Andor Andor Episode 2.03 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

I'd argue that Lucas had wanted to skew to a slightly older audience - teens and up - when he began making the first film, but he started to pivot away from that even before the movie came out, partially in the name of just avoiding the box-office flop all his friends were telling him he had. Owen and Beru's smoking skeletons is a survival of the earlier conception of the intended audience.

However, the kid-friendly approach took over more and more of SW as the films went on, until by the time of the prequels, Lucas had pivoted so hard to catering for kids that plenty of adults were turned off - and nowadays huge chunks of the audience can't imagine the GFFA as anything but "movies/TV for kids".

Andor is arguably a full-fledged exploration of the more adult level that Lucas wanted SW to have at the outset, but started shying away from almost immediately, arguably to its detriment.

 

The last movie Lucas released included a man having multiple limbs chopped off and being set on fire, with us watching him burn up. I'm not sure Lucas COMPLETELY pivoted.

 

Fair point, though it's also another element that goes back quite a long ways - back in 1977, before Vader and Anakin were merged as characters, Lucas was already talking in a Rolling Stone interview about the "lava duel" where Vader was burned.

 

Didn't Lucas cater more to kids because the toys brought in the credits

 

I think what's defined the vast majority of Star Wars content to date hasn't been that it's exclusively for kids, but that it's attempting to hit the broadest demographic possible and have something for everyone, to varying degrees of success. Andor is not attempting to do that, or at least it's not the priority. Having said that I don't think there are is a hard "age limit" for being able to enjoy Andor - other than very young kids. It's more about what people's taste is, and you can see that in the split reactions to the show across both seasons - a lot of adult Star Wars fans find that it's not to their taste, and others love it. And there are also adults who aren't Star Wars fans as such but have enjoyed Andor.

 

I read this scene was there in part because without it Star Wars by 1977 standards was considered such a tame fantasy it was in danger of receiving a G rating which would have been box office poison. The skeletons ensured the desired PG rating,

 

it's nice to have both and a reminder that yes, despite the armchair critics and pundits, we still can have nice things.

 

Without getting too political I can't see too much of those people in her besides maybe Liz, I think her politics really are those of someone who is genuinely committed to resisting oppression but comes to realise that the methods offered within the existing establishment simply don't do that and are ultimately part of that oppression. I think the interesting thing is really how far does she go down the path of Luthen's harsh pragmatism? how that moral argument ends really seems a bit of an unknown although the story of Rogue One is arguably in part about it as well.

We now her story is someone who ultimately gives up family for the rebellion and I think were seeing how thats stripped away although we still don't know the form it takes, do they actually end up being sacrificed? Even if there estranged you would think the Empire would take them as hostages if Mon is openly viewed as a rebel.

 

I don't see Mothma as a zealot who neglects her family. I see her as someone who resists the growth of fascism, while her family doesn't. And so a split is inevitable. She knows it, but being a good mother and person, tries and tries to bring Leida to her side. To the side of justice. But ultimately her daughter rejects her views, embraces extreme conservatism and the status quo, and chooses her father over her mother. And chooses to live in security under the Empire over standing up to it. Indeed, she has contempt for her mother's attempts to stand up to it. Calling her a zealot is wildly off-base, in my view. She's simply someone following her moral compass. She tries desperately to bring her family with her on that road, and they reject her. She therefore will have no choice but to abandon them. And she will be right to do so. Democracy over fascism. And democracy over a fascist family.

There's no room for amoral familism in Mothma's heart. Or in Star Wars.

 

Star Wars has always been diverse, in terms of styles. The point is that the basic feeling of Star Wars has remained, and that's what the different layers come to. I think they've handled that brilliantly in the Disney era.

 

She regrets her decision to arrange the marriage with Sculden, and tries to call it off. And in S1, she tried to bring Leida along with her to work, etc, to show her the ways in which the Empire was doing wrong. That's a good mother to me.

He used the TIE's hyperdrive to jump to Mina-Rau in this episode.

 

She dosent understand her daughter. And agreed to arrange marriage, and tries to take it away from her daughter on her big day. Her comments about her own experiences with her mother was not the way to go. And it seems she has not spent mutch time with her, as Leida dosent want to go with her to work.

I love the diverse Storytelling of Grounded real world that begins in ANH and all OT to Prequels, and Andor. Then we get the more magical in Clone Wars, Rebels, Sequels and Ahsoka. The campy adventure of Mandalorian and Skeleton Crew.

 

She didn’t try to take anything away. Quite the opposite. She gave her daughter the freedom to back out of the marriage. And then when her daughter rejected that option, Mon respected her decision. She may not understand her daughter as well as she would like, but that doesn’t make her a bad mother. It’s not easy being a parent in turbulent times. Especially to a child who holds worrying beliefs.

 

I can see Perrin and her daughter alerting the ISB, inadvertent or not, to her other than Senatorial activities.

 

...and then she kills them both?

 

Indirectly, maybe. What if when she comes out as an overt rebel, the Empire takes husband and/or (Ha!) daughter as hostages, and she chooses to let the Empire kill them rather than turn herself in.

 

I think for sure she's got some tough choices ahead, and sacrifice will be involved.

 

I love how we were all expecting Sculdun to be the problem (as he could easily blackmail Mon), but instead it turns out to be her old friend Tay.

 

Davo seems to be a big enough fish he could probably protect his daughter-in-law.

Going to be interesting to see how having Mon Mothma as an in-law will affect Davo’s business and his standing. He saw Mon as his way into high society, respectable society, when his money alone couldn’t open those doors to him.

He may have the Empire hounding every move he makes socially and in business.

 

Maybe his business will be on Ghorman, move the family here, and then it all goes south during the Empires plans.

Either they join the Alliance or they all wind up dead.

The wedding just seems too ominous. There’s no happy ending there.

 

For the longest time I thought the planet that the Ferrix crew was on was Gorman

 

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. I need a pop vinyl of Mon Mothma dancing.

 

I have no idea what happens, but can see a path where the kids get out and have a good life together. Im thinking if Davo stashes them away somewhere remote and the two of them can be happy living a simple life they could do fine.

I’m also thinking the traditional Chandrillian customs Leida is so enamored with in practice are meant for a less complicated world and would be key in guiding the newlyweds in a new life away from Coruscant and the luxury they grew up in.

Then again they could end up imprisoned on the Death Star.

 

Then you will like that SW team understands and memed the song and dance for 1 hour, cloning the Nemo dance from marvel