Did Jango Fett ever meet, and possibly kill, a Jedi before AOTC? (hypothesis within)

After much discussion with Darth Sin and others, I finally decided to post this, my first ever thread, here in the AOTC forum. Thanks to the mods (particularly YodaJeff) for directing me on where to post this as well as proofing and correcting this thread for me. Hopefully there will be some good discussion on this.

My hypothesis is that Jango Fett, the infamous bounty hunter, met and possibly killed a Jedi before AOTC as a test of his abilities to be the clone host. Jango Fett could have assassinated Jedi Master Sifo-Dyas. There are several reason from AOTC that lead me to this conclusion.

First: Jango Fett had to be an extraordinary bounty hunter in order to be chosen to be the clone/stormtrooper template

It is obvious assumption that that Tyrannus/Dooku and Sidious/Palpatine wanted the template for their clones to be the best non-Jedi available. How did they weed out Jango Fett from the rest of the bounty hunters and people in the galaxy? There had to be something that separated Jango from the rest. Killing a noted Jedi master would be something that would show your exceptional skills.

Second: Jango had the skills necessary to kill a Jedi.

In the arena scene, we saw that Jango Fett was able to kill Coleman Trebor, one of the Jedi Council members. In fact, Jango would most likely have survived his fight with Mace, had Jango's rocket packs not been damaged by the Reek.

In addition, Jango was beating Obi-Wan in the fight on Kamino. Jango wasn't fighting blindly. It was as if he knew what weaknesses he could exploit when fighting a Jedi.

Third: Jango most likely met a Jedi before Obi-Wan.

On Kamino, when Jango and Obi-Wan first meet, Jango says, "Always a pleasure to meet a Jedi" and is quite suspicious of Obi-Wan's line of questioning. It was almost as if Jango knew what to expect from a Jedi.

In addition, every time, with the exception of his fight with Coleman Trebor, Jango always was trying to disarm the Jedi he encountered. How did he know what to do? Yes, it could have been from observation from his fight on Kamino, but even before that, he had a method to his attack. First, he used an aerial attack (the missile). He then prevented Obi-Wan from getting his lightsaber by using the grappling wire. In the Arena, he dove for the Mace's lightsaber and attempted to use his rockets to start an aerial attack on Mace. This shows that Jango had a definite strategy when it came to fighting with a Jedi.

Finally: Jango Fett had several skills that would be useful in killing a Jedi.

Jango and Zam were both skilled in long-range assassinations. Jango, as I mentioned above, was able to kill Zam undetected by the Jedi (who didn't notice him until after he had killed Zam). Therefore, if you have an assassin who can kill someone at long range without being detected by the Jedi, what makes you think that he couldn't kill a Jedi from long range? Moreover, if that didn't work, Jango could always fall back on his short-range attack, which obviously did work.

These four points lead me to believe that it is possible that Jango Fett could have met and killed a Jedi before AOTC. This means he could have assassinated Sifo-Dyas, possibly as a test of his ability to be a suitable clone host.

Why would the test for being the clone host be to kill a Jedi? Well, look at the skills Jango demonstrates. He can kill at long range and not be detected and he can kill a Jedi with one gun. These would be useful for the clonetroopers because, as they are all clones of Jango with superior weapons and have similar training, they could be used by the Emperor to kill the Jedi when the time comes.

 

Plus this one....

Master Sifo-Dyas died approx ten years before AOTC.

Imposter posing as Sifo-Dyas (Dooku?) orders clones.

Dooku, under the alias of Tyranus, hires Jango as the 'clone template'.

All of this happens around the same time period.

So maybe Jango and Dooku/Tyranus already knew each other.
Dooku gets Jango to ice Sifo-Dyas, so that the Count can assume his identity and order the clone army.

 

wow this has a lot of thought in it and I will have to say that I could very well belive that jango did kill sifo dias as part of his tests to become the one to "father the clones.

but what about this?

Sifo dias is actualy in on the whole thing with dooku and sidious. But after he orders the clones, sidious orders dooku to have the bounty hunter "jango" kill master sifo dias to keep the whole thing quiet. so jango would have killed a jedi the very jedi that hired him ,then he tells Obi that he was hired by tyranus to trow him of the trail.

