ST Who should be the Male Lead? Finn or Luke Skywalker

Sorry about that. I misread your post, but the phrasing might might be considered an allusion to calling a poster racist.

 

He's been like this for years not just since TFA. He's blunt, he will speak his mind. in a way I wish I was a bit more like COJ. If you write crap, he will pick up on it, it really has nothing to do with his opinion on Finn. I could never in my mind be brutally honest like COJ. If he does not like a character he has right to say it, this is message board. I agree sometimes it comes across like he is stamping on people's feelings but you just have to let it go. There are a lot worse characters that have posted on this board. At least he does not put himself up as intellectually superior to everyone else.

 

Here's the thing, you subjectively finding a character "boring" doesn't mean that the remaining trilogy should shift focus based off that. Is shifting away from Finn, one of the leads of TFA, fitting for the story being told or not?

I watch the PT and have issues with the characterization and execution of Anakin and Padme, but I would never suggest the story should suddenly shift and make leads out of Palpatine, Yoda and Kenobi just because I found them more interesting. Anakin and Padme were crucial to the PT as leads, and "should" be leads regardless.

Finn is a leading character in this ST. The story is structured that way for a reason. Diminishing his place because you find him boring doesn't mean that makes sense for the story at hand.

 

That's alright, this has given me the opportunity to make it clear that I wasn't.

I don't think I'm being overly hostile or even asking for anything strenuous. He doesn't post troll worthy comments but a lot of the time there is little substance in his comments on Finn and I'd be grateful if he could expand on his criticisms if only for the sake of clarity and debate.

I'm not trying to hound him off the thread or the forum but I don't think its unreasonable to ask for his full opinion: I may find it interesting or even agree with some aspects. I've criticised Finn's character and how he was written myself.

 

Not only is he the lead for story purposes, unlike Anakin/Padme, he was a success in a beloved, critically acclaimed box office mega hit. He had the second most screen time in that critically acclaimed box office mega hit, Boyega specifically was loved by critics and won awards for it, and he continues to be one of the faces of the franchise that Disney puts out there. No one is liked by everyone, but the fact is, Boyega/Finn are adored by LF. He is working consistently, he is part of the leaks coming out about the new movie, noone associated with production has anything but glowing praise to offer him, and Boyega himself is thrilled with the material for Finn in VIII. People are free to think things should be different, but Finn as the male lead is what it is, and that's a wise business decision on Disney's part. He is a huge part of the next generation of SW heroes. You don't break a formula that you know works.

 

Excuse Me "I'm not trying to hound him off the thread or the forum but I don't think its unreasonable to ask for his full opinion: I may find it interesting or even agree with some aspects. I've criticised Finn's character and how he was written myself."

I have put across my views regarding Finn (and Boyega) several times on this Forum, I'm not going to bore everyone again.

turnip white

" I could never in my mind be brutally honest like COJ. "

....but I thought you were a Yorkshire Lass??

 

Bore us, this way the next time someone asks I can just link them to the comment.

 

Nope, can't be bothered.

 

Noted.

 

But a shy Yorkshire lass

 

Let's look at what Kathleen Kennedy has to say:'

So the idea that Finn won't be FS because they would've showed it already it dies right here, as does the idea that he won't be driving the story because he's not FS. SImply put they have an idea where to go...but have left wiggle room, which they've already used by rewriting the Episode 8 script to focus more on the new character.

Next on the chopping block is the idea that the Saga films will focus on the force. According to Kathleen herself...they will "Primarily" (again giving themselves some wiggle room) focus on the Skywalker family. In theory they could make a story about a Skywalker who has no talent with the force but none the less drives the story forward and changes the galaxy via their actions and decisions

So yeah, the plan is to focus on the new characters, like Finn, which makes sense.

 

Fair enough I certainly wouldn't wanna take away from those that enjoy his character. I'm just going to set out the rest of this trilogy it's just hasn't been my cup of tea so far I'm not impressed with all the Practical Effects, empire vs rebellion 2.0, and wasting the legendary characters. Too each their own though you all can enjoy the ST I'm going to stick with Episode 1-6.

