ST The Romantic Future of Kylo Ren and Rey

Is this fan-made or was this a real poster somewhere? The beam of light on him is incredible.

 

So... a love story that served as a catalyst for Anakin turning to the dark side and becoming Darth Vader is something that just "popped up"? Riiiight. And Star Wars '"rely more on action set pieces"? And not, say, on memorable characters who capture people's imagination, and their interactions? Riiiight.

vaderito: I didn't spot it myself, but you're so right, Kylo could totally be a dark Elf if he had a pointier set of ears Or a moredhel from Raymond Feist's Midkemia novels.

Kylo Ren's 8-Pack: those B&W shots of Adam are incredible, especially the profile one. I wish he got photographed by Anton Corbijn, who is one of my favourite photographers.

I was one of the people who initially thought that Kylo should have taken his mask off in the scene with Han. It simply took me a while to get used to the idea that TFA is not a self-contained film, and some things in it should be looked at not in terms of what they mean to this individual film, but what they mean in terms of the entire trilogy. From this perspective, Kylo's relationship with Rey is way more important than his relationship with Han, so it makes total sense that Rey is the first person who sees him unmasked.

I think that many decisions made in TFA might get re-assessed after the following episodes, including Kylo Ren's character in general. IMO a lot of the "he's weaksauce maaan" reaction to him stems from the fact that getting beaten by Rey is the last thing we see of him in the movie. Had the movie played it backwards where he starts off as vulnerable and on the losing side, and ends as a confident villain stopping blaster shots in midair, same people would probably go, "this guy is badass!"

Personally I'm glad that they seem to be taking a long view where Kylo is concerned, and took risks with the character that might have undercut his appeal in the first film, for some people. I get an impression they know exactly where they're going with him.

Re: Rey being a Skywalker because it makes for a happier story for Luke, I can see the appeal it has, but can't say I feel the same. Probably because I don't plan on having a family and having children to me is not necessarily the be-all, end-all condition of happiness. Luke to me seemed like a person who's found his vocation and who's to say that training the next generation of Jedi wouldn't have given him the same amount of fulfillment. This of course was taken away from him, but I do think that's where he's heading again by the end of the trilogy, with his Jedi mojo restored.

 

http://www.cosmicbooknews.com/conte...-ren-hot-toys-fan-pics-revealed#axzz426ZItDdf
This article says its fan made using the hot toys actions figure.
It does look amazing.

 

Sure....nothing wrong with a man in touch with his masculinity....in general or in any particular moment
Even if it's a consequence of fanbroing, any woman would surely appreciate it

 

With all the parallels between Rey & Ren I think her parentage will have an element of darkness. Obi Wan or Snoke, narratively speaking would fit. In fact both would mirror Kylo's to a tee. He had a grandfather on the side of light in Anakin and a grandfather on the side of dark via Darth Vader. The difference is she would aspire to be like her grandfather on the good side countering his aspiration to be like his dark grandfather.

Rey had both good and bad in her family resisting the dark whereas Ben was the opposite by giving in to it. It fits the Ying and Yang principles spotted about them. Truth is Snoke doesn't have to be Rey's grandfather, too, but it is believable to find out he played a part in her family turning bad. Their not polar opposites of each other, rather mirror images, representing what could have been if circumstances were different. Sort of like Spider-Man and Venom; Flash and Reverse-Flash; Batman and Bane; etc etc.

 

Catching up with yesterday:

@Adept I really liked your post and the reasoning behind it, hope you don´t mind me joining in for few comments about redemption...

Correct me if I´m wrong, but the only cannon redemption in SW right now is Vader´s...That arc was really badly done for me because, even if I today watch the movies in their narratively chronological order, I still think it´s lame that the big bad Vader who was so undeniably evil in OT suddenly had a change of heart and rediscovered love for his whiny son and thus saved his soul in the last 5 minutes or so of RotJ....I just didn’t buy that one....what Ren´s redemption has the potential to be is so broverwhelmingly different...the redemption arc that will play out through the whole ST and that, IMO, it already started in TFA (maybe even before)....and not by the killing of Han, but by acknowledgment of the presence of the pull to the light in this character....He adamantly and constantly does bad things and wants to be bad and evil, but fails in that all the time...if he was successful, then there would be no doubts and pulls to the light and tears....it´s like he is trying too hard to be evil against himself....Why does he do it if he repeatedly fails? I think THAT´s the real question of TFA, and not Rey´s parentage...WHY does he kill Han? Bastard he is, that´s why...lol...I guess I took it as his LAST, DESPERATE attempt to fall irrevocably to the darkness…even though a part of him knows that this will not bring him control and peace of mind that he craves for…and that part of him was the one that was willing to surrender himself at the bridge when he offered his lightsaber to Han…That offer was NOT, here dad take my sword, I´m done with being bad, now we can just all go home, and live happily ever after with me in prison or pardoned or whatever….no way…the stakes here were DEATH for one of them….I came to believe that when he gives the weapon to Han he is suggesting him to finish it all right there and then and free him, kill him:

