Fate: Predetermined or what you make of it?

Is fate predetermined? Some people believe that fate has already been
outlined for each individual. That the choices that have been made, or are going to be made, have already been plotted on a giant map of one's journey through life. Ultimately, are we destined for a life that has already had the outcome chosen for us? Do the decisions that you make now fall into line with what has already been determined? Or, is fate what you make of it?


Other people argue that there is no predetermined path that you walk upon. That each individual choice causes a domino effect that leads to other choices. That there are thousands of variations that your life could wind up being and that nothing is set in stone... i.e.: your life is what you make it.


Does believing one or the other directly affect the decisions you make on a daily basis? Is believing in predetermined fate an excuse for the lazy?? For example, "well, my life has already been planned out for me, so I might as well just wait for something to fall into my lap."


Personally, I am inclined to believe that there are no coincidences. That
things happen for a reason... but I also believe that you can directly
affect the outcome of your life by making certain pivotal decisions along the way. Sort of a mix of the two beliefs.


What do you believe? Does fate even exist??

 

A lot depends on what you believe about Free Will. You you believe that you have the ability to choose your own path or that everything is predetermined for you?

If you are able to choose, then by definition nothing is predetermined. However, if you cannot choose, then there is onlyone path you can follow and everything is predetermined.

Kimball Kinnison

 

Well after watching several episodes of Star Trek I believe I am an expert in Temperal Mechanics.

I don't believe in fate. I don't believe that all of our decisions have already been made and that whatever we choose to do has already been written. I believe we make our own choices and create our own paths. For instance, lets say you created a time machine and journeyed into the future. The moment you arrived, that path wouldn't exist because when you got back to your own time, you could change it.

 

I was speaking more along the lines of 'religious' views as opposed to 'free will'. Free will, by my defintion, has a tendency to deal with Socialogical implications. What society has dealt out as far as those decision making skills one can make. I believe fate is different than free will and isn't necessarily what I'm talking about.

 

What you make of it.

 

No, I don't believe in predestination at all. After all, our universe is uncertain on the quantum mechanical level, so everything above that must be at least as uncertain if not much more so.

 

What you make of it. However, genetics play a large part in your personality, which can affect your decisions.

 

Genetics play a part in your development, but no individual is bound by their genetics.

Or maybe I'm overly optimistic

 

Many studies have shown that genetics affect personality. For example, identical twins, raised all their lives in different, seperate enviroments, still have very similar personalities, mannerisms, and interests.

I believe that, in a certain sense, your fate is predetermined.

 

The definition of fate is pretty interesting, as it ties into mythology - this is from the Encyclopedia Brittanica:

"Greek Moira, plural Moirai, Latin Parca, plural Parcae
in Greek and Roman mythology, any of three goddesses who determined human destinies, and in particular the span of a person's life and his allotment of misery and suffering. Homer speaks of Fate (moira) in the singular as an impersonal power and sometimes makes its functions interchangeable with those of the Olympian gods. From the time of the poet Hesiod (8th century BC) on, however, the Fates were personified as three very old women who spin the threads of human destiny. Their names were Clotho (Spinner), Lachesis (Allotter), and Atropos (Inflexible). Much later, some fanciful writers assigned different tasks to the three goddesses: Clotho spun the ?thread? of human fate, Lachesis dispensed it, and Atropos cut the thread (thus determining the individual's moment of death). The Romans identified the Parcae, originally personifications of childbirth, with the three Greek Fates. The Roman goddesses were named Nona, Decuma, and Morta."

 

The only "Fate" I believe in is the current understanding that our Universe will continue to expand forever and fade into a complete void.

Otherwise our future as individuals and as a civilization is what we make of it.

If I were a religious person I would think to myself, "If I were God and could make the Universe so that each living thing had a pre-determined fate, then what would be the purpose of making the Universe if I already knew what was going to happen to each and every being?"

 

I don't believe in a pre-determined fate, but I believe that there is only one path that I will/could end up taking. So I hypothetically say, "what will be the inevitable future" because although it is not written yet, there is only one possible future that can occur. So I wonder about it.

 

The ancient Greek ideas on fate were quite different from the ones we have today. For them, fate was a central idea in their religion and in their entire way of life. To get a better perspective on this, read The Iliad. It was a work that was not about character and not about plot, but rather about fate and how it is the driving force that sculpts events no matter what is done in an attempt to impede it. There was no such thing as individualism to the Greeks; everything was about fate.

Over the past couple of millenia, humanity has come to emphasis the value of the individual more and more, so naturally people who live in the present era think fate is less influential than the Greeks did.

 

well i personally believe in free will, however, how much real choice we actually have is another question........i sorta see it like a large 8 lane motorway........you got choice as to what lane you are in, but its still on the road........the road being all sorts of constraining factors.......race, upbringing, health etc

 

I'm not sure I like the term "pre-determined". This gives fate a purpose, most of the divine in interpretation. Doing this only complicates Fatalism. Instead I would argue that Fate is better described by the term "unavoidable".