 

I would give Finn the lead.

 

Anakin .

 

I wish it was Poe. TO much Finn not enough Poe in 7. I hope 8 is a little more even.

 

CrazyOldJedi Would you mind pointing me towards these posts? I mean you've been a member since 2000 so I imagine you have a great deal of posts which would make finding the specific ones quite a chore, unless you've made these posts recently.

 

Excuse Me you really don't want to go rooting around my old posts, there's dark, dark things hiding there....

 

CrazyOldJedi You've sparked my curiosity now, I might muster the effort to search.........or not. If I do I will be to leave breadcrumbs so I can find my way out of the labyrinth.

 

while i like Finn, i can see where CrazyOldJedi is coming from. like he said, Finn is not in a position of power (or FS yet) like previous central characters have been. Han was kept around because of the romance with Leia and having the ship that was literally how the OT crew got around most the time, minor variables that actually create a big difference when talking about Finn. Finn has nothing to really take the story forward, or place him on a pedestal that makes him important. unique? thats different to important. yeh, he was unique because former storm trooper, used Luke's light sabre, etc. but going forward, the ONLY two things i can imagine for VIII is that they play up that he has intel on the FO, that aspect really wasnt played up or foreshadowed in TFA (he already did it with Starkiller base), so it would surprise me if they use this going forward. that and the romance angle, possibly with Rey, would bring more importance to his role, as Rey quite obviously seems the most important in driving the ST forward, who received the bulk of focus in TFA too..
the mystery female character thats heavily rumored to be Finn's pairing for at least a chunk of the movie could change things, but im leaning to this new character not really having a position of power/FS either. Rey/Kylo seem to be the characters pushing the ST along, respectively.

things can change and things will be missed, but this is just my feelings on it while also seeing where CrazyOldJedi is coming from.

while i agree, thats not really whats being argued. is Finn a skywalker? no. drops a little down in importance. is Finn a leading figure in any variety? no. drops a little down. is Finn FS? not right now. drops a little down. is Finn romantically involved (like Han)? could be argued yes, but 1) theyre separated right now 2) could be 'just friends'. this brings him up a few levels if proven that is the case. (see above for other thoughts)

so while Finn is a cool character, has a good actor behind him, has been actively backed by the higher ups to be a leading character, I personally don't see how they're going to do that and based on TFA and (to a lesser degree) photos leaked from set of VIII, i dont see how he is going to be a character pushing the story forward.
if anyone can suggest why he CAN be, based on in-universe things then i would like to hear this. stating the same stuff from the Story group/JJ doesnt give me full confidence, as they've been very general/vague on many things.

 

Big Boss
This thinking betrays one of the problems in Star Wars, people assume that if you don’t have a lightsaber or are not a pilot, you have no purpose. I would’ve thought the trailer for Rogue One would make it clear that you don’t need either but I suppose I was hoping for too much.

When it comes to tactics, Finn is the one the other characters in TFA relied upon. His information on FO limits allowed himself and Rey to escape Jakku, he’s the one that came up with a viable plan to stop the boarders and later on he’s the one leading Han and Chewies into SKB. When Rey executes her plan it results in the rathtars being unleashed.

So, since the FO is not going anywhere the one most likely to either take the fight to them (while Luke hunts for the First temple) or keep the himself and other characters one step ahead of the FO is Finn.

Also, since he has been associated with a lightsaber, whether or not he’s FS, he’ll likely use one again. Most likely against the Knights of Ren…and since Maz has collected one saber already not hard to see Finn getting his hands on another.

Finn’s story is likely about rising to prominence and power within the universe by his actions without help from the force. A way to show that it doesn’t take mystic powers to make a difference.