Han Solo: Snoke is using you for your power. When he gets what he wants, he'll crush you. You know it's true.
Kylo Ren: It's too late.
Han Solo: No, it's not. Leave here with me. Come home. We miss you.
Kylo Ren: I'm being torn apart. I want to be free of this pain. I know what I have to do but I don't know if I have the strength to do it. Will you help me?
Han Solo: Yes. Anything.

Something in that moment, with Ren´s eyes full of tears made me think that. The tears are not for Han, because I think that in that moment, he doesn´t want to kill Han…I think he wanted Han to kill him….But I don´t think that Han realized what exactly his son is asking of him….until the light of the consumed star fades away, and the darkness creeps back into Kylo Ren and he ignites the lightsabre pushing it straight to his father´s heart….In that exact moment the expression on Han´s face is first surprise (because he realized what just happened, what his son was asking of him), then acceptance of HIS death (because he could never kill his child) and then forgiveness (in its most pure form-that of love)….that freaking moment was the most intense moment I have seen in a movie, I dare say forever…I gasped loudly NO with the tears in my throat in a full theater, so consumed with the moment that at one point the people around turned towards me with a wtf look on their faces…really caught me by surprise….and to happen in a Star Wars movie, that was just priceless and added to the intensity of it, since before TFA Star Wars were just a shallow adventure flics for me and I´d like to think of myself as deep having the titles like Usual Suspects, Fightclub or The Godfather on top of my favorite movies list, among others…

That said, I guess I have to believe that the killing of Han, his sacrifice will have some greater ramifications than to establish the evilness of Kylo….the way I saw it, he himself realizes that just after he says “Thank you”, when the tears finally leave his eyes (wait till DVD, it´s easy to miss on big screen)….And I hope that the redemption of epic proportions is in the works for Ren, not just a sudden change of heart in the last 5 minutes and/or redemption by death…that would cheapen Han´s sacrifice, IMO…so I opt for full redemption with a long life of atonement for Ren with a prominent role in rebuilding the (grey) Jedi order of sorts, with him coming to terms with the consequences of his choices every…day…for the rest of his life…but still doing it, and not succumbing to darkness again, because of it….because it is his DUTY not to succumb…

I saw that you referred to a lot of non-SW villains redeemed or not….don´t know much about the others, but I do know about prince Nuada…and that is another example of a complexity within a “shallow” blockbuster movie….I hated that ending, I hated that he died, although that was the only way it could go….there are so many similarities between the characters of Nuada and Kylo Ren: the despair, the torment, resignation and willingness to surrender to evilness, contrasted with the love that still inhabits their hearts…for Nuada, it was the love for his sister….but the main difference between them is that from the start of the movie it was obvious that there was really no other choice for Nuada than his demise, ironically by the hands of what he loved the most in this world…and his last words are so true “the world would be poorer for their deaths”…which just seals the tragedy, IMO….
I HATED that, but knew from the start of the movie that there really is no other way to go….But for Kylo Ren, I do see another way, and I do hope that the writters will take it in that direction….but I know that the other possibility is also very much possible, more possible I´d say than his redemption…and if that happens, I will be fine with it…because, you know, at least I could go back to thinking that Star Wars is just another shallow movie, hahaha
I´d just hate to see all that potential for epicenes thrown away…

And for the fact that I would love to see Reylo happening….I guess that part of this for me is projecting…because I do on some level see myself in Rey, and I would like to think that she would be a kind of woman who is able to recognize the strength in Kylo Ren/Ben Solo that, IMO, he will need to show in order to redeem and atone himself (inspite of himself)

To end: I would like to see Ren´s redemption because all I have written above, or because I´m just into tall dark and handsome bad men...take it any way you like

Edited to ad: I just realized that Nuada is not dark, physically anyway, but I still stand by what I meant by tall, dark and handsome men

 

Well most blokes are ugly, source - bloke

 

Crimson Corsair

what are you doing up at this hour, isn´t it late in US....go to sleep

 

I've seen many suggestions that Rey might be a Kenobi, but I'm just curious, has there been a working theory on who Rey's parents actually are, what is their connection to Obi-Wan, why they left their daughter on Jakku etc.?

I could be wrong because I don't frequent the heritage tread all that much, but it just seems like most of the arguments for her being a Kenobi revolve around parallels and symbolism and such, rather than trying to translate it into the nitty-gritty details that tie in with what we know from TFA.