I feel it important to state the Law of Excluded Middle (LEM): Every meaningful statement is either true or false.

This leads to one argument for fate.
1) Every meaningful statement about the future is either true or false.
2) If 1, then nobody can do anything to change what the future holds.
3) If nobody can do anything to change what the future holds, then Fatalism is true.
4) Therefore, Fatalism is true.

As an excuse for laziness...it is stupid to think that something will just land in your lap so you might as well just sit there and wait thinking tha you can't make a difference. It is just as likely that your fate is to just sit there and have nothing fall in your lap. Lazy fatalists are quiet often optimists.

 

I'm not completly sure weather or not it is predeterminded or what you make of it.

If you constantly don't do your work in a subject in school you're determining your fate when you get your marks.

And we all know our fate - death. We cannot escape it. We can prolong, but not indefinatly. It's just a matter of when and where - these two things are the only things we can control.

but with your distant future and what you aim to do, it's all up to you. No-one forces you to take up the occupation of your dreams.

So I think both are true, from different aspects.

 

Maybe the predestination is is the choice it self?



DD - The Fateful Spliff

 

if everything is pre-determined, where's the fun? the individuality? That would make us all like mice in a maze, our opinions, our beliefs, our choices (which aren't really choices then are they?) would all mean nothing
and then there is the question as to who determines our paths....

 

I venture that is ourselves?




DD - The Divine Spliff

 

i agree it is ourselves, i do not believe in predestination
but for those who do, who is it that determines your future?

 

I don't believe in predetermined fate. You make your life what you make it. There is no forseen power that can wave a hand and punish you and tell you," yes, you had that coming."

 

I believe that each individual has the power to choose. Life essentially is what you make of it.

However, our environment, intelligence, genetics, personality, and every other part sometimes determine how we will respond to a situation. While we have the power to choose, often we will end up choosing something just because of who we are. It would take quite and act of will to change it.

I also see no reason why god would create the universe to predetermine everything. In my opinion, the universe is god experiencing himself.

 

Without sounding too much like Forrest Gump, Id have to say that I believe a little bit of both. I look at the friends in my life and the relationships Ive had, and I think they've all added positive and/or negative elements to my life that make me who I am today. I think I went out and I made those connections, but that perhaps it was fate that put them in my life to make me a better person.

...as far as fate being religious...to me its more like my role in the universe as opposed to a higher being

Im not an articulate person at all, so if that makes no sense then I agree with [insert whoever you think is smartest here] on this issue.





I would also like to congratulate on DarthGlymmer on her fist serious post! Im just teasing you, you are one of the friends I meant who has made me a better, if not weirder, person.

 

I would also like to congratulate on DarthGlymmer on her fist serious post! Im just teasing you, you are one of the friends I meant who has made me a better, if not weirder, person.

And I congratulate you on only misspelling 'first'. I agree with you though... I have made you a better person.

Actually, I agree with Humble extra and the comparison to life as an 8 change highway. Or maybe branches or forks in the road. Kind of like Frosts poem:

Two roads diverged in a yellow wood,
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
And looked down one as far as I could
To where it bent in the undergrowth;
Then took the other, as just as fair,
And having perhaps the better claim,
Because it was grassy and wanted wear;
Though as for that the passing there
Had worn them really about the same,
And both that morning equally lay
In leaves no step had trodden black.
Oh, I kept the first for another day!
Yet knowing how way leads on to way,
I doubted if I should ever come back.
I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I-
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.

 

Without sounding too much like Forrest Gump, Id have to say that I believe a little bit of both. I look at the friends in my life and the relationships Ive had, and I think they've all added positive and/or negative elements to my life that make me who I am today. I think I went out and I made those connections, but that perhaps it was fate that put them in my life to make me a better person.

Leia800, I think you pretty much summed up my thoughts on the matter there. Often things have happened to me that I later feel were supposed to have happened.
For example, I had to drop out of university last year because I was suffering from severe depression. At the time it sucked, but looking back on it now, it was one of the best things that could have happened to me. Through suffering depression, and through leaving uni for a time, I ended up making some new friends, ones I think I will be friends with much longer than the people I'd met at university. I'd say I'm a much stronger person now, and more self-reliant. Because I didn't have any studying to do, I had more free time, so started posting here at TFN. If that hadn't happened, I might never have met my boyfriend. If I hadn't been so determined to fight against the depression, I'd never have found the courage to play my guitar and sing in public - I was trying to prove to myself that while I couldn't cope with my studies, I could still cope with life. If I hadn't dropped out of uni, I'd never have ended up working as a web site editor for 6 months - before, I'd never even thought about getting into web design and stuff, but I enjoyed it so much I'd like to get back into it after I graduate.

So, basically I kinda believe in fate when it comes to the little things, but I don't buy the whole 'my life has been laid out and I will achieve this, that, and the other before I die' thing.