COMEDY: Binks Vs Han/Droids

One of the main reasons i enjoyed the OT was the Comedy involved. The constant bickering between R2 & C-3PO, Han & Chewy also (when we have to rely on one character to give us a clue on what the other said e.g. Chewy/R2 i think there's comic tension).
However, i think the prequel comedy relies on the practical stupidity of Jar Jar Binks, and for me, his style (& digitalness) is far less appealing.

What are your favourite comedy moments in the saga, and which characters/films do you find the most entertaining?

 

One of my favorite scenes was in Episode IV, where Luke, Han, Chewie, Leia, Obi, and the Droids were on the Death Star and the droids are trying to get the trash compactor to stop before it flattens our heros. And finally when R2 does stop it, they all start to cheer, but 3PO takes the cheers as screams of pain and death and start cursing himself for not saving them in time. That scene always cracks me up.

 

I think the sophistication of the humor in the PT has taken a severe nosedive compared to the OT.

In the OT we had fairly sophisticated barbs being thrown between R2 and 3PO ("mindless philosopher", "overweight glob of grease", "malfunctioning little twerp", "nearsighted scrap pile", etc.), while in the PT we have 3PO reduced to "Idiot!" (I know their relationship hasn't developed and all, but you can't explain away the difference, it's just lost something.)

Also, we have more intelligent and subtle jibes between the human characters, like "Yes, your highnessness", "That doesn't seem so hard", "You're braver than I thought" The interactions between PT characters seem to be much more humorless. Many scenes that are ripe for a humorous interjection are simply wasted. In AOTC, when they're going into the bar and Anakin says "I think he is a she, and I think she is a changeling", all Obi-Wan can come up with is "Then be extra careful" ???

In addition, the PT relies too much on juvenile gags for laughs, such as fart/poop jokes, 3PO's puns in AOTC, etc. True, the OT had some of these, such as the ewok getting tangled up in his own slingshot, but they are fewer and far between.

 

One of my favourite comedic scenes (at least I find it funny) is in ESB, with Han always refering to Leia as "Princess", "your highness", or "your worshipfulness". Leia finally asks him to simply call her by her real name, and he says "Sure, ... Leia." It just sounds unusual coming out of his mouth, since you're expecting him to provide a snidy or snappy comeback.

 

Their styles of comedy are very different.

Jar Jar has more levels than the Droids or Han.
1] As a children's character his comedy derives from broad physical humor to 'identification' humor i.e. kids can identify with his haplessness - laughing with Jar Jar helps them accept themselves. That was the idea, at least.
2] As a classical 'clown' such as the Clown in 'King Lear'. He takes the piss out of pomp & circumstance, questions everything, doubts everything, sees the glass as half empty, is pragmatically self-preserving.
3] Jar Jar was also modeled after the 'silent clowns' such as Harold Lloyd & Buster Keaton. His stunt-man-like physical antics and rubber-limbed pratfalls are derived directly from these films (I recommend viewing 'The General' and 'Gold Rush).
4) Once his character is established some of his humor is character based, such as when he says 'Hello' to Obi Wan in TPM and Obi ignores him or his entrance in AOTC.
5) Lastly Jar Jar is ultimately a tragi-comic character, like Polonius in Hamlet. We're laughing at his pranks and antics but it turns tragic when his personal flaws unwittingly provide enough 'rope' for the Hero to 'hang himself'.

In comparison the other are very one dimensional:

R2D2's humor comes almost exclusively from untranslated expletives and insults. The joke is that he's short but feisty.

C3PO is a one-joke character. His prissiness makes almost every situation funny. He's the clasic Butler-type who doesn't want to get his fingers dirty but ends up being blown to bits. There's a serious strain of Absurdist humor in 3PO's antics.

Han is the flattest of them all. He's a wiseguy with a lexicon of wise-cracks. Sometimes motivated by feelings he's not ready to accept, at other times to counter the idealism of his companions, or to 'whistle in the dark' his humor is pretty earth-bound and can be seen as derivitive of Howard Hawks's classic fast-talking heroes & heroines (check out 'His Girl Friday').

 

Guess I'm an unsophisticated imbecile, cause I didn't laugh once at Jar Jar -the masterwork of comedy- yet STILL laugh at pretty much everything 'one-dimensionally funny' Han, Leia, Artoo and even Threepio throw out for my enjoyment. Chewie, too. Even Vader has some humor to him, dark though it may be.

YODA: "A colossal mistake Jar Jar was."

