ST Rey & Kylo Ren in Episode IX

I don't think it's a big deal, but I think the actual on screen set up is for Rey and Chewie to be in the dark about events.

 

All my favourite sequel trilogy characters...and some guy who's not appeared once yet.

 

Exactly, Luke only said he saw a city in the clouds, unless Bespin is the only city in the clouds in the Galaxy, something happened off screen for Luke to know it's exact location.

 

The article's crap.

The debate will be over some day, maybe after TROS is out. Maybe it won't; but I won't be paying any atention, since its subject matter, Reylo, is crap.

The only element about Reylo that I find of some interest is that of them being strangers (=not family) That's nothing to do with reylo, though. Rey and Finn and Poe and Hux are strangers too.

I mean: theoretically, you could have both Rey and Ben not being family and Rey and Ben being Skywalkers.

Thrawn (Thrawn novel) talks about UR children gifted with precog abilities. Their generic name is sky-walker. Maybe that's where Shmi took the name from. But nothing about those sky-walkers being family.

In TPM there was a fatherless, special child; let's say there had been another fatherless, special child like Anakin at the time in another corner of the galaxy. Both would have been 'Skywalker' in a sense. 'Family', insofar they shared the same singularity and susceptible of sharing a connection just like the one Rey and Ben/Kylo share.

Let's say Rey belonged to 'the clan', and was created by Palpatine. Maybe Anakin bridged 10yo Ben and Rey since her conception, or maybe he curved Palpatine's ball by choosing the mother/aprents, knowing that she/them would cross paths with 'our' Skywalker family. Or both things. They would share the special aspect (Skywalker), but not real world bloodline.

The tecnique, 'Sky-walkerization' if you will, (establishing red, binding threads of fate between strangers) could be used to create more 'Sky-walkers', a network of persons immune to the PT/OT/ST sith manipulations, or, if manipulated, redeemable and capable of ultimately shifting the tide. Then those individuals could be made to form a hidden order of guardians and protectors, like a secret society of samurai monks or something. Let's call them jedi, to borrow an honor an older term.

Maybe that's happened several times already -Anakin's been busy- and they are waiting to be mutually 'connected' o awakened, post TROS. The new jedi are already around, jedi and rebels and 'family' at the same time. I wonder if that was the idea behind broom boy (originally called 'child of the force') That slave would be one of those anonymous Skywalker guys.

'If Skywalker returns, the new jedi will rise'. The rise of Skywalker, the rise of the new jedi. - if Anakin returned.

Anakin, TPM: 'I had a dream. I came back and freed all the slaves'

Rey adopting the Skywalker name in spite of not being 'real world' family would make sense in this way.

 

@ScreamingWoman2019

Thanks for your clarification. The rest of your post though sounds like an interesting premise of which we are never going to see.

Reason number 397 why this ST is seemingly convoluted storytelling and leaving us to write everything for them.

You're absolutely right: Why does Rey care about saving Kylo Ren? Why does she heel-turn about him so fast...a simple force vision? It definitely is disingenuous that the same vision says Kylo hasn't chosen a side when for over 5 years he's been a dark side grim reaper through the galaxy. And etc., etc., etc.

I disagree with one aspect of your post -- there's no real sound messaging or theme at all for the ST, so having Rey forgive Ren due to familial relation is just as believable and ok at this point as any thing else so far. And yes, just as shallow a reason in the 11th hour as well.

How the last film in the trilogy, let alone the SAGA is going to turn it all around and explain itself in 2 1/2 hours will be interesting to see indeed.

 

Who could ever want to see poor little Benny Ball suffer?

 

Re Rey’s heel-turn:

A friend of mine postulates that there was a scene filmed that bridged the cave scene and the hut scene, and that it was cut. (See also: The pretty vital Caretaker deleted scene.) It *is* a jarring change, no matter one’s theory re Rey’s and Kylo’s relationship. For example, *even if* Rey/Kylo were “enemies to lovers” (which they’re not) there’s some transition missing. (And yes, I have read/watched plenty of enemies-to-lovers stories in my life.) This has clearly been acknowledged by reylo fanfic writers who prior to TLJ required many, many chapters to get Rey and Kylo from enemies to lovers.

In short: The Rey/Kylo dynamic change may be so WTF due to bad editing choices.

 

What 'dynamic change'? What's missing?

 

People get really touchy about the Rey/Ben plotline. I think Rey is simply fascinated by the guy and how he came to be who he is. He’s a young, relatively good looking guy who she openly calls a monster. But how did he get that way? She doesn’t join him after repeated offers.

 

^Ditto

 

I don't think she's fascinated by him or finds him appealing. Nor do I think she has compassion for him. But she's been in his mind, and she's had a vision. Whatever she saw in his mind and the vision is what is driving her when it comes to Kylo Ren.