 

That would be kind of cool if Jango killed Sifo-Dyas.

 

It would be cool. But how will we ever know? Whatever he did, as spectacular as it was, I dont think we'll hear about it. I dont think GL would spend screen time in E3 explaining the exploits of someone he killed off in E2. (except for comics of course, thank the maker for the EU )

I'm sure Jango killed Jedi. Many jedi. (see Open Seasons comic) But not Sifo-Dyas. I dont think Sifo-Dyas is dead. It seems unlikely to me that GL would drop a name like that & then we never get to see him. He plays a pretty big part. He ordered the clone army, who end up being the stormtroopers. (I know that has been debated, but GL confirms it during E2s commentary when Jango knocks his head on the door in Slave 1 after his fight with Obi-Wan.) I think Sifo-Dyas will be revealed in E3, and "oh, he's dead" seems kinda pointless. Why mention him at all? Remember - his death is never confirmed. Obi-Wan was "under the impression", but Mace & Yoda say nothing.
Curious....

Jango a killer of Jedi? Definitely. But I think we know all there is to know about his involvement with the Clone Army. Dooku/Tyrannus recruited him, used him, payed him, & watched him die.
A Jedi test? Maybe. But if the comics are right, Tyrannus already watched him kill a few Jedi. He aced the test.

I really like your idea that they purposely pick someone who has proven he can kill Jedi. That adds a whole new dimension to the clone troopers that I never considered. Since they are preparing to wipe out the Jedi, they need a bunch of Jedi killers.
Cool.

 

Ive been playing the starwars bounty hunter game for my ps2 and its a terrific game and obviously since its a starwars game the story is fantastic too.

The way things are going right now is I recieved a message from count dooku ( a message he sent to multiple bounty hunters )the message essentially puts a bounty on the head of a dark jedi who is in charge of the bando gora cult. sidious and dooku want the dark jedi killed so she won't ruin their plans and they figured whoever can take out the dark jedi will also make a perfect clone template.
thats the story so far, i actually just got the slave 1 it was pretty sweet seeing it in action for its first time technically.

 

I agree with wstraka5 on this issue

 

sifo dias is dead and jango killed him. it would make perfect sence.

 

Nice post. I wish there more of these in the forums.

 

Though we do not have the evidence on film and may not concerning wstraka5 theory here, there is enough to suggest that Jango has not only encountered a Jedi Knight and that specifically Sifo-Dyas in killing him.

But let me also take this a step further to help validate this being possible, and that being the relationship he had with Dooku.
Count Dooku as we all know is Tyranus, the same person Jango named as the one who hired him for the clone template.

Who of all people would be able to tell a non-Force user how to possibly defeat a Jedi than a Jedi(or former)themselves in that of Count Dooku?

I propose that Dooku may have well taught or communicated to Jango how he might defeat a Jedi in battle with the skills and weapons he possessed. I thought it interesting that Dooku did not warn Jango not to go after Mace as no doubt he had to know that he was heading into the arena after him. It is my belief that Dooku not only was shocked by what the implications of Jango's death meant in terms of the cloning process, but he was shocked at the ease in which Mace was able to kill him.

In other words, Dooku may have really thought Jango could not only hold his own against the likes of Mace, but that he could kill him as well.

Lastly, one thing that is not mentioned in the films, and may never be, and that is Jango's origin. I know that the AOTC Visual Dictionary is not canon, but it does help to some degree. The dictionary states that Jango was the last of the Mandalorian race wiped out by the Jedi and he wears their armour in honor of them.

So if any of this were true, this provides Jango's own motivation for desiring to kill a Jedi("Always a pleasure to meet a Jedi"). But also, Dooku being a former Jedi could have capitalized on this fact.

And was Jango hired by Dooku to kill Sifo-Dyas to prove himself, or did Dooku learn that Jango kill Sifo-Dyas, and this is why he was hired?


Darth Sin!

 

Well it's certainly possible that Jango did kill S-D and someone impersonated him it would be a bit anticlimatic if in 3 we find out that's what happened.

