Lit Fleet Junkie Flagship- The technical discussions of the GFFA (Capital Ships thread Mk. II)

Back on my bull****.





1 = MC85 (3, red)
2 = MC75 (9, yellow)
3= Beefy Nebbie (24, orange)
4= Neb-B (5, pink)
5 = MC80(?) (7, green)
6 = Vakbeor (8, blue)
7 = Bunkerbuster (2, purple)
8 = Neb-C (3, brown)
9 = Pelta (2, dark red)

Oh, Home One is there too.



--Adm. Nick

 

First decent look at the Neb-BF I believe. It kind of looks like the love child of a Assault Frigate Mk II and a Nebulon-B.

 

That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.That shot looks so absurd.

 

I wonder if they think that shot looks so absurd?

 

????????????

What??

 

What I wrote was very basic right? I could have written a more in depth and detailed account of my feelings for this fleet scene, but it would have taken me much longer. The same is true of this scene. Most of the cgi kit bashed models are almost certainly not up to the quality standard needed for close up detailed shots that can fill the screen, so instead the screen is filled with tiny, far away shots of thousands of copies of the basic models, hoping that the shear number will amaze us. I could easily have done that too with just a few more pastes and spammed you with thousands of lines of my single sentence but i'm sure the mods here would have been just as impressed as I was by that fleet scene in TROS, and I'd have got a nice holiday away from this forum

 

I still get struck with the awe of the moment of seeing the galaxy finally have enough of Palpatine's crap and brought whatever ships they could to the fight. You go on and on about copy and paste over and over and for goodness sakes, the galaxy does build more than one ship of a single class!!!!! I don't care if there are 100 MC85 star cruisers or 10,000 Nebulon-Cs or Vakbeor-class or 20 types of Mon Calamari variant cruisers or 500,000 GX1 short haulers, it means the galaxy has more than 100 ships in total.

 

Well I actually thought that the ships in TFA, certainly the Nebulon C with it's missing port side wings and other outer panels, would be unique (@AdmiralNick22 another Neb C right at the very bottom left just before the picture border angles up, ship face on, see the two starboard horizontal wings?). Now here are many Nebulon C all with identical missing parts. How likely is that? Yes it shows the galaxy has more than 100 ships but what it also does is shrink the galaxy to a tiny size, where ships from anywhere and everywhere in the galaxy can just come together so quickly. The ST has broken the sense of distance of space and time of travel in hyperspace.

 

I dunno, I'd consider myself a minimalist. But if I'm contradicted by official sources, then I guess I have no choice but to keep that to my headcanon

Btw, is there a count on how many Rebel capital ships were at Endor? The canon section of Wookieepedia just says at least 15 Calamari cruisers...but if the final number isn't significantly larger than 15 then I don't see how the Rebels could have won.

 

I think that, at least in the newcanon, a significant section of the fleet simply fled once the Executor had gone down, instead of staying to fight.

 

I go with at least 40 Mon Calamari Star Cruisers being present at Endor based on the Rebel Command Fleet page (a combination of Home One and her sister ships, Liberty and her sister ships, the wingless Liberty types [at least eight] and smaller ships like the MC40a's and the other Mon Calamari light cruiser identified by ECHenry [I call it the MC55 light cruiser]).

 

What I find "absurd" is taking the filmmakers to task for a flaw that becomes apparent only if you carefully study a screencap in excruciating detail. The shot is three, maybe four seconds long in the film - tops. Frankly, if it even rises to the level of "blooper" it's only because much more was made of it than it deserves.

 

You were there, Captain - you must have noticed it. The sudden loss of coordination between crew members and ships; the loss of efficiency and discipline. The loss, in short, of that elusive quality we call fighting spirit.

 

I'm sorry, but this claim in LUDICROUS. Travel times make zero sense in ALL of the films. In the OT, we go from Alderaan to Yavin in a matter of hours, not days. In AOTC, 200 Jedi make it to Geonosis from Coruscant in a jiffy. In ROTS, Palpatine can travel from Coruscant to Mustafar in hours, like he is driving to the corner market.