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Reylo would be so much more acceptable if Kylo had an ounce of good in his body.

Like, if he was more calm and reasonable outside of combat instead of yelling and smashing everything, or if he was fair and always worked to minimize unnecessary bloodshed instead of just killing everything that lives.

He's so violent and cartoonishly evil that I can't buy him being "conflicted" about anything, and it's extremely frustrating that the makers of the film keep saying he is rather than showing it.

I can't imagine this guy being a loving husband/father, and LFL used narrative cheats like magic hand touches to force Rey into caring for him rather than putting effort into having them legitimately challenge each other's viewpoints.

Well-written Reylo (romantic or not) could be an excellent storyline, but this isn't how you do it. Sorry about the rant.

 

Apparently in the new book, he’s cracking down on dissent as the Supreme Leader? I’m beginning to wonder if we’ll find out Han and Leia took the wrong kid home from the hospital.

 

I don’t think she finds him appealing either. My comment about his looks is more about how someone who seemingly should be a decent person (Han and Leia are his parents) is instead a murderer. I’d be curious about his background. That’s the obvious thing to ponder. Hearing Ben’s interpretation of the hut encounter made her see how someone COULD potentially feel the way he does, but even then, she doesn’t embrace the guy.

 

He is quite calm when force-skyping with her. If anything, she's the angry one during those conversations. She hasn't seen most of his angry outbursts.

 

Ben is a liar and a manipulator. Rey tried to connect with Luke, but overall he was a distant grump, meaning Rey’s confidence in him was low. She bought into the twisted narrative because feasibly her own treatment could’ve resembled Ben’s own. She saw the mythical legend of Luke wasn’t what she expected it to be, and perhaps there was more to that.

 

How is Rey's confidence 'low', but somehow she's confident enough that she can whip off to save Ben's soul? That takes some balls, ya now. A Rey with lower confidence wouldn't have suddenly think she could do that. She would feel immense pressure that she couldn't live up to. She's probably break down. If anything. Not rush off to play OT Luke Skywalker.

And even so, just because Luke didn't turn out to be welcoming of her (even though he helps her) why would she decide to to sympathize with Kylo? They don't have the same upbringing at all. The film wants us to buy into Kylo's POV notion that they're both alone, or lonely, or whatever. That they were both abandoned by their parents. But this isn't true. Rey was abandoned by her family. Ben is the perpetuator of his loneliness. He abandoned them.

From their interactions, there is no reason why Rey should suddenly start being sympathetic or even interested in Kylo Ren. A sad story about how Luke almost attacked him one night, and then Ben attacked him back and killed a bunch of students isn't sympathetic. It's also not sympathetic to Luke either. So really, after hearing about their drama, and tagging along with grump Luke for a few days, Rey should be ready to just leave them both to it. Just fly back to Leia and be done with their petty Skywalker drama, which she shouldn't really care about.

 

Rey’s confidence in Luke is low. She doesn’t respect the guy to the point she whips out the sabre and yells at him. Rey asks Ben to call off the fleet bombardment - that’s fair. She can only ask, but that request is rebuffed, destroying any hope Rey had in brokering peace. Luke was sitting around doing nothing and Rey wanted to do something.

 

It’s the combination of those factors you correctly mentioned, IMO, that couldn’t be enough individually. Along with even more factors that IX will reveal like a suggested ancestral force bond from their grandfather’s 30 year master and apprentice relationship, and her growing dark side connectivity as Rey Palpatine leading to emotional impulsivity and poor decision-making. It’s a grand combination of all of those elements.

We must never forget that it was presented as an emotional low point for her tied to her family and loneliness that lead her to bonding with the dark sider. The force vision of the future is what brought it home after that. And all of it... positioned as something she doesn’t want to do and is working to not do moving forward.

It’s not only one thing but multiple things combining.

By giving her character traits where she lacks certain social perceptions from her unusual childhood, or how she idealizes the idea of what family could be due to the issues she has with her own and possibly wanting to help another family she admired since hers is gone, or how she can talk herself into something unlikely happening simply because she wishes it could be so, or emotional impulsivity development due to dark side vulnerability, or possible physical attraction to him, she gains personality traits. Not all personality traits should be positive ones IMO. If you don’t like her because of aspects of her personality that have emerged that’s of course your right.

Yes, they might lead her toward missteps but overcoming all of them in her final showdown in the end will help her grow.

 

Ok. All of that is fair. But why does that lead to Rey sympathizing or becoming interested in Kylo Ren? Those two things aren't behaviorally related.

Or are you saying that she's so disappointed in Luke, that she's like..."man this Kylo guy was right. He's got a sad story about how crappy Luke is, boy I can relate to that. I mean, Luke didn't try to kill me, and I didn't kill a bunch of students yet, or my father, or commit genocide. But I like this Kylo guy now. Hey Kylo got anymore Crappy Luke stories?"