 

I'm from the UK m8

 

hahaha...then I did mistook you for someone else....good to know...looking forward to fighting with someone who is living in the same continent as me

EDIT: Found something new to fight about?

 

I'm drawing a blank, this one is on you

 

@ Diddy Minty,

I'm glad that at least gave an idea into some people's perspective on the Luke and Rey thing. I was thinking a bit more about it and about what draws me to the conclusions that I have regarding Rey and her parents. If I had to pick someone outside of Luke to be her father (in either adoption or Biologically) then I would have to say the Shan's over say a Kenobi for two main reasons. Firstly the Shan family does have a history of at least leaving their children under the care of others, save for Bastila who seems to have raised Vaner on her own for a long time, and any of the many grand children and great grand children, etc. that were not jedi's seemed to have, at the very least, taken care of their children. The ones that have connections to the Jedi tended to leave them with masters or the Order. Second is the fact that we know the Shan family line does exist, they were gray, all of them, and willing to break rank with the order. also if she does wind up with Ben it would be interesting to see two very strong force users from two very important family lines working together.

Humm this is rather interesting. I'm not sure if this was brought up here or not. but From Pablo on March 3rd.

So, if we're to believe what he's saying here firstly we can assume that we're going to learn how long ago Han's been playing the role of Smuggler again. Secondly, and I think this could be really important to the question of connections. Pablo is indicating that Leia and Snoke know each other. I've been going on the speculation that Luke was the one to tell her about him. however if Leia knows Snoke and he's been around Ben for a long time, that would lead me to think that there was only a few posts that he could be in.

Why am I getting a Sheev vibe off this post honestly? Snoke being someone in the Senate that worked with the other new character mentioned in the Bloodlines preview who also may have been collecting the Empire memoriablia. This kind of changes things up some.

 

We have to find something...things are not just as interesting as when there is a conflict of some kind, hahaha....quick some bold statements I can counter
Anyone?

 

Oh, yes, I'd love to know what other people saw in that scene as well because it attracted my attention very much in a movie where everything happens so fast you don't have time to process what you just saw, because action moves very fast to the next scene. I saw a man and a woman ignoring how the planet was crumbling under their feet to focus on their choreography of chase and fight. He wanted to catch her, not kill her, that was very clear although many viewers didn't realise that. She felt revulsion and she has two reasons to be revolted, his brutality and status as a murderer and also, this is just guessing, that she knew he wanted her really badly and not just in an animalistc way but also on a deep spiritual level. She had access to his thoughts and, when she concentrared before defeating him, I think the Force let her see what he felt, that was when she turned so furious and not defensive and scared any more.

I think she felt revulsion that he felt that for her and her desire to punish him went full force. The way she went against him was vicious, as you've said, even more brutal than anything we saw him do. Only when he wounded Finn was he vicious in his agression but that was personal, just as personal as Ray's brutality towars him. Kylo is f...ing jealous of Finn , who was able to escape what he never could and go towards the Light and also the girl he thinks belongs to him. He also brought Han to him for a confrontation Kylo had been desperately trying to avoid and towards his death. Finn wasn't guilty of anything but he was the the one who set everything in motion, everything that lead to Kylo's defeat and fall to the pits of hell. Even SK was destryed thanks to Finn and it was Kylo's fault because he let him get away with his disobedience and later desertion. So he has personal reasons to hate Finn.

But Rey is just as vicious towards Kylo and then some more, and shows this cruelty after the impass where he offers himself as a teacher. Of course she has reasons to hate him but realising what he really wants probably made the difference. I think she wouldn't have been so furious if she thought he just wanted to kill her, but realising he wants something so personal from her turned her response into something very personal too. You just try to kill a murderer who is fighting you but why going for his shoulder, why kicking his wound, why BRANDING his face instead of finishing off ? That was far too personal as she branded the same face that left her so confused when he unmasked in the interrogation room. I don't think she felt attracted to him but she was affected by him, by his face, and this made her feel confused and uncomfortable when he unmasked. She is not attracted to him but she could, that's what their scenes together suggest. In another place, under different circumstances she could.

She branded him, she also cut in several places that fabric he uses to cover every inch of his pale skin, but she didn't go for the kill and he looked up at her in awe. He would have forgiven her anything in that moment and she had just branded him as if he was cattle or worse. And then that crack separates them and they look at each other one last time over the abyss, both literal and figurative, that separates them. That was f.... ing intense and personal and makes them great as enemies, but enemies with personal grudges and passionate feelings involved.

