Dark Side Of The Force

There is no dark side of the force.
As a matter of fact, it is all dark.

 

Your first statement - spoken like a true Vergerite.

Your second statement - care to explain?

-Paul

 

I agree with the first statement.

As for the second one, I think Vongoid means it as a metaphor for the unknown. Do you mean that the Force is unknown and thus it is all dark?

 

if that's what he means by the second one, i agree with both

 

Or perhaps he's merely applying Pink Floyd to Star Wars.

"There is no dark side of the Moon. It's all dark."

 

Or maybe he's just ******* with us.

BTW: Ignore the subject heading. I was just bored...

 

Oh boy, here we go again...

 

Rougue Ten- LMAO!!!

 

As a matter of fact, it is all dark.

Well, you're right.

It is now, with so many darksiders in the NJO. We have Kyp, who went to the darkside and blew up a solar system, on the Jedi Council. I think it's blasphemous. You have jaina, and Jacen, and all of Kyp's followers, and Mara, and Lukje, for that matter. All tainted by darkness.

Poor Yoda.

 

I feel strangly compelled to up this...

 

Esplin 9466 got it right.

Somehow I got the impression of GL in the `70s being a hippie dude mixing Pink Floyd and Dune and coming up with Star Wars.

All of you came up with great replies. Amazing.

 

But you were ******* with us, right?

 

If there is no darkside, it contradicts Lucas comments on the darkside on the DVDs and other interviews. If there is no darkside it contradicts major plot points in various bantam, Dark Horse and WEG era stories.

 

The concept of "no darkside" does not contridict anything Lucas has ever said about the force. As a matter of fact I believe it is more in line with his ideas concerning the force. The force is in all things. It is an energy field that binds the galaxy together. Maybe it is just me but I have trouble beliving that energy has an agenda. It just is. The people who can channel the force, on the other hand, they do have an agenda. Mostly the concept of no darkside is a semantic thing. It is trying to dispell the cult that has arisen in the novels (and in the understanding of the fan base) that makes characters not responsible for their actions. Oh, Kyp isn't to blame for destroying Cardia, he was seduced by the darkside. BS! Kyp is responsible for his actions, just like vader and the Emperor. They used the force for evil, however, that doesn't make the force evil. The force is neutral. It takes no sides. That is why there is no darkside, just evil "dark" characters.

 

There is a Dark Side. Just not in the Force, as you so eloquently stated it's energy and so doesn't take sides or even have them. But you can't say there is no Dark side, it exists in people because again as you said they do have an agenda and put the Force to evil uses.

BTW Kyp was under the influence of Exar Kun, a long dead Dark Lord of the Sith when he destroyed Carida so he's not fully responsible for his actions.

 

BTW Kyp was under the influence of Exar Kun, a long dead Dark Lord of the Sith when he destroyed Carida so he's not fully responsible for his actions.

So the GFFA shouldn't hold him responsible?

Mmm. Just like how in our society we don't hold violent criminals under the influence of drugs/drug dealers responsible for their actions. Oh, wait. We do hold crack-heads who kill people responsible for their actions. I forgot.

 

Counterpoint

God would technically be an energy field were one to describe his being scientiffically.

I'm not saying God is the Force or vice versa but one has to take note there is a "Will" of the Force

The Force also contains the collected sum of all spirits in the universe as described in the universe

It is a benevolent being it seems in its Light Side but it also seems to have what amounts to a Id

Both that can be drawn from

I don't see any reason why there is no Dark Side....just because the Force is one doesn't mean it doesn't have a vile aspect

 

well I never thought I'd do this, but I'm about to argue on the same side as Valiento lol

There is no dark side of the Force, but like Val said, there is a Dark Side. Now, this dark side is called "The Dark Side of the Force" but although literally that says a dark side of the Force itself, it really refers to the dark side of people who have an affect on life. For what is the basic definition of the Force? Life.

Sure nature has no bad side good side, but things happen in nature that are dark. This is considered the dark side. This is what happens to the Force.

When someone uses the dark side (of their powers) it leaves a residual of their dark emotions behind. So when Jedi go to a place and feel the place is strong with "the dark side of the Force" they are actually referring to the dark residual emotions left behind by the darksiders.

There is no dark side of the force.
As a matter of fact, it is all dark.

Well I am not really sure of your second statement, but I think that is a matter of looking at it. Yes it is all dark, but it is also all light. (I know that doesn't make sense, but we already know that opposites can happen at the same time in the Force...well at least according to Vergere's theory)

Forgive my ignorance, but I do not know what Pink Floyd is so I cannot comment any more on that.