 

while i agree with a lot, your reference to Rogue One a) isnt out yet (so we dont have a SW movie w/o lightsabres/force stuff, or a TV show without them - you'd think Rebels might have taken that chance, being so close to ANH where order 66 is being felt, but they brought in FS's) and b) people are still asking for Vader/Palpatine and the "is the blind guy FS", to which we dont know for sure the answers to either of those.

i think theres many people who do assume this sort of thing, as in - not FS = not important, but i went into other reasons as well. the assumption itself isnt even that off base to begin with though, as every movie in the Saga has had FS characters as the main/s (and TV shows).

what you are assuming though, is that for in order for Finn to be integral to the Saga, there has to be some message telling us "you can save the world without these mystical powers". thats a lot to assume (and speculate) without anything really backing that up.

imo the story group werent lying when saying Finn is a co-lead of the ST. but i do think after TFA his importance may very well reduce. he was important to TFA, because of what you said in your response - and more... but i think unless something entirely new happens to Finn in VIII, his chances of being reduced to 'side character' rise drastically. with the promotion of Luke from 10 seconds, to a most likely active role (or at least more screen time) it only furthers this point.

most likely against the KoR? what makes you think that/is this just speculation? same with the Maz has another lightsabre hidden away?

just saying that what we were given in TFA seems like his most important contribution and that in the future films his role may be declining - unless - im right about his FO knowledge being played up or he and Rey as a relationship are played up.

 

Why would they sideline Finn after the heavy investment in him in TFA? Finn had a clear origin story. Origin stories are usually told because they lead somewhere. It doesn't make much sense to give one of our four new generation of stars an origin story (which one out of the four didn't have at all) just to drop his development in movie 2 of a trilogy. Luke's role picking up from zero is meaningless. Where Luke had no face time in VII, Han has no face time in VIII. And true to SW form, Leia's role will remain the same. Mama bears get sidelined, not one of our two leading new heroes.

 

The focus is on Non-FS characters. Vader may show up as a villain but it's the normal people that are making a difference. The fact its coming out and that they invested so much in caste of people not FS says a lot.

Like Mrs. Kennedy said, the Saga films Primarily focus on the Skywalkers. To date those people have been FS....but there is nothing that says they have to be. Also....since she didn't say it'd focus only on the Skywalekrs that means there is more than enough room for characters like Finn to be a lead.

Let my restate...you don't need to be of the Skywalker bloodline....or otherwise special to make a difference.

http://www.slashfilm.com/jj-abrams-midi-chlorians/

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Luke's the mentor figure, his presence doesn't take away from Finn because his actions and decisions are likely driving the plot along with Rey's. This has more or less been stated by Mark Hamill who has said the old caste is there to guide and pass the torch.

Because they took the time to establish them in the film, so someone is going to have to deal with them.

She's FS and managed to get her hands on Anakin's saber, not hard to see her having another in her collection.

Since Ashokasolo already went into the significance of Finn's origin story I will not repeat the points here.

 

I think Finn should be the male lead over Luke becuase....he is the male lead over Luke.

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I voted that Finn will have more time than Luke, i also think he'll still be considered a lead character. but i do think that the story is not going to be moving from his actions and based off of the previous Saga films/TV shows, his importance will decline. I see him becoming the Han Solo of this trilogy. apart of the crew, but doesnt really impact on the plot. they've already showed, btw, through Han (and the literally the entire rebellion), that you can still be a hero without the Force.

Adept quoting JJ on TFA doesnt really help for VIII. it was also on the talk of midichlorians, which wasn't relevant or retconned or anything in TFA, i doubt itll be touched on in VIII either. like AhsokaSolo said he had his origin (and arguably his complete arc) in TFA. showing an origin in a movie doesnt necessarily mean it'll be continued with, especially if it was a fairly self contained arc. Im sure theres a lot more to him, he'd have a great story to tell, but im not sure its going to be the one we see in VIII. as ive said before, unless they put Finn in with Rey and they develop a relationship like hinted at in TFA, or, they REALLY play up his importance/knowledge on the FO (he's just a stormtrooper/they did that already in TFA) then im not sure why he'll be relevant.
if anyone can say why he'll be relevant (with the same or more screen time than TFA), rather then how he cant not be relevant ("he has to be because theres a message to it" isnt saying, in context of the canon, why he will), then i'd listen and could even be swayed.