PT Grievous Line towards Obi Wan

In Episode 3 when Obi Wan faces Grievous in Utapau it seems that Grievous is introducing himself to Obi Wan like if he hadnt seen him before Grievous says:"i have been trained in your Jedi Arts by Count Dooku" in Legends and in TCW Obi Wan has seen Grievous before Why is Grievous introducing himself if he has seen Obi Wan before?

And that is not the only contradiction Anakin says to Dooku "My powers have doubled since the last time we met" and Obi Wan says: "This time we do it together" this was a more clear reference to their duel in Geonosis since Obi Wan and Anakin did not face Dooku at the same time because Anakin attacked first and was quickly defeated same with Obi Wan also Obi Wan says "You wont get away this time Dooku"another reference to Geonosis

I think the original intention was that Grievous hadnt seen Obi Wan before at least never fought him and Anakin and Obi Wan should never have faced Dooku since the Episode 2 in 2005 TCW dont existed and in Tartakovsky Clone Wars Grievous never met Obi Wan and Anakin

 

you...do realise that ROTS 'Episode 3' was made before TCW right?

is it stupid: yes
should TCW retcon the movies?: no
do most fans care?: no.

I learned not to care either. It's fiction. I've long ago learned not to give IU explanation to things.

 

The easy explanation is that Count Dooku instructs Grievous to fight Obi Wan's individual way of fighting specifically.
So it's not "I have been trained in your Jedi Arts by Count Dooku" (to fight Jedi in general... no pun intended)
it's "since our last encounter I've been trained to fight you, specifically"

And let's not pretend Obi Wan no-difficulty'd Grievous. Grievous had Obi Wan hanging off a ledge.

 

Yes Star Wars is full of Retcons i understand that everything is fiction but i like to make sense of everything still i enjoy all Star Wars stories

This could be true but being honest its another Retcon

 

only he didn't say that did he? (bolded)

he said the line before it, which you quite rightly interpreted to mean fight Jedi in general

 

If I had watched everything in chronological order the first time, I'd have assumed that Grievous meant he was trained by Dooku after his last fight with Obi-Wan. That's what it sounds like to me now.

As for Anakin's claim that his powers had doubled, well... How do you measure that? It was always just an attempt at intimidating Dooku. Now, with their previous encounter being the one on Oba Diah, I assume that it's been a couple of months and Anakin has been training like crazy, like he always does, to keep getting more skilled and powerful.

"This time, we'll do it together" - because they always end up separated somehow, even in TCW.

"You won't get away this time, Dooku" - because so far, he's gotten away every time they've met.

Retcons? Yes. Contradictions? No.

 

I think Anakin was referring to the last time he saw Dooku he was a Padawan now he was a Jedi Knight thats why he says"My powers have doubled since the last time we met" but well in Star Wars there is many Retcons i dont have a problem with that

 

You also have to take into account the majority of the audience doesn't know anything about Grievous, let alone EU. That line in RotS is there to explain to audiences how Grievous, who is neither Jedi nor Sith, knows how to fight with lightsabers and can hold his own against Kenobi.

Anakin's line to Dooku is also largely for our benefit. Yes, he's trash talking with Dooku there, and it's also a bit of exposition in showing how arrogant he still is about his powers. As Dooku says, "Twice the pride, double the fall."


Are they retcons? Possibly... I say they're fudge-able.

One thing TCW did keep undeniably consistent was Anakin never seeing Grievous, besides flying in their ships. So Anakin's line, "You're shorter than I expected." is still solid.

 

Occam's Razor: He's taunting Obi-Wan, trying to intimidate him. Like, "From what Dooku told me, he handed you your ass so what makes you think you stand even the most remote chance against me?!"

Same with Anakin's (albiet cringey) 'my powers have doubled' line.

Taunts aren't about facts, it's all bravado. Hence why its immediately discounted once one of the combatants gets their proverbial ass utterly destroyed.

 

The problem here is Anakin killed Dooku even before Obi-Wan and Anakin encountered and fought Grevious together at the start of the film.

How is a dead Dooku going to train Grievous to specifically fight Obi-Wan?

 

Seriously? Grievous didn't fight them. He didn't even pull out a lightsaber. The last time he fought Obi-Wan before Utapau was in TCW.
Also, I don't believe he was trained to fight Obi-Wan specifically. I mean, maybe he was. But not exclusively. It was more likely about being better equipped to deal with Jedi in general.

 

I don't see that as an introduction, in that way.

 

these kinds of things are the reason i don't look at the cartoons as 'canon'.

 

My apologies if this is the wrong thread to pose this question, it may be semi related and I couldn't identify a general questions thread. But, I recently came across a video on Youtube where the narrator had a differing interpretation than mine regarding Dooku's line in RotS prior to his duel with Anakin & Obiwan.

Dooku line: "Your swords please, we don't want to make a mess of things in front of the Chancellor".

The narrator of the video interpreted Dooku asking the Jedi to surrender their lightsabers as he planned to obliterate them (in a messy way). I had always thought Dooku was asking them to activate their lightsabers, to engage in a duel instead of him have to use Force Lightning again on them or some other power (again being messy). Minor detail - but was struck that I may have misinterpreted Dooku's line since 2005. Thoughts?

Edit: Additionally, after the duel starts, Dooku says, "I've been looking forward to this". Seems like he wanted to engage Anakin & Obiwan.

 

The narrator is right.

 

Yes. He asked them to surrender their weapons, thereby politely implying that they were still no match for him. But of course, he knew they wouldn't.

 

That's nitpicking. That's like complaining that Qui-Gon trained Obi-Wan, when he's not mentioned in the OT. Remember that argument?

 

so we're supposed to believe that Anakin has faced Dooku bunches of times and since the last time a couple months earlier his powers have doubled, and not since ATOC

sure

 

Obi Wan and Anakin dueling Dooku after Episode 2 and before Episode 3 annoys me less compared to the Kenobi show where Vader dueled Obi Wan again after Episode 3 and before Episode 4 i think that was unnecessary and takes away from the impact that Episode 4 has

 

not the same thing.

Like at all

 

Oh, it is. Twenty years ago, people complained about that very thing. Saying that it contradicted TESB, because nowhere does he say "a Jedi Master who instructed me". It was a total contradiction and was debated for six or seven years.

ANAKIN: "My powers have doubled since the last time we met, Count."

Very open ended statement. Could mean Geonosis. Could mean Oba Diah. There's enough wiggle room. To everyone who just watch the films, it's the former. To those who watch TCW, it's the latter.

 

Some fans cling to their initial impressions. Others let go. That's how it's always been and how it always will be.

 

And remember, a taunt is a taunt. 'I'm going to destroy your ass' doesn't particularly care for facts in relation to skills, who trained them, or when they last fought.

 

"my powers have doubled since the last time we met count

Fans in 2002: oh he must not mean Geonosis but the dozen times they've met since then...

I know the TCW is now apparently THE canon and everything else including the movies is folklore and gnostic **** (apparently)

but newsflash: TCW did not exist in 2002, so it is thus by definition a retcon,

make excuses all you like, again not really that bothered as I said its fiction. Doesn't really matter.