Lit Rebirthing Legends ideas in new canon by transferring them to new characters, locations, eras etc.

If corded lightsabers show up in canon, it should be before the Jedi become “the guardians of peace and justice in the Old Republic”.

 

You know i was listening to a podcast and they brought up a good point.

If you really do have to tweak any part of a character to the point they are no longer the character why bring them in the first place...Granted George Lucas didn't follow that philopshy however I feel in his case for some of the stuff it was more he saw a design in one of his movies and decided "Lets do that but do it my way" not great of course but still...I can see the thinking.


@ColeFardreamer

Idea....Merging concepts of civilization

like in Legends, the Rakatan Empire was responsible for a lot of stuff (Very ancient aliens) BUT ...Even though Rakta Prime the planet is still a thing I wonder if a lot of the "These planets have Darkside energy" because of the Ratakan they give that to the Sith Empire/Civilization.

 

@Jid123Sheeve

To Vergere your idea: Is it really dark side energy or just Force energy? Can energy even be evil or is it only what you make of it?

The idea of tainted energy and places stems from shamanism in the real world where the ether, the universal energy field can be imprinted with information and said information is what gives the neutral engery its flair if someone else subconsciously enters said locale and recieves this imprinted information of an earlier visitor/event in this place. Which subsequently lead to cleansing rituals via various techniques, including smoke rituals and others to remove the imprint from the energy ether and return it to its natural state or overwrite it with a positive imprint, much like the Jedi try with building their temples over dark side sites.

I guess, in SW, residual Force energy can be imprinted with information that to a new reciepient may wear heavy on his soul to the point of feeling uneasy or corrupting the person if no natural defenses are up mentally and emotionally.

But if we look at TESB and the Vision cave-tree-temple Luke enters, when he asks Yoda what is in there he gets a reply of: "Only what you take with you!"

The cave is a place of energy that mirrors what you bring into it and throws it back at you. Luke entered with fear and got shown his greatest fears: Facing Vader and becoming like him. But Yoda's comment actually means the place is rich in neutral energy that adapts to its visitors! The place is not evil itself. It may seem as if tempting and tricking you, if you expect that. For nobody rarely is at that level of peace that it would not find anything to throw at you that will shock or surprise you. But if one would be such a Master of the self and the Force, that is what it would be, a calm serene cave temple.

So here we have the movies telling us, the Force, its energy always is neutral. Something the Jedi of old may not have known or believed always given their habit of doing stuff to places they believed to be tainted. Maybe new wisdom Yoda achieved in his last stages of life, hmm?

He never was hiding near a dark side spot. He was enjoying a rich Force Energy heaven he knew would throw at any enemy approaching him what he feared most. Perfect hiding hole, perfect defense, as well as explains why Yoda was happy and in joking mood when Luke encountered him first. He only knew the best of energies himself there.


So back to places rich in the dark side.. if not dark per se but just rich in energy... why would Jedi of old believe them tainted? Why would the dark side spots devoid of life like deserted Korriban etc. be rich in energy despite being lifeless compared to flourishing vibrant Dagobah?

Maybe the Jedi building temples over dark side nexi was not to cleanse them but to harness their power, their neutral Force energy power. It is not to heal the places but to control them. Like crusaders turned many mosques into churches upon conquering the land, and like many ancient builders had constructed temples and churches in special places said to be of energetic quality (like on leylines). Sounds like your Jedi Crusaders of old doesn't it? Besides even deserts are full of life, Korriban looks devastated to eyes attributing desert and that climate with devastation but in fact it is a vibrant world of desert life small and large, hidden from the preying eyes of the invading crusaders. No wonder it is rich in natural Force energy for it is just a different type of life that enriches it. And just the onlooker describing it as something it really isn't. Korriban lives. Poor Crusaders only saw that it was not like what they deemed perfect living conditions. That tells more of their presumptions and biases than any facts about the world they described.

After all, the greatest flaw of the Jedi was that they told a lie about their enemy in order to justify fighting them. Only to over centuries fall prey to believing their own lie and it became dogma.

 

@ColeFardreamer

So....Here's something I've been thinking about as of late.

With all these rumors about future Disney + projects, Rebels sequel series, apparently Boba Fett getting a thing, obviously Mando Season 2, maybe a Ashoka series that may just be the Rebels sequel series it starts to beg the question.

What is the Post Return of the Jedi Pre Sequel Trilogy Story.

What is sorta the overarching meta-narrative/narrative that the next 30 years is gonna be building.

