Andor Andor Season 2 Discussion (Spoliers Allowed)

Again, the writing on this show was amazing.

I will say it was a bit of let down that when Dedra rang the doorbell to Luthen's shop Luthen didn't say, "I've got a bad feeling about this!" Then Dedra could've told Luthen that the odds were pretty good that some of the artifacts in his shop were fake and Luthen could've said, "never tell me the odds!" And when Dedra asks if the knife is real Luthen should've said, "from a certain point of view." Lastly, after it's clear that Dedra knows who Luthen is she should've said, "this is where the fun begins!" and a surprised Luthen would let out a Wilhelm scream!!!

 

I'm so glad we didn't get cameo dialog.

 

If this series has shown anything, it's that you can add layers to the OT through inspired writing, original characters and great acting. In this or in RO, it doesn't tread on the toes of ANH, neatly ending before the other starts but in a way that you can watch the whole lot as one massive serial, which was George's idea from the very start.

 

Immediately thereafter, the Rebels team comes through the back door, Chopper swears at Dedra in droid speak, Dedra gives a confused expression with her teeth, and Sabine blinds her with spray paint.

 

I've never heard it called "cameo dialog" before but I love it and will be using that from now on.

 

So...







What now?

 

But before the spraying happens, Dedra says, ‘So, it’s treason then.’

 

Now that the Andor->Rogue One arc is complete I feel very justified in saying I knew Bor Gullet was awesome from the very beginning.

 

Watched R1 last night and ANH earlier today, and got chills during the “You’re Father would be proud of you” and the victory celebration. Amazing set of SW stories

 

Watched RO last night and the semi-frantic pace, and the idea of constant exchange of information that exists through out the film, feels much better now.

Also...although originally (and for the last decade) Jyn Erso was the protagonist ... something changed. I really couldn't help but see the entire thing through Cass's POV instead, and it shifted him into the protagonist spot. He's basically like a Spy Obi-wan, mentoring Jyn in the ways of the Rebellion. She's still clearly there, but he has so much more importance now.

 

My only criticism of the show is I wish they had shown a lot more of Luthen getting together more cells and making them group up on Yavin. I really thought we were going to see more of the Alliance coming together, that process. It should've been 3 seasons.

Also, while I didnt need a cameo from the Ghost crew or anything like that, it wouldve been fun to see at the very end the Ghost parked in the background. But that's it, just a ship in the background.

 

I just have to say that that last arc had some bad creative choices.

1. Why would Luthen have had a better exit strategy than just shanking himself? How about an explosive charge that would have taken out the shop and anyone in it.
2. Why were Cas and Melshi just standing around talking to Kleya in the safe house? Just get there, get out and get on the ship. Not waste time with all the "You have to remember this" nonsense.

 

You mean @Bor Mullet , right?

 

The series just broke an IMDB record - first show in history to have 5 consecutive episodes rated 9.5 or higher:

Episode 8 - 9.8
Episode 9 - 9.7
Episode 10 - 9.6
Episode 11 - 9.5
Episode 12 - 9.7

Funny thing - Episode 7 for me should have been rated higher too....I think it got a 9.3

 

Cancel Disney+ until Alien Earth premieres.

 

Were they supposed to kidnap her? She didn't want to leave. And they didn't know the ISB was hot on their tail - it was a safe house, after all. They escaped there with Mon Mothma just fine. If Luthen had time to finish destroying the radio, or Dedra hadn't told Heert what to look for, they wouldn't have caught her.

ETA:

Another big one for me was in Cassian's conversation with Tivik: "Erso? Galen Erso? WAS IT?!"

 

Neither seems so bad to me.
1. He got interrupted while destroying things. Who knows what he would have done if he had more time. It's not like an explosion necessarily destroys all the evidence either. Much better to make sure something is properly destroyed beforehand.
2. You are using viewership-knowledge while judging characters who don't have that knowledge. There was no reason to assume that the safe-house had been compromised. On top of that, Kleya was distraught and, as mentioned above, didn't really want to leave.

 

A major part of the plot in this episode, involving an old radio that Kleya gets after spending hours breaking a brick wall, and Dedra telling Heert about the old Ferrix and Kreeger radios, explains this. They have no idea that the Empire was able to trace the old frequency they were using. And K2 was unable to tell them that the Empire was onto them. Kleya doesn’t think there’s anyone coming and so her priority is to make sure Cassian remembers exactly what she’s telling him. Not to mention that she doesn’t intend to leave. She wants to stay and continue her and Luthen’s work, until the end. I wouldn’t be surprised if after she passed the message to Cassian, she intended to do something drastic and suicidal against the Empire on Coruscant. And I haven’t even mentioned her reluctance to go to Yavin, where she’s viewed as a serious vulnerability by the Alliance. And so Cassian and Melshi have to spend time convincing her to come.

This is all meticulously spelled out in the episode.

I think the reason some viewers have an issue with it is because they have a bird’s eye view of what’s happening. We know the Empire is on the doorstep and so we pull our hair out watching them talk while the strike team nears. And that’s part of the episode’s tension. It’s almost like yelling at your favorite sports team on television. Pass the ball, he’s wide open! Well, they don’t benefit from your all-seeing angle.

It’s really well-done and not a bad creative choice at all. The characters only know what they can know. I wish more writers were better at adhering to this simple premise.

 

They knew comms were jammed though?

Sure but then when they defeat the team they still just walk to the U-Wing as Imperial craft approach (let's not get into them just flying past the Imperial craft which all ignore them...). There is zero urgency even AFTER they know the Imperials are after them.

I bloody love this show but that whole plot really felt like padding because they didn't know what else to do.

 

One thing I dont get is Mon's husband still moving around like nothing happened. With his wife doing what she did, I think the Empire would arrest him just on suspicion. That guy should be in jail or dead.

 

It is a fair point to say that she did not know that the Empire was at her doorstep.
Though, even if we concede that she did not know that she was going to be caught immediately, she should have been realistic about her position. The Empire knew about her, and they knew she is Luthen's assistant, and almost surely (from her pov) they also realized she blitzed into the ISB headquarter. She had no realistic hope to start working again.

In virtue of that, I could even understand if she blew herself up after killing Luthen, but to say something like "I'm not going to Yavin because I don't like it there", sorry, it simply did not feel like Kleya to me. It's a minor issue, so of course it did not affect my love for the show, but during that dialogue everything felt a bit off to me. Perhaps the weakest moment of the season in my view.

 

I think the implication is that he was already friends with the elite, he was somehow above the law and may have already disowned her

 

I view both as common sense...

1 - Luthen needs to make sure any informaion or equipment is secure...or at least delay any access to both as much as possible. And if he is willing to kill himself through stabbing...it only makes sense to go bigger taking himself and any data and equipment out as well. Is it possible the Empire could reconstruct any equipment and data? Yes. But it would take them much longer to do with with it all in pieces.

2. Drag her out kicking and screaming if they have to. If Luthen is compromised then they need to assume that Kleya is compromised and any information that Luthen had is compromised...or at leas in danger of being compromised. So once they showed up they should have been moving her out the door to the U-Wing.

 

Kleya is unsure if she will be welcome and safe on yavin, but sure let's drag her out the door against her will, that will surely convince her that she will be welcome and safe, that makes total sense

 

It is that or risk her being captured and tortured for information...or just shoot her in the head and leave her corpse for the Imperials to find.

On an unrelated topic...When the Ghorman stuff started...I wish we got a flashback to Tarkin landing on the protestors. And they took the time to produce a Gladiator or Victory class SD for the scene.