GEORGE: "I don't believe it."

YODA: "That is why you fail."

 

I must be strange because I laughed at neither Jar Jar Binks nor at Han & Droids. In fact, I never laughed during a SW movie. However, I think that Binks is funnily annoying. Han is cool. 3PO is annoying. R2 is THE droid.

Depa Billaba

 

Nothing will beat Han and Threepio.

"Is it me or is this asteroid not entirely stable?"
"Not entirely stable? Well I'm glad you;re here to tell us these things!"

 

Play nice or have a vacation.

jar jar was shoe-horned into episode 1 as george obviously fell in love with the fact he could create a central character that was entirely computer generated. why didn't anyone at ILM have the guts to tell him how bad an idea it was? disagree? well why aint he really in episode 2? i think we owe uncle rick a big thank you.

jar jar is the main reason episode 1 doesn't work for many people, how can you suspend your disbelief looking at a cartoon character in the middle of a live action star wars movie? He is a techincal achievement, nothing else. that is truely ONE dimensional.

han and the droids are simple and well written characters. that is why they work.

they symbolize the real difference and problems between the prequels and the OT. the OT had a warm personal story, the PT is cold and open. it has none of the personal charm that it's fore bearer did. more fool george.

 

the good part about the droids/han is that they're comical on their own, but they produce different comedy when paired together. 3PO and R2, chewie and han, and han and threepio. i never laughed out loud, but they do provide comic relief, where Jar Jar is just a prop to make younger audiences laugh. i actually found comic relief in TPM with obi-wan, and then obi-wan and anakin in AOTC.

 

Darth Onion:

>>first_stage_lensman are you for real? or is [it] the crack talking?<<

I'll let you get away with the 'crack' comment 'tho you *should* be suspended for it. And learn how to type.

>>jar jar was shoe-horned into episode 1 as george obviously fell in love with the fact he could create a central character that was entirely computer generated. why didn't anyone at ILM have the guts to tell him how bad an idea it was? disagree? well why aint he really in episode 2? i think we owe uncle rick a big thank you.<<

WRONG! On the TPM DVD there are a series of web doc's - the first one is from Nov. 1994 - it shows Lucas *clearly* studying a silent Keystone Cops type comedy - the gag he's watching actually *appears* in TPM! So he had that idea from the beginning.

>>jar jar is the main reason episode 1 doesn't work for many people, how can you suspend your disbelief looking at a cartoon character in the middle of a live action star wars movie? He is a techincal achievement, nothing else. that is truly ONE dimensional.<<

That's your OPINION. Jar Jar is one of the things many of my friends liked *most* about TPM. At any rate, Star Wars was always meant to be a 'live action cartoon'.

>>han and the droids are simple and well written characters. that is why they work.<<

Once again, thanx for sharing your OPINION. They work for you. They work for me too - but so does Jar Jar. In terms of layers, however, JJ has more interesting levels than the aforementioned do, if you know enough to recognize them.

>>they symbolize the real difference and problems between the prequels and the OT. the OT had a warm personal story, the PT is cold and open. it has none of the personal charm that it's fore bearer did. more fool george. <<

Well, if you want to feel warm & fuzzy, stick with the OT. That's your choice. I *like* the alienating remoteness of the PT. It recalls many things I like, from classical theater (Western & Eastern), old comic strips, epic poems like 'Iliad' & 'Aenid', silent films and more. Those are my tastes.

I was speaking strictly in terms of content, not what people do or don't like. Next time you express your OPINIONS try to do so with more tact, 'kay?

 

First Stage Lensman, not sure who you think you are? - your OPINION is no better than anyone else's OPINION, including mine.

the hypocrisy in your above statement is clearly lost on you, and i'm not sure how to deal with someone who has a total lack of irony...

Thanks for letting me off though. I really feel a papable sense of relief.

i guess i might feel more threatened if you had a point.

so you think george was thinking of jar jar in '82 before the advent of digital modelling? you proberly do.

so you think jar jar was a universal success, hense his successful vitual exclusion from episode 2 and 3? you proberly do.

jar jar is deep huh? how so? (other than a few superficial refences to a couple of classics) you only have to understand the basics of film structure (which i am sorry you don't) to see the reason jar jar and gungans don't work for many people is because they don't fit. they unsuspend disbelieve. proberly over your head, but as long as you are happy.

i am asking a basic question to which you seem to wholely miss the point. why did george make the two trilogy's feel so different? no judgement - just speculation.

and if your friends all loved Jar Jar, I guess that would make them about seven (which suddenly makes a whole lotta sense).

put that in your pipe and smoke it.

