CT What does the Sixth Advisor from ROTJ look like?

In those photos they look like badly dressed dorks. Lol. They looked gothic and menacing like Sidious/Palpatine in the film, however.

 

Alpha-Red wrote

Huh, I always thought Sate Pestage was one of the advisors with Palpatine on board the Death Star. No?

Same here and unless I hear solid evidence to the contrary (and not just EU conjecture) I'm pretty confident that one of these dignitaries can be traced back to the "Grand Vizier to His Eminence, Emperor" i.e. Sate Pestage to whom Vader had to talk first in the fourth draft of ESB from October 24, 1978.

I believe Sate Pestage would have been the one right behind the Emperor during his Death Star arrival, who also became available as the "Imperial Dignitary" Kenner action figure.

P.S.
According to the information in this link it's "official" that Sate Pestage was at least one out of the five dignitaries:
http://www.starwarz.com/tbone/minions-of-the-empire/

But the question remains who might have been the actor playing him in ESB.

 

P.P.S.

Couldn't help but notice that all the Wikipedia descriptions only refer to these guys as "advisors", despite different costumes that could possibly suggest differences. Considering the Emperor wasn't in his prime anymore, wouldn't one expect one of these guys to be his personal physician?

Up in his tower there's only Sate Pestage and the other "dignitary". Given the absence of the others I'd assume the other is probably Palpatine's physician:
http://starwarsscreencaps.com/star-wars-episode-vi-return-of-the-jedi-1983/35/

 

Actually, neither of those is Sate Pestage, canonically.

Star Wars In 100 Scenes provided canonical names for those two - Janus Greejatus and Sim Aloo:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Janus_Greejatus
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sim_Aloo

Pestage also isn't the OT-era Grand Vizier any more - Mas Amedda is:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Mas_Amedda

Which is why he's the one in charge of the Empire in the newcanon novel Aftermath - set immediately after RoTJ.

 

Being well aware, now, where that comes from (i.e. some guys working for the Customizable Card Game invented the name) I have my doubts, but maybe I can bring myself to believe he's the successor of Sate Pestage, who has fallen out of favor with his master.

During the arrival scene he is next behind the Emperor and Vader and Jerjerrod, talking to what is probably Jerjerrod's executive officer, possibly being briefed about the details of the Death Star's completion, so he can provide the Emperor with additional information should he require that.

Next couple behind is another Imperial officer talking to the "tall hat" dignitary. I believe he could be the Imperial treasurer. Undoubtedly, Jerjerrod's men used the occasion to stress the importance they need more money and/or personnel to finish the Death Star construction.

The next couple is the dignitary "Kren Blista-Vanee" and another officer. I have no idea what they could be talking about. Politics?

And last but not least we have three dignitaries (including the previously missing sixth one) that all wear the same headgear as "Janus Greejatus". I can't help but think that these are probably Palpatine's personal physicians.

 

Being well aware, now, where that comes from (i.e. some guys working for the Customizable Card Game invented the name) I have my doubts, but maybe I can bring myself to believe "Sim Aloo" is the successor of Sate Pestage, who has fallen out of favor with his master.

During the arrival scene "Sim Aloo" (right) is next behind the Emperor and Vader and Jerjerrod, talking to what is probably Jerjerrod's executive officer, possibly being briefed about the details of the Death Star's completion, so he can provide the Emperor with additional information should he require that.

Next couple behind is another Imperial officer talking to the "tall hat" dignitary (left). I believe he could be the Imperial treasurer. Undoubtedly, Jerjerrod's men used the occasion to stress the importance they need more money and/or personnel to finish the Death Star construction.

The next couple consists of "Kren Blista-Venee" (center, sitting). Are they talking about politics or else?

And last but not least we have three dignitaries with this same kind of headgear (center, standing - the third one is missing in the above publicity shot) which could be Palpatine's personal physicians including "Janus Greejatus". Two of these do not appear to be engaged in a conversation (after all, what should Palpatine's personal physicians be talking about with the officers? Weather in space?)

 

I think Lucas lost interest in Pestage. Hence all scenes that reference him being deleted.

The first "newcanon" source to include Pestage was the Tarkin novel (he's moustached).

As far as I can tell (thanks to Aftermath) Pestage was never Grand Vizier but always remained a lesser dignitary.

 

Iron_lord

But then what are your thoughts on that (from my link in post # 27):

Over at Starwars.com in one of their Q&A sessions with that uppity librarian Jocasta Nu, this question was asked:

In Return of the Jedi, who are the gentlemen that exit the shuttle with Emperor Palpatine? ​

Her answer was this:

Accompanying Emperor Palpatine in several scenes is a cadre of Imperial advisors. They are alternately known as Imperial dignitaries, or more sinisterly, the Emperor’s Inner Circle. They wear burgundy and purple robes and have pale skin and sunken features. Many of them are key officials in the managing of the Imperial bureaucracy. ​

Among the members of Palpatine’s Inner Circle are: Sate Pestage, Janus Greejatus, Sim Aloo, Ars Dangor, and Kren Blista-Vanee.​

​

​

It would appear that Sate Pestage is still among the five (at least in 2013) and was listed as the first of all of them.

Considering that the "specialists" at Lucasfilm weren't even aware that there was a sixth dignitary (...) I really wonder if "Sim Aloo" could really
be the successor of Sate Pestage as Grand Vizier.

 

I'd go with "Pestage is in the Inner Circle, but not everyone in the Inner Circle is aboard that shuttle". That, or Pestage has shaved off his moustache.

 

It would appear Jocasta Nu from Lucasfilm had that publicity shot (above) at her disposal when she "identified" the five individuals on it.

