** are fault of the actress portraying her.

 

I think it works considering she's basically a stuck-up rich core-princess in ANH. She has a few joice-words about the Falcon too, because she isn't used to fly in a "hunk of junk".

 

Well Luke called the Falcon a piece of junk as well, so I always thought it was more a case of the Falcon looking hopelessly outdated to everyone but Han and Chewie. But cool that the walking carpet works for you. It's not a big problem for me, but more one of those small moments where the seams are showing.