 

I like the idea of JF killing Master SD...

 

For those who haven't read the "Open Seasons" comic:

Two years before TPM, Jango Fett and the Mandalorians took on a job putting down an "insurrection" for a corrupt governor on the planet Galidraan. They learned (too late) that it was a double-cross, because the governor had been aiding a traitor to their organization named Vizsla. Once their job was done, they were suddenly surrounded by fifty Jedi. The Jedi had been led to believe by the governor that the Mandalorians had slaughtered women and children, and they went in slashing first and asking questions later. All the Mandalorians except for Jango were slaughtered. Jango went into a berserk kill-frenzy, taking down more than half of them -- with his BARE HANDS -- before being cornered and captured. The leader of this Jedi unit...was Count Dooku. "what have we done...?" the shaken Jedi Master whispered. The Jedi were forced by the Senate to hand Jango over to the governor (he later escaped). This apparently was what started Dooku on the road to quitting the Order, and what gave Jango a burning obsession (one he passed down to Boba) to wipe every Jedi off the galactic map.

 

Jango was a kid after the events of TPM but I bet Count DOOkU killed syo dios!

 

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[b]Darth Sin[/b] wrote:
[i]I propose that Dooku may have well taught or communicated to Jango how he might defeat a Jedi in battle with the skills and weapons he possessed. I thought it interesting that Dooku did not warn Jango not to go after Mace as no doubt he had to know that he was heading into the arena after him. It is my belief that Dooku not only was shocked by what the implications of Jango's death meant in terms of the cloning process, but he was shocked at the ease in which Mace was able to kill him. [/i][hr]
Intresting idea. I agree that Dooku is shocked at the ease that Mace defeats Jango. However, your thought would make the case for the clones killing the Jedi an even more plausible idea! In addition, you could make it fit with the timeline that is hinted at by Obi-Wan in his various conversations on Kamino regarding Sifo-Dyas. If we take what Obi-Wan said as the correct timeline, then we can construct a possible secnario of what happened at the end of TPM. Lets assume that it is over 11 years before AOTC when the word of Qui-Gon and Maul's death reaches the Jedi Temple:

Dooku then leaves the Jedi Order and meets Sidious. He then recieves his orders to find a suitable clone host. The criteria for the clone host is to kill Master Sifo-Dyas (two reasons. First is to prove the ability of the host. Second, eliminate Sifo-Dyas to coverup the Kamino deletion and possibily the ordering of the clones on orders from Palpatine). Dooku seeks out Jango Fett and other bounty hunters on the moons of Bogden, tells him how to defeat the Jedi. Jango Fett is first that is sucessful in killing Sifo-Dyas. Now, 10 years prior to AOTC, Jango is ordered to Kamino for the first set of clones as well as the making of Boba Fett. For the next 5 years he does other missions, but is to make Kamino his home base (so the Kaminoians can get the fresh samples).

It could be a plausible timeline.

Let us assume that we can take the EU backstory that [b][color=red]Nightowl[/b][/color] gave as the true backstory of Jango Fett (No EU/canon debates! This is a place for a free expression of ideas.), then it would be very ironic if Dooku was the one who taught Jango to kill his killers. All Dooku would have to do is say it was wrong of the Jedi to order him and his team to kill the Mandalorians and what he wants to now do is right that injustice by telling Jango how to kill his the ones responsible for the destruction of the Mandalorians. Now the hunters become the hunted.

[hr][b]black_saber[/b] wrote:
[i] Jango was a kid after the events of TPM but I bet Count DOOkU killed syo dios![/i][hr]
Unless Jango Fett ages really quickly, [b]The2ndQuest[/b] is probably right on Jango's age.

Some great ideas guys! Keep 'em coming. :)

 

Furthering thoughts from my first post here, it is my belief that possibly Dooku's influence along with Jango's own hatred for the Jedi is why I support he killed Sifo-Dyas, and why I support he seemed to be very knowledgeable and equipped to battle a Jedi.

Before I go further, I had asked the question at the end of my last post whether Jango killed Sifo-Dyas of his own accord and this is why he was hired by Dooku/Tyranus, or did Dooku/Tyranus hire him to kill Sifo-Dyas, and in doing so this is why he was chosen as the clone template?

