Full Series The Bad Batch 2.08 - Truth and Consequences - Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

It was interesting to see how the Senate still held some sway on matters even though Palpatine had near total control of the Empire. Like Palpatine still relied on the Senate to get bills passed instead of just issuing edicts left and right. Now I want to see the senators' reactions when he eventually dissolves it.

 

Somehow Palpatine returned

 

I love a good Palpatine Xanatos gambit. He's in total control, he just lets the Senate believe they are to an extent. Much like how I believe the criminally underrated Deception Arc of season 4 of The Clone Wars is one big Xanatos gambit. Just like how the real smartest Clone Trooper, Fives. Who I believe would probably rank highly among the most intelligent characters alive in The Clone Wars was no match for Palpatine's twisted guile. The same happened here. The entire thing was all set up by Palpatine.

There is so much going on in this episode. Bail's follow the money trail line... wow.

Rex at this point is pissed enough to where it clouds his judgment. It infects Echo who easily seems to take charge over Hunter at different points in the episode. Rex called in The Bad Batch not only to get the backup data they needed but because he wanted to use The Bad Batch to hit Rampart back. And they succeeded spectacularly. The Venator is wrecked though ultimately it's of little consequence since Palpatine was playing him the whole time. This may ultimately be why Rex will end up going into hiding.

It really seems like Rex has a very personal grudge against Palpatine. Rex outright says he played into Palpatine's hands. A similar line to one from the Seige of Mandalore. By the same token does Palpatine know he is alive? It's going to get him into trouble. It is still a question as to how much Ahsoka told Rex about what Maul said. Let's not forget "Carnage of Krell" where Rex is questioning Krell and is able to make a leap that suggests he has a rudimentary understanding of The Dark Side, of Sith. There is so much weight in that and I would love to know if this is something someone told him or when he realized the truth. Now that's gotten worse with terrible consequences. It's really a question as to how long Riyo Chuchi is going to be able to stick around. I don't think this is the last we'll see of her.

The other consequence is the payout for the season premiere. There was actually a great episode for Omega and man did it raise more questions for me. I don't remember Rampart directly interacting with her before. She has a clear look of disgust on her face when she sees him I'll come back to later. I thought it was sweet when she asked Echo to Meditate with her. I think she may have some force sensitivity now though not a great deal like a full-on Jedi would. Perhaps it's just her ability to learn technique and this is something more like Churrit. It's a pity she doesn't try to do this around Rex. There is a clearly marked difference between how Clones like Echo and especially Rex directly influences by the Jedi and The Bad Batch think.

I found Burtoni's reaction to her intriguing. Given what we have seen from Kaminoans it's not that surprising she doesn't seem to care about what happened to Kamino at least as far I can tell. But she seems to realize what Omega is and that itself almost seemed to get her to cooperate. She even seemed scared or shocked by Omega. I can't decide. Like what the hell? Or maybe she saw Omega as a way out of her situation and she is going to spill some beans to someone in the Empire. I don't know if its because she knows something crazy about Omega or because she knows Omega is supposed to be with "rogue-enhanced clones". The Bad Batch are going to end up on the radar for sure now.

I wonder if Rampart will try to pull something like Maketh Tua did in Rebels and somehow try to contact The Bad Batch or even Rex himself who are both supposed to be dead to get him out. I wonder if Omega herself would even entertain offering him a hand and we'll find a limit to her naive kindness. I feel like the real foreshadowing of the last scene with Crosshair has turned out to be its the last time the latter will see him alive. Of course Crosshair himself could always be on the firing squad. The guy Rampart should have sent to do his dirty work. Rampart is such a tool either way.

Echo's departure is bittersweet. Really sucks since he is my favorite of The Bad Batch. But this was foreshadowed and it remains to be seen if this will be an episode. Or more like Sabine. Echo got mad and has expressed the Bad Batch isn't doing enough, and he went back to Rex despite the fact the Echo he was before Skako minor is for all purposes dead. A fate worse than death. How could it have been worse Echo? Have, the Bad Batch simply given him a place to heal? It's just as likely Echo is in exactly the place he needs to be to protect Omega later. I wonder if the departure is going to dredge up her feelings from what Echo said before in the premier.

10 of 10, the action pieces were great as well. And Rex! I hope to see him again soon.

 

Or their reactions when he dissolved them.

 

I think the implication is that they need raw Jango material so they can make a new class of enhanced clones, in order to provide something the Empire can't get otherwise and make themselves indispensable. Considering that Nala Se is spared to do her experiments, they were probably right.

 

Both of these episodes were fantastic!

 

It's interesting that this uber-loyal clone was a good Sniper though not a perfect one like Crosshair who is CT-9904. Possibly implying he was the last of the "enhanced" Bad Batch assets created. Crosshair's OP enhanced ability is built to kill. IIRC it's only Crosshair they've bothered to give the number of. Which Rex made a deal out of the new guy having his number erased or maybe not having one at all. What if it wasn't an accident Lama Su let Tarkin select Crosshair to experiment with dialing up the chip because he was engineered to just be a Soldier and pick the Empire? Like a contingency because the Kaminoans figured it would come to it eventually. While Crosshair did let The Bad Batch escape in season 1 so he is not perfect. They needed Omega's pure DNA specifically to perfect the "Crosshair" model.