I heard in a documentary that for the epic antagonism between Ben Hur and Mesala, the actor who played Mesala was told by the director he had to play his hate for Ben Hur thinking he desired him as a man. Charlton Heston knew about this much later. That incredible shocking hate Mesala felt for a former beloved friend was chilling and much too personal and looks incredible on screen but this homoerotic vibe is never suggested in the movie.

Directors do these things. Driver must have been told to play his role as if his character was fascinated by Daisy's but she didn't receive the same instructions. She played her character as a bit naive, then confused and eventually full of hate for him, but her feelings for him are too smoldering and personal for comfort. She had only known Han and Finn for a couple of days at the most, so killing Kylo for what he did would have been normal but that viciousness...it was uncalled for. He made her feel too uncomfortable, as if he had hurt her on a personal level. Not only did he hurt her friends but also her, personally. He failed her somehow, because when she looked at him and Han on that catwalk there was hope on her face and the dark angel chose to fall into hell. Either she also feels a pull towards him she doesn't understand and chooses to ignore or at leat she is aware of his fascination for her and is revolted by this. She doesn't want to be desired by a monster capable of affecting her on a personal level.

They fought oblivious to everything around them, including the snowy planet crashing down. He's always invaded her personal space in all the scenes they have shared being alone. It took a physical abyss to separate them but neither belonging to opposing sides of the force and the war, nor his crimes and her hate for him will be enough to separate what links them, force bond or whatever it is.

 

you know what Im thinking. He could be trying to scare her/taunt her but it's also almost like he is trying to show off in front of her when he hits the laser blasts away, we all know he can just stop them in mid air (like he did on Jakku), but no he does his best to look fabulous here. In the book she thinks he's toying with her here.

 

The ravine separating was amazing to see in the cinema and to hear the noise of it separating creating a massive gap..... Rey on the right..... Kylo on the left, it was magical.
There has to be foreshadowing there, I mean really, these two aren't going to be separated for long and I definitely think there will be a balance between them both.
I think Rey will eventually come to care for Kylo. Maybe the ravine symbolizes/foreshadows wanting to be together but can't, like Anakin and Padme only better!
Maybe like Obi-Wan Luke will be the one who knows whats going on behind the scenes. Obi-Wan knew about Anakin and even though he was a devoted Jedi he didn't interfere with Anakin and Padme.

I'm sure Luke loves his nephew, and when you love someone you want the best for them. What better person to work as a wing man then good old Luke Skywalker. I mean Rey is surrounded by his entire family now! As well as the Falcon and his legacy saber.

I don't think Luke would be pushing anything though but he'll notice more than anyone. That's at least what I think anyway. Although I could be wrong. Luke looked seriously pissed in that production trailer.

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More like in terms of cobstantly challenging eachother. ...what, you have to admit, would make for an interesting romance.....

Seeeeee? Crimson Corsair the importance of conflict...lol...

 

I found these tweets by Pablo interesting:
This one asked me was asking him whether there was a possibility Rey was only Leia's daughter:
@braindeadcooker that Leia had a child without Han? Yeah, that doesn't work at all.

@braindeadcooker When their son became a murderer. Given the age difference between Rey and Kylo, for what you proposed to be true...

@braindeadcooker ... Kylo would have been 10? Kinda weird all around.

And this one asked him why Kylo's eyes didn't turn yellow after he killed Han:

@irishcal7524 It's not chemistry. It's only ever really done a director deems it cinematically appropriate.

 

there is dialogue in that moment where the chasm happens without words, their expressions tell us what is being said without words. He looks at the chasm, looks at her as if to say, "don't leave me", she looks at the chasm then him as if to say "I dont want to leave you but I cant get over there to help you" she has snapped out of whatever she was feeling a moment ago..thats why she looks back in concern at the ship.

Its like a classic "take my hand dont fall" to the enemy in a film but then its too late to help

 

Yea shes a bleeding heart underneath it all. Even when Leia was approaching her she looked a little guilty.
I can't wait for the DVD every other vid is just **** quality.

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It's really interesting because he's trying to be man assign towards her("You know I can take whether I want" "We'll see")but he just can't force himself to be that way towards her and his compassion for her just wins out.
It really makes you think whether he would have killed Han in front of her if she was with him when he confronted Kylo.

 

I agree, I saw guilt, theres no way she would hug the mother of a man she just left to die if she felt no guilt about it

 

I'd say that that would be the best kept secret of TFA if true

Welcome and congrats on de-lurking...this was a great first post

 

Yea Kylo toying with Rey was interesting compared to how he treats everyone else. As it says in the book it's almost like a game he's playing.
I think because he was already curious about her, he probably wanted to take a few minutes to see how cute she was haha, after all she is really like a kid here, she's just 19 while he's what? 29? 30?

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