There is a Dark Side. Just not in the Force, as you so eloquently stated it's energy and so doesn't take sides or even have them. But you can't say there is no Dark side, it exists in people because again as you said they do have an agenda and put the Force to evil uses.

Exactly. Although I'd like to throw in the "The will of the Force" idea of Qui-Gon's, what Valiento is saying is true IMO but I wonder how the will fits in.

BTW Kyp was under the influence of Exar Kun, a long dead Dark Lord of the Sith when he destroyed Carida so he's not fully responsible for his actions.

So the GFFA shouldn't hold him responsible?

Mmm. Just like how in our society we don't hold violent criminals under the influence of drugs/drug dealers responsible for their actions. Oh, wait. We do hold crack-heads who kill people responsible for their actions. I forgot.

Hmm but we don't hold people who are forced by others or tricked by others into killing for there actions. Depending on the circumstance of course.

Counterpoint

God would technically be an energy field were one to describe his being scientiffically.

I'm not saying God is the Force or vice versa but one has to take note there is a "Will" of the Force

The Force also contains the collected sum of all spirits in the universe as described in the universe

It is a benevolent being it seems in its Light Side but it also seems to have what amounts to a Id

Both that can be drawn from

I don't see any reason why there is no Dark Side....just because the Force is one doesn't mean it doesn't have a vile aspect

Hi Charlemagne19, the idea I see behind the whole 'no Dark Side' concept is that the Force is one, and yeah there is a vile aspect to it, just like there is to nature, but the vileness is from the people who manipulate the Force, rather than the other way round.

As far as the God/Force analogy, well I am not a Christain and don't truly believe in the Christain concept of God, but as far as the will of God/Force is concerned, I am unsure. The Force does seem to have a will, and from GL's concept of balance, the will of the Force is to have itself in balance (and that is not equal dark and light things but a harmonious peaceful existence, this is what GL has stated (or something to that affect)) so the Force sends messages to the Jedi trying to help them, it brought the Chosen One, but gave him the choice to follow the dark or the light. When Anakin was set for the dark, I would contend the Force brought about the birth of Luke and Leia to bring Anakin back to the right path. So the Force is one and can support both dark and light uses of it but the will of the Force tries to bring things into ba

 

Wow. I was silly and started a thread that turns serious.

Amazing.

 

Well a couple of stories to ponder.

Darksaber. Callista is cut off from the lightside of the force and can't use "lightside powers" that benefit people, or can be used for defense. But it goes onto state that she can tap into darkside of the force to use "darkside powers", powers of offense(that can kill, or maim), and it was implied because she used the power that palpatine used, to take over clone bodies when she took over the ship, and then Cray Mingla's body(Dark Empire sourcebook, and Tales of the Jedi sourcebook, calls it something like, "The most evil of darkside powers").

WEG(some WOTC), often mentions that while the dark side can't force you do something, it can tempt you into doing something wrong. Several times the force is described as having positive and negative polarity. I suppose similer to religious idea of a concious controlled by angels, and evil angels who give you advice, or tempt you, but don't force you to make decisions. So in the case of darkside energy field, it says while you it can tempt you, it's still up to the individual to choose to draw darkside powers from it. If he makes that choice then those powers can corrupt him(make him want to draw on more darkside powers, premature aging, and other things). But the force itself, either polarity, can't make you do things that you didn't first choose to do, it can only "will" suggestions. But you are the one that makes the choice, and it is your own "internal darkside" that makes you choose which polarity you choose to draw from. Beyond that both are natural parts of the universe.

IIRC, WOTC put it something like, one deals with the natural order of death and decay, while the other dealt more with the idea of regeneration and rebirth, both exist as natural parts of the force, but without one, the other can't exist, and both follow the natural order of the universe. so a jedi who decides to tap into the darkside aspects of the one force, are supporting death and decay of the universe(making it proceed faster than it naturally should), while someone who sticks to the lightside aspects are trying to prevent death and decay as long as possible, while making sure a new generation can be born to replace the old.

This of course doesn't mean that you can't be involuntarily forced to use the darkside(thus corrupting yourself closer to the darkside) by say another darksider. Such as in the case of Exar Kun in TOTJ comics.

Insider, called force lightning, something like a terrible evil darkside power, something that a true jedi master wouldn't use.

 

Hmm but we don't hold people who are forced by others or tricked by others into killing for there actions. Depending on the circumstance of course.

Yeah. And what movie did you see that in?

 

Well, i have found another Pink Floyd/Star Wars connection! Actually , it must be PF who copied Star Wars, but here it goes: On their album "the final cut", the last song is titled "Two suns in the sunset" something about tatooine.......

 

Esplin 9466 got it right.

Amazing.