 

It is true that Pestage not being in it was originally a Legends concept - when that statement was made back in 2003 (not 2013) - he could have been in it - but a 2013 Legends source ruled out that possibility:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Unidentified_Imperial_Advisor_(black_robe)

In 2003, a Return of the Jedi production photo of the red-and-black-robed Advisor and four others was included in a StarWars.com article, with text that read, "Among the members of Palpatine's Inner Circle are: Sate Pestage,Janus Greejatus, Sim Aloo, Ars Dangor, and Kren Blista-Vanee."[7] This led to certain fan confusion, in which the red-and-black-robed Advisor was interpreted to be Sate Pestage,[8] given that Pestage had previously been identified in the Expanded Universe wearing a similar headpiece.[9] However, the 2013 Star Wars: Galactic Files Series 2 card set reveals that all six Advisors aboard the Death Star were killed during the Battle of Endor, while Pestage is established to have lived past the Battle of Endor,[10] thus eliminating any connection between the two characters.

http://web.archive.org/web/20031008...om/community/askjc/jocasta/askjc20030602.html\

In the newcanon though, we have no idea - we can only go by newcanon sources - which make it clear at least that "Sim Aloo" is the guy behind the Emperor.

http://www.starwars.com/databank/sim-aloo

 

Allow me to rephrase the text a little bit:

"This led to certain fan confusion (?!?), in which the red-and-black-robed Advisor was interpreted to be Sate Pestage,[8] given that Pestage had been (a) scheduled to appear as Grand Vizier in ESB, (b) apparently made into a ROJ Kenner Action figure as the only "Imperial Dignitary" because he is the dignitary VIP next to Palpatine and (c) identified in the Expanded Universe wearing a similar headpiece.

I really have to wonder who is "confused" here.

 

If you want to "headcanon" that Sim Aloo is Sate Pestage, that's up to you. Just don't mistake your headcanon for either the canonverse or the Legendsverse. As to whether your "headcanon" happens to correspond to "Lucas's original intent" - that shouldn't really matter.

 

Did I miss something here?

Lucasfilm itself and EU confirmed in 2003 that Sate Pestage was among the group in 1983 and identified as the next one in line trailing Emperor Palpatine based on observations and (IMHO) accurate conclusions, but the new guys in charge determining "canon" now decided against that and deem everybody confused or betrayed who accepted this in good faith?

I'm sorry to say so but this methodology reminds me too much of George Orwell's dystopian Doublethink: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublethink

 

Actually, "Lucasfilm" didn't say which Pestage was - and eventually said "None of them" - back in 2013.

The newcanon just carried on with that, as far as I can tell.

Logically - it would be a mistake for Palpatine to take his Grand Vizier off Coruscant - because it's his Grand Vizier's job to do the governing and act as his deputy. So that Palpatine can take time off to go on important trips - like to the second Death Star.

 

Alright- more Dignitary talk!!!

Finally, somebody else also noticed that there are conversations of some sort going on amongst the Dignitaries and the various Imperial officers that are evident upon close viewing of the end of the arrival scene. For those interested, just quickly pause/unpause the part where the camera zooms out into an overhead view, and look at the postioning of the heads. So much for Sim Aloo never speaking...

 

As I just learned Ms. "Jocasta Nu" passed away (RIP), but I think it's anything but a stretch to notice that she identified five dignitaries by name. However, the actual footage reveals there are six of them, thus it's a logical conclusion she must have referred to the group publicity still with the five in it.

Iron_lord wrote

Logically - it would be a mistake for Palpatine to take his Grand Vizier off Coruscant - because it's his Grand Vizier's job to do the governing and act as his deputy. So that Palpatine can take time off to go on important trips - like to the second Death Star.

How do we know that, that's merely an assumption. Either there are other bureaucrats that can take over (the inauguration of the second Death Star is a big thing that could require the presence of the Grand Vizier) or Palpatine actually wanted to make the Death Star his new home.

Considering he had already been taken as a hostage once during the Republic, surely there had been Alliance plots to try again (Coruscant is a big planet).

By relocating his residence aboard the Death Star any attempts to capture or kill him would have probably become much more difficult. The other thing is travel: I could say that travelling in a Super Star Destroyer is far less safe than travelling the galaxy with a Death Star.

 

It's pretty clear in the newcanon (Aftermath) that Mas Amedda is the ROTJ-era Grand Vizier and that he was not on the Death Star II.

Makes sense to me that after ROTS, Lucas would replace his old idea (Pestage) with a new one (Amedda).

 

It would appear that's not what George Lucas intended.

Mas Amedda has been in the GFFA since 1999, but in 2003 Sate Pestage was still with the Emperor in ROJ according to Lucasfilm (see above) and was originally scheduled to be the Grand Vizier for ESB. This doesn't look like a coincidence to me.

It rather seems nuCanon chose to ignore that and seriously suggests that one character neither fell out of favor nor was he replaced by an eager upstart - like Sate Pestage probably was.

Considering how Darth Sidious never minded to replace old followers with new ones, I actually find it hard to believe that he supposedly stuck to one advisor for several decades.

 

Which one is Snoke?

 

The sixth one that wasn't identified by Lucasfilm and managed to stay out of the group picture

 

It doesn't matter what Lucas intended, or rather, what's speculated what Lucas intended. He sold the franchise. Other people are "in charge" now.

As Jello put it:

 

Iron_lord

I will rather reject than follow that doctrine. The essential idea that people that mostly were not even born by the time these characters were created should "know" better than the actual creator/s or researchers respecting the original intentions is quite simply outrageous.

Regarding Jello's "leap of logic unsupported by the text" I addressed that in my first sentence in post # 43.

 

It's what happens when a long running franchise passes out of the control of its creators.

Since Lucas didn't choose to outright name "Guy behind Palpatine" in any source - it's within the remit of the EU to name him, and, of the Story Group to canonize that name.