Obviously we have

1. Ben Solo fall to the Dark-side (Covered in the Rise of Kylo Ren comic)
2. Repercussions of the Mando purge and whatever the Mando does
3. The Search for Ezra/Thrawn
4. Rise of the First Order
5. Whatever the heck Palpatine did in those thirty years of building his Final Order


I'm curious how they can fit all this stuff and make it seem seamless with Force Awakens when the time is ready.

Not sure if this a question but defiantly the next thing to talk about how this can be a re-imaging of essentially the Bantam Era of Star Wars storytelling when Imp Warlords were the baddies of the week.

 

@Jid123Sheeve

The sad thing is, the post ROTJ is a failed era where one has to work and build up for characters to fail and fall ultimately, much like the Clone Wars had to kill its babies, or most of them. Or like Rebels had to find a way around slaying its Jedi pre-ANH. (well typical eras for Filoni thus!)

Jedi Academy tales? Doomed to slaughter.
New Republic heroes? Failed government and slaughter. Children kidnapped by First Order, retirement and sadness.
Han and Leia? Break up
Luke? Looses faith
Lando? Looses his kid and wife
Peace and Victory? Is fake, Palpatine is alive and manipulating behind the scenes, FO rising.
Jedi? doomed to fall and slaughter, with folks like Ahsoka or Ezra or Baby Yoda hardly joining them but doing their own thing.

Given the ST starts so sad and dark, and only has the galaxy come to terms in IX as a united fleet, the post ROTJ may have happiness but none meant to last.

No wonder they are shoveling so many tales to the Unknown Regions where there still is story to be told, still mystery and open ends and options for characters future. Given this rather sad backdrop, stories would have to small scale and personal, nothing major or if so only for few people and on a smaller stage like Resistance tv show was.

The heroes you can hear about though do exist but not in places you expect them:
-The heroic tale of Sheev's clone-son and how he escaped Exegol, found love and saved his daughter from his fathers clutches despite his own sad end.
-the heroics of those that tried to warn the galaxy and found deaf ears or got caught up and dealt with in time with only rumors surviving them to alert Luke of Exegol and start his search for it

Of course SW is spinning something positive in this era despite the inevitable end, like TCW did. Like life needs to be lived and can be happy no matter how long or short it is, so long it is meaningful. People can overcome the pain of loss of their children. And children may find good times within the FO too so long it does not attack and stay rather quiet. I kinda want a stockholm syndrom story starring abducted childrends first years with the FO.

But speaking of Legends ideas reborn into canon as this topic is about, basically we are getting the same story as Legends post ROTJ, just from a different point of view! Instead of happily ever after warlord of the week feeling, we know the ST/NJO is coming with darkness and death. Instead of focussing on the New Republic and Jedi rising, we know their fate and instead focus on the Unknown Regions, the FO/Empire of the Hand being forged, the UR threats battled and worlds freed of its clutches, as well as the cold war back and forth between the FO and a NR that didn't even know it was in a cold war yet. We just see the other side of the medal we had with Legends now in canon, which is why One Canons work so neat.


All in all on a positive note, the NR, Jedi, Dathomiri, Mandos, all who had been purged by the Empire are healing and recovering. Some ignoring each other and still small in numbers, but leading up to their first major outing in IX's Allied Fleet. The Mando who became Mandalore the Rebirther? The Force Cults that healed and did not join Lukes Jedi but will join Rey's now they are ready? Good stories!

Aside those, we get plenty personal tales of Doctor Aphra-esque happy go lucky oops i did it again damn well lets survive the day and call it a day stories.

 

@ColeFardreamer

I feel like one story you can tell and I'm sure i've said this is Ashoka in the spirit realm getting the ghost of Jedi past ready to help Rey take out Palpatine for good when the voices in her head start to speak.

I feel like it would be weird to talk about a great Alien invasion force that we need to stop at least now, although I guess one can say a bunch of stuff is happening behind the scenes.

Though I think a Luke and Lando look for Exegol show would be cool even if it ended sad for Lando.

 

@ColeFardreamer

Sorry for the DP but something crossed my mind.

I wonder if since Thrawn isn't dead and could show up again in a post jedi era...I wonder if we will get a Empire of the Hand in the Unknown Regions, how big would it be...Can't be massive to be a threat to the NR, and obviously the FO still needs to get ready for it's big take over the galaxy moment.

But i'm curious how a Empire of the Hand could work in NuCanon, and we might see Thrawn actually rule it.

 

I think, Thrawn set it up during the OT, hence his absence. He and Ezra didn't stay away for too long, maybe a year I believe. The First Order took parts of it when encountering the Emperors forces in the UR (i.e. Thrawns Empire of the Hand!). Palpatine kept Exegol hidden from Thrawn and the FO/Empire of the Hand because he knew should Thrawn mutiny against him, he still had Exegol to reign him in and take over the FO/EotH.