I support my latter question that Dooku hired Jango to kill Sifo-Dyas, and in doing so he proved himself to be the template for the clones. As a matter of fact, it is possible that Dooku hired him to try and kill any Jedi, and not necessarily Sifo-Dyas specifically.

But I believe he was hired specifically by Dooku/Tyranus to kill Sifo-Dyas. And after doing so, he was presented with the opportunity to become the template for the clones.

I do also support that Dooku may have known or known of Jango previously before leaving the Jedi order, and knew he hated the Jedi because he was the last of the Mandalorians, though this is not mentioned on film.

He may well have been told that his clones would eventually help to kill off the Jedi, and this was another motivating factor in agreeing to be the template besides his salary.

Lastly, I like Jango's denial of ever knowing Sifo-Dyas to Obi-Wan when he said sharply to him; "Never heard of him"!

I believe he knew him, because he was hired to kill him. I do hope this theory proves true, and that in EP III we find out that Yoda and Mace knew that Sifo-Dyas was mysteriously killed, and after reopening the case on his death due to clones and his name being mentioned as part of it, they learn that Jango did kill him.

Darth Sin!

 

This really is good work.

As for how it could be revealed that jango killed Sifo Dias, I believe there will be an admission scene in EPIII like there was in ROTJ, "It was I who allowed the Aliiance to know the location of the shield generator", etc.

Something like this for EPIII:

"It was I who arranged for Jango to kill Sifo Dias, it was I who formed the Separatists through Dooku, everything has happened according to my bidding," etc etc.

 

Some of this stuff actually ties in with the look that Dooku gives when Jango dies; anyone think of that?

 

Jango was a good bounty hunter.
He might have killed jedi before ATOC

however, i find it hard to believe that such a great bounty hunter tried to take down a JEDI MASTER with rinky-dink blaster pistols that looked like something out of a star trek cartoon *gags*

i believe that Jango was inexperienced when it came to fighting Jedi. The only reason, IMHO, that he was able to kill Coleman Trembor was because he is a Jedi Reject.
He might have killed one or two jedi before he face obi-wan but that really isn't much time to evaluate one's stradegy. Finally, each jedi uses a different form of combat.
From what i saw in the movie, he tried tp keep Mace at bay with blasters. That probably means that he faced Jedi that mastered in defensive combat where it would only be a matter of time before he was able to pick someone off. Any jedi stupid enough to do that would have been incredibally weak. Mace, would be different. He immediatly went on the offensive and look what happened...*grimace*

 

Well, the way I see it, each Jedi's fighting style would depend greatly on the race--different physiologies. (sp?)

For example, Zabraks, like Maul and Eeth Koth, are said to be able to stand great amounts of pain.

We have seen the ease Jango had when taking out Coleman Trebor (who is not a total reject, because he somehow got on the Jedi Council. Now Jocasta Nu, she's the reject....probably still hacked off that Coleman got to the Council and she didn't...)

Sure he can take on aliens, but when it comes to human Jedi, he just can't hack it.

We have already seen Jango tangle with Obi-Wan and retreat....then he his killed by Windu.

So perhaps, if Jango did indeed take him out, Sifo-Dyas is not human.

Also you have to remember that Jango just got run down by the Reek, so he is battered, bruised, and is probably seeing double....

 

I love stuff like this. There are a lot of interesting ideas here. The one problem I see:
We're talking about 2 dead guys.
Even with a ROTJ'esque revelation scene (which is sure to come in E3 anyway), who would explain it? Plus, why would anyone bother to explain how or why dead guy number one knew dead guy number 2, or why one killed the other.
It sounds like a James bond spoof. "Well Obi-Wan, now that I have you in chains I will explain my whole diabolical plot. Let me tell you about a man named Sifo-Dyas who was killed years ago."
I doubt it.
The only possibilty I can see is that Sifo-Dyas isnt dead & he'll be back. I just dont see any reason to even mention his name unless we'll eventually find out who he is. And I dont think "oh, hes dead." would be very interesting for anyone. Therefore , I dont think GL would spend the time setting up a character like that.
He ordered the friggin Stormtropers. He plays a major role in the Star Wars universe.