 

1. I must be going senile because one of the most obvious members of an already obvious and Wanted rogue clone squad walking around the Lion's Den capital of your enemy seems like an incredibly stupid idea.

2. Echo should've died a long time ago.
Nothing felt about him since the start of this show and nothing felt here.

 

Not to mention that they usually make a big deal about being able to protect her, but this time they just say "sure, go have fun on your own."

 

Perhaps they decided that she will be safer in the Senate budling, where nobody was looking for her, than assaulting Rampart's Venator.

 

Yeah.

The way he appeared was also an interesting part of the psychological manipulation he uses to control the senate.

Giving the impression he is always there. Just unseen for most of the time.

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Does Palpatine/The Emperor ever have to explain to the Senate why he now covers his head with the hood and what happened to his face; or was it already established that the Jedi provoked the attack on him causing those scars?

 

Yeah, it came up in ROTS:

 

Jedi attack on my life.

 

Right. Point taken.

 

Yes, but there's still a little problem with this. There are some indications in canon (for example in the first Thrawn novel and in Rebels) that many people at the time of the Empire apparently either don't know about the deformations or have the impression that he got them healed at some point.

Implied for example by the use of holograms, statues and media showing him without them.

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Omega volunteered to guard Chuchi and I think it made the most sense to let her at the time. I don't think Rampart never met her face-to-face and most don't recognize her as a clone. That's what made Burtoni's reaction interesting to me. I think in the long this will be treated as a big mistake for the Bad Batch.

 

Which brave soul in the Senate wants to speak up and be like, "This guy kinda looks like a villain character."

 

Did anyone else get a Harriet Tubman Underground Railroad for the slaves feel with Captain Rex and what he is doing getting Clonetroopers safe passage?

 

Mas Amedda gets so mutch hate from the galaxy for trying to safeguard the galaxy. Dealing with a corrupt Chancellor and next with a dark wizard for 26 years. Mas Amedda should be next Chancellor of the New Republic. An elderly statesman. For all we know his race are long lived.

 

It was an interesting episode and alright, but it seems like a rather risky plan and Omega just openly appearing in the senate building? Well officially Bad Batch is dead and I don't remember is Rampart even saw Omega up close before, but still it was bit weird he didn't ask anything of Chuchi's small companion. Getting evidence illegally from navy ship seems like quite a problem to represent in the senate just like that and Bail Organa himself getting mixed in all of this... quite bold considering how much Bail knows he agreed to help Chuchi in quite a risky business, sure he has done that before and will do that again, but still seems bit too bold perhaps considering that Organa should lay low and be careful at this time not to reveal Leia or Obi-Wan to Palpatine.

I think this episode felt a bit rushed too and Echo's departure was a rather weird addition. Many have said that show doesn't really need him and they realized it themselves that he is not needed for internal dynamics of the Bad Batch and can go with Rex instead. I would like to see more what Rex is doing at the moment. Bad Batch has been doing fillerish side quests for some time now so I hope we see more of this storyline instead. Now the show is moving forward.

+ Halle Burtoni is back
+ Palpatine himself is back and Rampart is thrown away like trash he is, I like it how they developed him though, he is just one of many upstarts like Krennic, Grotton and the like who overestimate their own importance to the regime which basically needs no one but the leader himself, just uses people as long as they are useful. I like it how Ramparts overall storyline goes, it is such a tragedy of his own pride and stupidity. I wonder if Tarkin has already learned about his failure to defeat the Bad Batch and attempt to hide it by killing Wilco or if he is just sacrificed for the senate as scapegoat.

- It was a bit rushed and seemed to me they haven't really thought this through well enough. It was bit obvious they needed to explain how clones will be replaced with stormtroopers, but they really had to make such a big deal out of stormtroopers being "stormtroopers" that Emperor needs to personally come up with that name? It is all bit too obviously for audience and makes no such sense in universe. Stormtroopers are not evil because they are "stormtroopers" though, but because the regime they serve. But since OT movies came out first and stormtroopers are so recognizable and memorable it's a big deal for audience to see how they came to be. But galactic senators have never seen OT and therefore stormtroopers being "those stormtroopers from OT" means nothing to them, that's why that comment is too clearly for audience.

 

Yes let’s make the guy who wholeheartedly supported a fascist takeover of a democratic state and went on to serve said fascist state for two plus decades the next Chancellor. What could go wrong?

 

A really good couple of episodes. Isn't this what we wanted to hear about? Just goes to show TBB writers can pull off good storytelling when they want to!

You didn't really need the whole bad batch premise or their "super powers" for this story - it felt like good continuity from TCW. As TBB were in it, they were quite understated and better for it IMHO.

There were lots of good bits - very AOTC/ROTS feel, nice music, oppressive tension, exciting action, old school clones, lovely detail to the animation, good dialogue, and generally believable characters and actions.

The one thing I didn't like - which seemed at odds with its overall nuanced approach to answering the question of "what happens to the clones" - was Rex's summary that it was "Palpatina's plan" all along. That was clumsy writing. The entire story would have made sense without it and they could've devoted more time to Echo's departure or showing Rex and the clones he saved.