Books A/V DARK DISCIPLE (Ventress/Vos novel) (spoilers)

I can't remember the last time I Liked something so hard so fast.

But like, I wouldn't even want to confess to being the dupe they conned into writing the scripts into Dark Disciple, so...

 

Is it a compliment if you distort their creation so badly that it becomes only a superficial resemblance to the original?

 

I actuallybloved the book. It'd have been great if they replaced Vos with practically any other male Jedi.

 

I'd prefer and even secretly hope (despite the fact that I am certain it will never happen) that LFL re-releases Dark Disciple with a different and original character instead of Vos. It would still be a cringe worthy, cliche and unreadable book for my taste, but at least they'd maintain the integrity of the fantastic original story of Quinlan Vos.

 

I was hesitant about posting that and was felt slightly guilty but that is ultimately how I feel. I can't really apologise for that.


Dark Disciple was just a train wreck and the writing was horrendous. "Full Gambit"? Adult content?



Since the cancellation I've become conflicted on the show.

It has reached a point where I don't really think about Season 6, Crystal Crisis, Bad Batch and Dark Disciple.
I appreciate them doing an awful lot (I really do*.)

But I take in the stuff and just wonder was the show that different? Did it do stupid stuff every week? Was the writing bad and I just gave it a pass?
How would I have taken it if it was released properly?
I still think Dark Disciple would have been awful.


Have I changed? Or has the post Season 5 openedmy eyes to just how "silly" and "stupid" the show was?

-Willing to clarfiy anything.

*I am really grateful for what Lucasfilm has done for the fans and how they have tried very hard to please everyone.
The live streams for the conventions for instance goes a long way. The Legacy project.

BUT the handling of some stuff is terrible, where is the UK dvd/blu-ray release for the Lost Missions? It didn't arive on Netflix for a while afterwards so it is likely stuck because of rights. I don't really want to import it for more than I should have to.

 

I don't see how it makes any difference to the story of Legends Vos what's written about Canon Vos, honestly. There's like a couple of small nods to the former in TCW that don't work anymore, but overall they're two separate continuities.

(This is not to defend Dark Disciple in any way, mind you).

 

I suppose it all depends on whether you enjoyed his depiction in the CW series and the DD novel, and I did. Do I think the character born of the comics was better...yes, but without the animated series and this novel, Vos would have likely faded into obscurity.

 

Obviously I can't stand TCW Vos.

As I've said before, I'd rather have Vos remain as he was in the comics than get this insulting version of him.

And please note that this is how I feel regarding the canon Vos, I realize that you like him and that is your right.

 

Found the book at a B&N today but had no interest in it all.
Probably will read it eventually but am not interested right now.

 

As someone who never read the Republic comics I really liked this. I wonder if that is the determining factor in whether or not someone enjoys this book. I was more upset about Dooku's portrayal than I was about Quinlan's, obviously because I haven't seen much of Vos before, other than reading his Wookieepedia article.

 

FWIW, I was far more dismayed with Ventress' portrayal than I was with Vos. That said, I felt like nearly every character in this novel seemed like some strange alternate universe version of themselves, so I suppose saying that I liked one portrayal more than another really isn't saying much for me.

 

No that isn't it.

It is because it is just a horrible book, the writing is terrible, the story is silly, the charaxters are inconsistent.

It highlights all of TCW weaknesses and shows just how stupid SW is.


I can (probably will) elaborate on the Force especially just how much of a silly concept that does not work in this book.

I enjoyed it but it was very bad.

 

The book is out now in paperback in the UK.

 

I finally got around to reading this book, so I hope it's alright if I bring this thread back for a bit just to give my current thoughts on it. I'm about halfway through the book, and disappointingly, I can kind of see why a lot of people have found problems with it(note: I have not looked at any spoilers yet, i'm simply here to give my thoughts so far in the book) It's blatantly obvious just how much this book really was ripped straight from the cancelled Clone Wars episodes. I know that they made it clear that that was the idea, but I think it hurt the book more than did it any justice. A lot of the characters don't really fit well with their in-canon counterparts, mainly Ventress and Vos. The story, for the most part, is pretty underwhelming, and a lot of the books moments just generally feel very unnecessary, as they were clearly thrown in solely for romance between Ventress and Vos.