 

I think the "dry wit", as it's called, utilized by Han is extremely entertaining. I laugh at those line just about everytime I watch an OT movie. Threepio and Artoo's exchanges don't entertain me the way they did when I was younger, but that's because my tastes have changed over the years not because the jokes aren't funny.

I laughed at Jar Jar the first time I saw TPM. After that the jokes just aren't funny. They are slapstick, nothing more nothing less, and slapstick is only funny for a short while. Threepio suffered from this miserbly in AOTC "I've fallen and I can't get up" was just to much for me.

First_stage_lensman,
You have way over analyzed these movies. Yes GL did get ideas from the old Chaplin films, but he also used comedic influences from Airplane! in TPM. Comparing Star Wars to the Ilad or King Lear? You need to lighten up.

Also, how is it you can express your opinion as being absolute but if another does the same it doesn't count?

 

Comparisions of Jar-Jar to tragedies like King Lear comes from the fact that Jar-Jar is derived directly from the fool characters that always are in those types of pieces.

Personally I find both types of characters funny, although I also think Obi-Wan gets quite a few good quips in the prequels, and he occupies the kind of serious, but funny at times role that Han does in the OT. And Obi-Wan is pretty funny in a very dry way. But despite JJB's antics in TPM-which I still find pretty amusing, but then again, I never get tired of 3 Stooges either-the PT is nowhere near as light-hearted as the OT therefore to force more humor into it would make it campy.

 

DO: you're obviously a Troll trying to get a rise out of me - game over.

OJ: reread my post.

 

First Stage Lensman -

You made a rather lengthy analysis of JJB.
But - did you find him funny?
I find it curious that you never said anything about that.
I mean the true test of comedy is - did it make you laugh?

g

 

There seems to be a misunderstanding here. The theme of this Thread (as I understand it) is 'contrast & compare'. I was only offering definitions of the various types of humor evidenced by the characters cited.

But if you're interested: yeah, most of JJ's stuff makes me laugh for various reasons. There's stuff that makes me cringe too.

Overall, I prefer Lucas's more over-the-top surrealist/absurdist humor. If you're not familiar with these genres then such elements will be lost on you. Anyway, 'funny' is like 'pretty' - it's in the eye of the beholder.

 

Overall, I prefer Lucas's more over-the-top surrealist/absurdist humor. If you're not familiar with these genres then such elements will be lost on you.

Yes I'm familiar with such genres. Perhaps you could give some examples of this from the PT.

And - which JJ bits make you laugh?
g

 

>>Yes I'm familiar with such genres.<<
Good, then you don't need any examples.

>>And - which JJ bits make you laugh?<<
The funny ones, of course!

 

>>Anyway, 'funny' is like 'pretty' - it's in the eye of the beholder.<< but there's also a thing called a sense of humor, and if you don't have one, that doesn't neccesarily mean that you don't find things funny, it also means you don't know what is funny. jar jar is there for comedic purposes, but only younger and more immature audiences find it funny. i like slapstick comedy as much as the next guy, but i find him irritating and distracting to the story.



>>And - which JJ bits make you laugh?<<
(The funny ones, of course!) that doesn't neccesarily answer the question, because there are none. comedic parts? yes. funny? no.

 

Jar Jar is the reason I dont like TPM and still cant watch it to this day. Just the sound of his voice is like nails on a chalk board with me. Everything else in the movie is fine. I even liked Jake Lloyd.. but I cant watch it because of Jar Jar. And a lot of people I know feel the same way.

The humor with Han and 3PO was great. I loved Han's smart ass comments. 3PO it seems has annoyed me more in the PT and I dont really know why because he doesnt bother me in the OT. I'm not a big fan of fart jokes and physical humor, which is why I cant watch Jar Jar

 

>>Yes I'm familiar with such genres.<<
Good, then you don't need any examples.

>>And - which JJ bits make you laugh?<<
The funny ones, of course!

Man you like to talk in circles..

 

>>Yes I'm familiar with such genres.<<
Good, then you don't need any examples.

Well I'm not a mind reader. I don't know what examples you're thinking of.

>>And - which JJ bits make you laugh?<<
The funny ones, of course!

? Is it a secret or something?

g

 

it's no secret, there are none.

 

Nah, just a waste of time.

Thanx to everyone here who were kind enough to inform me that I have no taste and no sense of humor, you're a real great bunch of folks!!