ST Rey & Kylo Ren in Episode IX

We’ve all been repeating ourselves endlessly for ages!

Certain mysteries need not be answered to make the story comprehensible (such as how Maz got the saber). Certain mysteries must be (character motivations, for example).

Daisy thought there were plenty of questions left by TLJ for fans to chew over - “with answers come more questions.”

I take that as validating fans wondering what or why something happened, or what the truth of xyz is.

 

@oncafar I would gladly discuss that further since I have a couple of theories but this is definitely not the thread for it.
Where do we meet?
* The Knights of Ren in Ep IX?
* Mark Hamill (Luke Skywalker) In Episode IX
* Mark Hamill (Luke Skywalker) in the ST

What do you think? I'd gladly move the discussion from here...

 

If it's solely about the past, then maybe Luke ST?

 

Agreed.
See you there.

 

Now I want to see Rey asking R2 to show her all the events of the OT, PT and everything else he saw. I'm only half kidding.

 

I had to check that I wasn't in the Luke thread.

For those who want to discuss Kylo Ren and Rey's dynamic: Do you think they will continue to see each other/communicate through their connection in IX?

 

Theories of "kylo isn't responsible for the temple massacre" keep showing since TFA released. I remember of "what if Han wasn't killed by Kylo, maybe Han activated the lightsaber?"

 

Maybe. I think the ability to do it is there, but I don't believe either will want to use it come beginning of IX. Rey is done with Kylo Ren. Kylo Ren knows Rey is done with him. They will have went their separate ways. However, events will bring them into contact again, and events might prompt one of them to use it. But I don't know what events.

Rey might use it for: deception (prompted by Resistance plan), warning (do not do X, or there will be Y consequence--I'd prefer not to do Y but I can't allow X), question (prompted by some action taken by Kylo that has some significance in the Force regarding whatever supposed purpose the Force still has for Ben), Luke's messenger (lol - I think this would be kind of terrible, but Rey translates everything Chewie says and she's already been in this messenger role a lot), Good bye Ben

Kylo: threat (if you do X, I will do Y), ceasefire (could be a deception), some final action (apology, goodbye, "this is the end for you," "you were right")

I really would expect it not to reopen though unless Rey reopens it. I kind of think Kylo would think that Rey doesn't want to talk to him, they are past that, and would be trying to move on/away from that. If Rey reopens it, I'd expect Kylo to be the more reticent/hesitant/wary/uncertain/whatever; and Rey the more forward.

Another option: FG Luke could call a session and create a 3-way call, ETA or Rey could ask him to do that

 

That would be seriously cool!

 

How about Leia's death?
To start again, a reload from the common gound that brought them together: Loneliness, grief over the loss of someone they both loved.
That would be a fresh start, I think. Beyond the "What you did" "What you want", "What you have done"... simply searching comfort for the loss of a dear one.

 

I have a feeling Leia’s death will send them into the saw orbit again. Kylo’s attachments are still his weaknesses. Hux will exploit this. I think they will both be grieving Leia’s passing and they will find each other in that mutual outpouring of emotion.

 

Well the powers that be have been suggesting that Ep. IX is going to touch on all the trilogies. Plus this is the end of the Skywalker Saga.It would be kinda cool if Rey binged the whole Skywalker saga to get the full context of everything going on.

Maybe it's not too crazy to think that Rey will start off by asking R2 to show her what happened the night of the temple massacre and then R2 will bloop and bleep and Rey will say, "what do you mean there's more? Yes...by all means...show me everything". Let's ignore the memory wiping issue. They can work around that.

Something like that would be so fan servicey and possibly maudlin but also...maybe super cool and helpful for Rey to understand how to defeat her enemies.

 

I'm not sure anymore that Leia will die. What if they actually have enough footage to work with to kind of make it seem like she is still alive? I wonder if they could create some situation out of it in which Kylo is faced with whether he will directly kill his mother.

 

I’m not sure what they will be able to bring together but this old passage from Empire’s End suggests they really did anticipate Leia being the one to work through this with Ben in the end more.

Leia bit her lower lip, refusing to concede. “No. It was Snoke.”

Han drew back slightly. “Snoke?”

She nodded. “He knew our child would be strong with the Force. That he was born with equal potential for good or evil.”

“You knew this from the beginning? Why didn’t you tell me?”

She sighed. “Many reasons. I was hoping that I was wrong, that it wasn’t true. I hoped I could sway him, turn him away from the dark side, without having to involve you.” A small smile appeared.

“You had—you have—wonderful qualities, Han, but patience and understanding were never among them. I was afraid that your reactions would only drive him farther to the dark side. I thought I could shield him from Snoke’s influence and you from what was happening.” Her voice dropped. “It’s clear now that I was wrong. Whether your involvement would have made a difference, we’ll never know.”

He had trouble believing what he was hearing. “So Snoke was watching our son.”

“Always,” she told him. “From the shadows, in the beginning, even before I realized what was happening, he was manipulating everything, pulling our son toward the dark side.” - Empire's End

 

It was from the TFA adult novel.

 

I actually thought it was from the TFA novel but when seeking out the quote again found that reference to Empire’s End elsewhere and copied and trusted it.

Oh well.

Would be interesting if they actually had filmed some of those moments between Fisher and Ford somehow.

 

That's Alan Dean Foster, The Force Awakens, page 196

 

Or maybe it was Snoke guiding Kylo's hand?

 

Kylo managed to kill Snoke and Snoke didn't even notice the lightsaber next to him was moving so I don't think so. There's no reason to put Kylo's crimes in someone else's hands in the last movie

 

From a narrative perspective, IX has to do the opposite. Kylo is our villain. They can't make him less scary at this point, unless they killed Snoke off to bring in a random new villain to tie up the Skywalker Saga... which makes the kind of sense that doesn't.

 

I agree, especially when Kylo has wanted to achieve what he grandfather didn't and he has. A Skywalker as Supreme Leader/Emperor is a big deal.

 

Oh yes, they can.
They already have:



Or perhaps you find this cute?

 

Some of the greatest villains are comical: 007 Jaws comes to mind or Blofeld, in You Only Live Twice. Batman's Joker (Jack Nicholson's version). Vizzini from The Princess Bride.. the list is quite long.
And the louder they laugh, the scariest they are.