I also agree with many people who are saying that a thing that really hurt the book, is using Vos over just about anybody. If I had it my way... I would have chosen Obi-wan. It would have been perfect. Obi-wan and Ventress had such chemistry through out the series, even if it was mostly playful, so it's a shame we don't get to see more of that just before her end. Had they switched Vos out with obi-wan, I could actually see Ventress, legitimately growing feelings for the guy, even if Obi-wan would never feel the same way.

That said, So far, I do think this would have been a great arc in the Clone Wars episode since I think the filler is what hurt this book the most.

 

That's an interesting point, considering the flirtation we've previously seen between Obi-wan and Ventress. I don't think Lucas would have permitted Obi to have that type of relationship though, especially not that long after the death of Satine. Vos is more of a "grey" Jedi, where Obi seemed like more of a "by the book" type - so him falling for a Sith assassin / Nightsister / bounty hunter likely wasn't possible in the eyes of Lucas and Filoni. Not to mention, the younger fans of CW would be pretty shocked to see Obi sleeping with the enemy, as one of the most significant heroes in the saga...

 

I finally got around to reading Dark Disciple a while back. I thought it was pretty interesting overall, but just an average read.

 

just finished reading this and thought vos was op and just didn't enjoy it for that reason. we watch the movies and dooku beats anakin and obi wan in combat and holds yoda to a stalemate long enough to escape and is renowned as one of if not the best swordsman ever yet im meant to believe that this vos bloke wipes the floor with him and can kill him multiple times in the book. then it contradicts episode 3-6 by when anakin turns to the dark side obi wan believes anakin is lost and can't be redeemed yet this bloke fell to the darkside twice in the book and came back.

 

This... both of these. The latter especially. Like I might grant the former if Dooku was having a bad day (there's a video for that too -- they animated part of that scene), but Quinlan killing a ton of people, including Jedi who were his friends, plus getting a couple of second chances and screwing every single one up in the worst possible way... it completely undermines what happened to Anakin. Heck at this point they should have Quinlan show up in Rebels as an Inquisitor. He could have an epic angst battle against Maul.

 

My Incredibly Harsh Review of Dark Disciple

By. C.T. Phipps

Yeah, I don't know how to summarize my opinions on this book. I don't want to to insult Christie Golden as I absolutely adore her and still consider her novel, Arthas, one of my all-time favorite novels. Certainly, she can do romance since I found the Jaina Proudmoore/Arthas Menethil romance to be one of my favorite in the World of Warcraft universe. But this? Well, I just didn't like it.

Before we begin, I should also mention this book isn't like Star Wars: Bloodline or Lost Stars. It's not a book a causal Star Wars fan can just pop open and read. Instead, this book depends heavily on your knowledge of The Clone Wars television show. Much of the story focuses on popular villainess Ventress, Count Dooku's brief Sith apprentice, and is designed to wrap up her story arc that was cut short by the show being cancelled. I understand this book was supposed to be a few episodes on television and it's a shame they weren't filmed since I think they might have worked better on screen.

The premise of the book is Count Dooku orders the extermination of an entire planet of innocent aliens and the Jedi Knighthood decides this is the bridge too far. They must assassinate Count Dooku and rid the world of the Sith once and for all (oh, how little they know). Rather than send Anakin Skywalker, who is HILARIOUSLY just sitting in a corner waiting for them to call him, they decide to send Jedi Master Quinlan Vos to recruit Asajj Ventressin order to help him do this.

Okay, this stinks because I'm not even finished with the summary and there's already way too much wrong with this to properly parse. First of all, Count Dooku was intending to survive the Clone Wars. He was keeping his hands clean while General Grevious did all the dirty work and atrocities. You're telling me he ordered an Alderaan-scale massacre and pretty much no one noticed?

Next, the Jedi Knights sending Quinlan Vos after him is a hard enough pill to swallow. I'm not sure what the canon Quinlan brings to the table which would allow him to defeat the galaxy's greatest swordmsan after Mace, Yoda, Anakin, and Obi-Wan. What is Quinlan Vos' special ability that makes them think he can take Dooku? It's certainly isn't psychometry. That doesn't help fight a Form II Master.

After that, we go into the fact the Jedi Council wants Quinlan Vos to join up with Ventress, a failed SITH LORD. Shouldn't the Jedi Knights be trying to track her down and arrest her for all of the war crimes she committed? Yeah, I regret she's come to regret being a Sith but even if the Jedi are planning on offering her a pardon to help kill Dooku, this seems like an insanely risky plan for almost no reward.