With the First Order primarily Imperial though, I think the Chiss Ascendancy is not a part of the First Order, despite its proximity to Exegol on the map. I think Ezra and others are hiding there.

I imagine a power struggle in the UR between Thrawns Empire of the Hand and the Imperial survivors arriving after Jakku at the Eclipse. Given the contingency was altered as per Aftermath books, the newcomers would be under scrutiny and while taken in, might not be the topdogs yet. What if whoever is in charge aside Thrawn is an obstacle Sloane and Hux have to remove to truly birth the First Order from within the Empire of the Hand? Meanwhile Exegol is watching which faction will win the UR Empires reign, Thrawn or the newcomers.

 

That does not make me wonder if the UR will see some sort of version of the Imperial Civil War be carried out obviously leading the FO/Dark Empire/Exegol faction winning out tin the end.

Sloane defiantly lasted a long time at least from what the Phasma book showed her being part of the FIRST GENERATION of First Order leaders.

Of course if maybe not a outright Civil War, maybe more like just power plays within the same faction, which could be cool...less Armies fight Armies and more politicizing and inner scheming.

Like if some sort of Imperial Civil War took place then it would defiantly have been harder for the FO build up power, especially considering the Eclipse and Refugee faction had a hard time trying to survive, even with Snoke's help.

Any wrong move and everything could have been done.

 

Well you got Thrawn vs Sloane/Hux at first, but soon enough Pryde will be on the scene sent by Exegol to direct events to Exegols favor. And that is before mysteriously a Snoke left the jar to take control from Sloane. Guess it took a Forceuser to beat Thrawn, eh? Did Ezra still help Thrawn against Sloane and the hidden threat of the Emperor/Snoke?

Imagine a young Rey, born on Exegol. Their parents intent on hiding her need help to flee and who might be crucial in helping them to get far enough? Did Ezra meet baby Rey?

If all events, and that is not required but would be interesting, align, we may have several interconnected storylines:

1) political / militaristic infighting between Thrawn and Sloane factions
2) Exegol infiltrating both camps
3) Thrawn and Ezra trying to locate the true power suspecting something behind the First Order given they know the Emperor and may have hints and crumbs Thrawn could follow with Ezras help
4) Palpatine family troubles with baby Rey and the escape
5) Due to the conflict spilling to the galaxy via Occhi hunting Rey's parents, Luke and Lando go on the hunt for Exegol
6) Luke and Ben meet Snoke, who will continue to meet Leia, Han, Lor San Tekka and Savi later on before Luke seeing through his charade and dueling him
7) Ahsoka and Sabine finding Ezra and Thrawn, Baby Yoda along for the ride and searching for its species homeworld
8) The FO secretly funding and supporting leftover Imperial Warlords like Moff Gideon for assisting in kidnapping and recruiting Forcesensitives to Exegol and the FO

 

Question is though will Thrawn make a ploy for leadership, the Thrawn novel doesn't really have him make any plans to conquer or take control of the Empire...Though I guess it did say he planned on using his influence to pick the next Emperor when Palpatine died (Oh Naive Thrawn) so I'm curious if he would go for leadership directly.

Also it depends on what his feelings towards Sloane are...Sloane probably wouldn't want another Rax situation since she won't be towed too again, but I think she could see Thrawn as a useful ally.

I like the idea Pryde being connected to the Exegol faction obviously, he was in reserve by the order of Snoke.

It seems Rey was born away from Jakku and that the Emperors Son/Clone escaped beforehand.

You could have Thrawn and Ezra being allies but I could see Thrawn switching gears, part of me think it be interesting if he joined the Emperor again thinking that at the end of the day Palpatine is the true power to follow.

Curious to see when the FO OFFICALLY formed.

 

Thrawn picked the next emperor when he backed Palpatines clone son... And chose to save Imperial royal Princess Rey Palpatine... Anastasia style. All his plan in the end? Rasputin snoke destroying one dynasty as Thrawn saves its future? Did a Snoke ever go rogue against Palpatine? Hence his injuries when he lost?


Gesendet von meinem FP2 mit Tapatalk

 

Considering I love that movie despite having no basis in History...I LIKE IT!

Plus Palpatine singing in the Dark of the Night is now my favorite thing in the world at least in my head ;p

Granted I go more for the Villain Thrawn route myself, I feel like he would take more interest in the Force after his defeat on Lothal that it makes him wonder just why after all his tactic genius he lost to a bunch of flying Space whales.

 

His indifference to the Force is something I’ve wondered about with canon. With Zahn’s depiction of the Ascendancy and their navigators and his begrudging friendship with Anakin/Vader it would seem that Thrawn’s worked with and been around Force Users pretty much for the majority of his life. Yet his basic reaction to it is to shrug and move on.