Travel speed is always dictated by the needs of the plot. Period.

--Adm. Nick

 

That would only be a factor if the Rebels outnumbered the Imperials by a large margin and the Empire was actually dependent on Palpatine's battle meditation to win.

 

The proportions of the stern, with a relatively solid-looking connecting keel and compact engine module at the stern, look a lot like some versions of the the Assault Frigate Mk. 1 - specifically the Jeff Carlisle version in Starships of the Galaxy...

The basic Assault Frigate concept allows a lot of variation - reduce the hull to retain only the reworked forward fuselage and the structural core of the stern, and add a new ventral structure forward and engine section aft. I'd be perfectly okay with these being actual Assault Frigates, if the scale is right.

Of course, speaking speculatively, these could be something that applies the same Assault Frigate concept to a ship-type other than the Dreadnaught Cruiser. Say, something big, pointy and Imperial.

Or they could be something completely different, like a Hutt ship.

I'd be happy with all of those options too.

On other topics:

* I think the Rebel fleet at Endor was probably smaller, and certainly less well-armed, but they've always been characterised as throwing all their ships into the fight - and they had a definite superiority in missile-armed fighters, as well as engaging the Imperial fleet at close range, where they could concentrate their capital ships against elements of the formation and defeat them in detail (even against Executor, once Ackbar gets into the spirit of Lando's improvised new plan).

* As I suspect everyone knows, there are two well-established retcons for outwardly inconsistent travel times in Star Wars: for one thing, there are some fast hyperlanes where travel is far quicker - these are generally portrayed as just being there, but there are a few examples (like the secret Imperial freight route to Endor in the pre-reboot continuity) of fast hyperlanes being created artificially by parking special generators in suspace to sustain high performance; and secondly, a hyperdrive which needs a maintenance overhaul between "flights" - like the Falcon or a Venator - is depicted as way faster than one designed to "cruise" reliably for months or years - like that of an ISD (there are hard numbers in the Thrawn trilogy, where the Falcon's sustained speed is depicted as around forty times faster than that of an ISD). A lot of the movie trilogy is taking place along fast hyperlanes (Coruscant is the focus of the entire network, Tatooine is a smuggling hub, and the Rebels would be idiots to place Yavin, Dantooine or Hoth anywhere else), whereas in the Thrawn trilogy, the Rebel-vs-Imperial fight has statlemated into slow-moving "trench warfare" in the Borderlands - a region of space between the fast hyperlanes.

- The Imperial Ewok

 

Palpatine probably just loved lightspeed skipping until he ended up where he wanted to be

 

I really have to say I don't think the combined proton torpedo load of even several squadrons of B-wings is enough to compensate for a deficiency of capital ships in a fleet engagement. Missile-armed fighters are good for raiding enemy convoys and threatening transports or their escorts. Against a top-of-the-line battleship...probably not so much. Also, didn't we establish a while back that Calamari cruisers rely more on fighting at long range and can't hold up in a point-blank shootout?

 

Hey Admiral, in that giant fleet shot do we get any side view pictures of the Corellian Gunship? It immediately popped out to me when I saw it in the trailer, true beaut of ship!!
(Don't worry this is from the trailer)

 

Yes the PT also broke the sense of distance of space and travel at times, though not at all to the same degree imho (HS skipping ). The OT never broke that sense of galaxy scale for me.

 

Absolutely. Distinguishing hyperlanes (natural and arifticial) from typical hyperspace slogging is the key to all of this. I have some crazy hyperspace ideas too about treating it as as a sphere with depth, angular velocity, and mass "pressure" to account for the variation and engine types.

I also like to think that the shuttle, Rogue One, had access to an S-Thread hyperlane to Scarif, which the Rebels from Yavin were able to utilise.

 

Wait wait, what's this about "fast hyperlanes" and "special generators"? Is this Mass Effect now?

 

https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/S-thread