My theory: Sifo-Dyas left the Jedi order and became.... **********drumroll**********
Count Dooku. (yeah, Tyrannus too. theres no name limit.)
He lies to the Kaminoans about being on the council and places the order with his newly recruited buddy as the host. Then with his new assumed identity (opening scroll- "the MYSTERIOUS Count Dooku") he builds a seperatist movement with an army to oppose the army he just ordered. When the time comes and war finally breaks out ("good news") he sits back with his buddy Palpy to watch chaos rule.
Nice and neat, and all ready to explain in a few easy sentences.
Sentences like "that name no longer has any meaning for me."

Anybody agree with me?

 

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[b]arrowheadpodracer[/b] wrote:
[i]Sifo-Dyas left the Jedi order and became.... **********drumroll********** Count Dooku.[/i][hr]
The problem with that is that Obi-Wan states that Sifo-Dyas is dead, several times. If Dooku was Sifo-Dyas, wouldn't Yoda, Mace [i]and[/i] Obi-Wan recognize him? Yet, every time his name is mentioned by the Jedi, it was [b]Dooku[/b] not Sifo-Dyas. Also, Mace, at the beginning of the movie says that Dooku was once a Jedi.

[hr][b]LeeKenobi[/b] wrote:
[i] Well, the way I see it, each Jedi's fighting style would depend greatly on the race--different physiologies.[/i][hr]
Grand Admiral Thrawn's ideas, eh? ;)

You may be on to something. Mace has his own unique fighting style. According to the EU, he is the only person who uses fighting Form 7 (and by the movie, he is the only one who is a little more agressive than Anakin). So, if Dooku gave Jango the secrets to killing the Jedi, but not Mace's, since it was unique to only Mace. Besides, Dooku probably expected to take on Mace himself, since he wanted to prove that he was a better Jedi than everyone.

Also, [b]JediMaster41589[/b], Jango had a specific method to take Coleman Trembor (who wasn't a Jedi Reject, how else would he have gotten to be on the council?) out. It took 3 shots to kill Coleman. It was after the first shot that Coleman was injured and couldn't defend himself.

 

Yes, Jango did kill some Jedi(as somebody else mentioned see Open Seasons comic), and no he was not beating Obi-Wan in their fight in AOTC. Obi-Wan was winning in spite of the fact that he had to contend with not only Jango but also Boba using Slave 1's weapons. Unfortunately, he was attached to Jango's lasso when he kicked Jango off the ledge so he was pulled over the edge with him. And he had direct orders to capture(not kill) Jango.

 

wstraka5 wrote:
The problem with that is that Obi-Wan states that Sifo-Dyas is dead, several times. If Dooku was Sifo-Dyas, wouldn't Yoda, Mace and Obi-Wan recognize him? Yet, every time his name is mentioned by the Jedi, it was Dooku not Sifo-Dyas. Also, Mace, at the beginning of the movie says that Dooku was once a Jedi.

1) Obi-wan states that Sifo-Dyas is dead once, to someone who seems surprised. He then tries to confirm it with Yoda & Mace & they say nothing. So we really dont know what happened. Did he die? Obi-Wan is actually "under the impression he died BEFORE" the time the order was (in fact) placed. That, in itself, is curious. The fact that Yoda & Mace answer his inquiry with silence makes me think that they know he isnt really "dead". Hes just.... gone. Like another former Jedi we all know.

2)Who says they dont recognize him ? Just cause they dont say: "Hey, Sifo!" ? They call him Dooku just like Obi-Wan called Anakin 'Darth' when they met on the Death Star. Thats his name now. He changed it. It happens all the time in Star Wars. (Obi-Wan/Ben ) They just dont realize he's become as bad as he has. They think he's just a "political idealist, not a murderer."

3) And mace is right; Dooku was once a Jedi. Just like Vader was once a Jedi. The men who were Jedi became something else. When they did that, they changed their names. "And the good man who was [Sifo Dyas] was destroyed."


As GL would say;
"Its like a symphony. There are repeating themes."