 

Which is why I feel like the next place in his arc after his defeat at Lothal (Be it a book, a rebels sequel series....or some third thing) should be that he finally starts to think "Maybe this Force thing is something I should look into" even in TTT he may indifference to the Force as a concept but he does want to control it and use it as a tool to his own ends with people like C'boath and battle mediation as a important part of his plans.


Again that's my head-on fan fiction pitch, I don't know where they will go be it Zahn or Filoni (My bet Filoni finishes off his arc) but either way that's just me.

 

It’s weird to me, because his people utilise the Force so heavily. It’s basically how they became a superpower in the UR, so you would just assume that, growing up in that culture he’d be all about having it as a resource to be exploited. I don’t even know if it’s a deliberate character trait or just something that’s kind of overlooked by the various creatives who want to differentiate him from Vader.

 

I mean with the THRAWN ASCENDENCY trilogy, it's possible we'll see why Thrawn is very shrug about the Force perhaps.

And maybe if we get to see him post Rebels in any form they'll go into him using it as resource again...at least I hope they do.

Also @SyndicThrass you once compared Thrawn to good old Stannis the Mannis ;p

It be interesting if Thrawn went the Stannis way to the point of him doing the equivalent of burning someone alive.

Then Pellaeon could Thrawn Davos who gets disillusioned with Thrawn...maybe even defects from the Empire...Which would be a interesting route to take a NuCanon Pellaeon.

Honestly I wonder where one could take a NuCanon Pellaeon that is different from his legends counterpart

 

It's interesting how the Chiss' treatment of Force Sensitives in their culture is so different in Legends from Canon, as in Legends those born with the Force are treated as anomalies and outcasts, while in Canon, they are a valuable resource that is part of their culture, and while Legends Thrawn's views on the Force may be just a byproduct of his upbringing on the Ascendancy, New Canon Thrawn seems to be differing from his fellow Chiss in this regard, i also hope it gets explored in the future.

 

While I absolutely get the comparison of Davos/Pellaeon, because they do serve similar narrative functions,Davos is fundamentally a more moral person than Pellaeon ever was and his relationship with Stannis is much more personal than Pellaeon’s with Thrawn. Davos’ loyalty and respect for Stannis came from a place of genuine (if unorthodox) friendship and faith.

And it gets tricky because, Pellaeon isn’t following Thrawn because he believes the guy to be a stalwart figure of nobility and justice. At least in TTT he followed him because Thrawn was actually an effective leader who had a very real chance of restoring the Empire. And if you’re going to be consistent to Thrawn’s character, anything he would do could be rationalised within a context that a loyal soldier like Pellaeon would agree with. Pellaeon would probably have also served Vader if he was still around post-Endor and Vader killed children on the regular, so I don’t think old Gilad is squeamish.

I think more likely...Ezra would be the one to grow disillusioned with Thrawn and leave after a period of alliance. Ezra is the only one who could realistically be working with Thrawn who actually has some kind of fundamental moral objections to mass murder.

 

Okay that's fair. I hope any alliance Ezra has with Thrawn sorta goes sour eventually as Thrawn returns to his bad habits...or Joins the First Order in the end. Whatever comes first.

Also while Ezra would serve the function of a Force User, I do wonder if a Canon version of a Jorrus C'boath would come into the picture (Maybe Snoke/ Maybe a new force sensitive of a knew organization that is neither Jedi or Sith) and to add to the Stannis companions a bit also serve the function of a Melisandre (Granted I think not as morally complex as Melisandre was if they go with someone like Snoke or a new C'boath) but defiantly someone who is mystical but defiantly willing to you know...burn some people. X(

It seems not matter what universe Thrawn is the oddball of his people.

 

I’ll co-sign the C’baoth return. Ripped Santa is sorely missed.

 

Closet we have these days is that guy from Jedi Fallen Order

I was honestly a little surprised Maul and Thrawn never teamed up. The way Mauls mind was going I sorta assumed he'd be the Force User Thrawn would use in his attempts to crush the Ghost Crew

 

Maul wouldn't ever work for the Empire after what Palpatine did to him, not even with Thrawn.

In the EU, Jerec and Thrawn worked together, but we got very little of their partnership in actual works other than them killing Morgan Katarn.

 

Bring back Dash Rendar as a crazed old smuggler in the sequel trilogy era to fill the void of a dead Han.

 

Dash Rendar already was back in new canon... played by Lando Calrissian complete with the "i love my copilot droid" subplot of Solo A Star Wars Story... just saying

L3 was more LE-BO2D9 than Vuffi Ra!