The story proceeds to go on with Quinlan hooking up with Asajj as a bounty hunter before they start a flirtatious relationship which, eventually, blossoms into love. After Quinlan reveals he's a Jedi, which she already knew, Asajj starts teaching him the Dark Side of the Force so he can have the power to defeat Dooku. Quinlan, a supposed Jedi Master, thinks this is a good idea and things go pear-shaped from there. Not the least because it turns out that Asajj has done bad things to Jedi Quinlan knows.

My God, I really don't know how to judge this book because there's just so much nonsensical stuff going on here which never gets sold to me as the reader before something equally weird happens. The stuff I listed above is just the beginning, really. I mean, I don't even know where to begin analyzing the stuff which didn't work for me because I can't just say everything.

Let's go with the fact the majority of the book is a romance, or an attempt to do a romance. The portrayal of the book is Ventress is a skilled seductress and femme fatale who Vos finds captivating. Well, I guess some people would find Ventress appealing. She's certainly a dominant female and Dark Side ladies have their appeal but mostly I've always found her a really nasty character with a smoker's voice.

Even so, there's a history of her and Obi-Wan Kenobi flirting, which gets mentioned. I could maybe, kinda, buy them having an attraction since he's the opposite to her in virtually every way. The Yin to the Yang and vice versa. Quinlan Vos generally acts like a complete pushover who tosses aside decades of training to go along with her statement the Dark Side is more powerful. What does Ventress see in him? Especially, you know, when he goes from following her around like a puppy to murderous rage?

There's also a bit where Count Dooku decides to team up with Quinlan Vos to try to take down Emperor Palpatine. This is actually the one part of the book I liked. Unfortunately, it occupies only a small section of it and goes in some bizarre directions. Not the least of which being that Count Dooku only wanted to kill the Emperor because Palpatine ordered him to kill Ventress in the first place, eventually resulting in the destruction of the Nightsisters. Getting some of that complicated relationship deconstructed would have been great but do we? No. Also, Quinlan Vos while Drunk on the Dark SideTM is able to kick Dooku's butt from here to Mustafar.

Which, no, I'm sorry, I don't buy that.

No spoilers since Revenge of the Sith happened but Quinlan Vos doesn't kill Count Dooku in the end. The thing is, the Jedi Knighthood learns a "lesson" about the evils of assassination and vow never to do it again. Except, in Revenge of the Sith, Anakin is feted for killing Count Dooku and they intend to do the same thing with Palpatine. They also send Obi-Wan to (successfully) kill General Grevious. So they learned exactly nothing from the events of this book.

As a finale for Asajj Ventress' story arc, I have to say I was rather disappointed in it as well. Ventress, for all of her flaws, was one of the most formidable female characters in the Star Wars Expanded Universe(s). I never quite bought her redemption stories, though, because all of her personality was focused on being a ruthless murdering psychopath.

Here, she never really rejects the Dark Side and when she does, it's for the somewhat prosaic reason of romantic love. I can't help but think I would have preferred her story to have something less traditional like wanting to take down Dooku for his crimes or facing Anakin Skywalker. Indeed, in the Republic comics, Ventress' best death (she had several) was when Anakin murdered her to protect the secret of his marriage. A pity that wasn't her canonical end.

I can't say I much cared for the book's interpretation of Quinlan Vos either. The character was popularized by Jon Ostrander in the Republic comics before being brought to mainstream canon by the The Clone Wars show. He had an extensive arc where he was corrupted by the Dark Side, tried to assassinate Count Dooku, and fell in love with a beautiful thief but this story lacks all of that story's oomph. We also don't have Aalya Secura as Quinlan Vos' padawan in this book, which seems just plain strange given her popularity.

In conclusion, I recommend reading the Wookieepedia summary of the book instead of actually reading it.

4/10

 

Wow I did not know those animatics existed. Go Dooku! The Count's still spry and limber for an old fellow.

 

at Dooku spinning Boba and Latts in circles.

 

As a Dooku fan myself, if you read Republic, you would be even more upset.

Seriously, what transpired between Vos and Dooku in this novel was utter nonsense.

 

I often wonder if that would have been preferable to what they did to the Mandalorians just to give Obi-Wan a love interest. Although, that really isn't the biggest problem with the romance in Dark Disciple. The more she fell in love, the more that defined her as a character, which made her dreadfully dull as a result in comparison to what was in the show (seeing as how she was one of the few things I liked about TCW).