"I'm a bit taller, that's all."

So, on the Alek = Malak debate, I've been saying over and over again that numerous details don't line up, one of the most important being Squint's height -- he's maybe six feet tall, but Malak was 6'7" -- he towered over everyone else in a way Alek just doesn't, and I don't believe that the artists would get a character's appearance that off when his height was one of his most noticeable characteristics in the game. So how come no one ever pointed out to me that in Flashpoint, Squint's first words are, "No worries, guys. I'm a bit taller, that's all," to his companions as he exits Demagol's Hall of Scientific Torture Fun?

Now, he's not noticeably taller than he had been in Crossroads, but whether he will get any taller depends on what made him taller. If it was surgical, then there's no reason to think he'll end up two meters tall. But if part of Demagol's Mad Science Regimen was to shoot him up with some growth hormones . . . we could easily see a two-meter Alek by war's end. Ladies and gents, I think the Alek/Malak theory just got a lot more likely.

I'd seen scans of Squint, but had never read the story all the way through until I got the TPB, and that line immediately jumped out at me. The fact that no one pointed that out to me before makes me wonder if it was an addition for the TPB . . . in which case it was a counter to height complaints and makes the theory almost certain. Can anyone check the issues to see if that was in there?

 

Just checked my copy of Issue #8, and yep, the line's in there. Having never played KOTOR, I have nothing to offer to the "This person becomes this person" debates, but if that line was never pointed out before, that's certainly interesting. Line's definitely in the issue, though.

 

Ah. Silly online people, then, not pointing out a perfectly good counterpoint. Still makes me think there may be some interesting things to come, then . . . that line completely changed my opinion from "clever red herring" -- like Haazen is to Sion -- to "actual setup". I think this might be the only theory so far that I actually buy into.

 

Would that make the Unknown Hooded Jedi Revan? Or was Malak just a compatriot of Revan (sorry, It's been a while since I've played KOTOR)?

 

Revan and Malak were best friends. When they became Sith, Malak was made the apprentice only because Revan was stronger.

 

I still say the hooded Jedi is Kreia. Revan doesn't talk all cryptic like he/she does.

As for Malak/Alek, this is an intriguing theory and all, but it still doesn't explain why they both have completely different eye colors. (Not like retcons haven't smudged over larger discrepencies in the past...)

 

I have considered if the "Bit Taller" bit was Squint crudely attempting to make light of being stretched out painfully "Rack" style or if it was a literal statement that meant, well, that he actually got taller. If the truth is that he did get taller I would prefer to think of it as some type of growth hormone where he is slowly gaining height rather than Demegal waiving a magic wand like...

"You know what comes next Squint"
"No....but I can take whatever you shell out, I am centered in the force."
*POOF*
"HAHAHAHA! I KNEW IT! Not even Jedi are immune to my +1 Inch rod of heightening!"
"NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!"

Anyone happen to look at the Pre-Sith Malek cutscene? Can you see his eye color in that? If not, I feel it wouldn't be a stretch for him to lose his eyes in whatever scuffle takes his jaw......noting the eye color change of Tholme due to his battle with Dooku. OFFTOPIC - Is that actually still Tholme's eye, is it an asthetic but worthless filler, or is it some type of cybernetic eye?

 

My initial reaction to seeing Squint in Commencement was that there was a possibility that he was Malak, he had the right sort of posture and of course the bald head, it was just the height that was the issue. That line didn't strike me straight away, like others at first I just took it to mean that he'd been on a rack of some sort, but thinking back I doubt Demagol would be using such a primitive technique whilst trying to discover the secret of the force in Jedi, but who knows. Then of course you have the similarity between Alek and Malak, but given that Revan and Malak never changed their names as far as I can remember does that mean he would be called Alek Malak

As for the other theories the hooded Jedi still makes me think of Revan more than Kreia, there are reasons for hiding both of their appearances, Kreia because she would be easily recognisable, Revan because there is no canon appearance for him as yet. The scouting that is done on Onderon and Dxun, places that would later become very important for Revan, seem much more like something the proactive Revan would do, rather than Kreia who seems much more of a thinker. Finally, there is the link to Cathar, Alek and the hooded Jedi are on Cathar and Revan obviously has a later link to Cathar of Juhani, but IIRC there is something during Revan's conversations with Juhani that alludes to him having been on Cathar during the Mandalorian War, but I'd have to play KoTOR again to be sure of that and the context of it.

As for the Krynda Draay is Kreia theory I don't know, she has the strong seeing power of Kreia and certainly fits with Kreia going somewhat against (or behind) the council. However, at the moment I just can't see where her training Revan fits into everything, from what we see it seems that she concentrates solely on the "seers" who become the Covenant, to the point where she even ignores her own son, so I'm not sure if Revan would fit in there. Then again there is that very cryptic line from the Hooded Jedi to Lucien, so if that Jedi is Revan that perhaps there is a connection between the covenant, Krynda and Revan.

As for the others I think Haazen is maybe a little too obvious as Sion, Sion keeps his shattered body together through anger, pain and hatred, whereas Haazen seems to be mostly bionic, also Sion has his right shoulder intact whereas Haazen doesn't. Either way, I doubt we'll see that much more of Sion, if any, given that he has to be on Korriban relatively soon and also has to be strong enough to survive the fallout and escape. Though I suppose that it would explain a link between Kreia and Sion and explain how he came to find her on Malachor V.

 

Malak wasn't Revan's apprentice before they turned dark, was he? IIRC, the game said that they were both Knights who went to war together because of their friendship.

Now, if it turns out that Kreia trained Revan and Malak, that might be interesting. What did KOTOR2 say she was up to during the Mandalorian Wars?

 

Yeah they were both Padawans at the same time, so either Alek isn't Malak or the Hooded Jedi isn't Revan. It can't be both as Alek refers to the Hooded Jedi as Master, so there is the possibility that Kreia is the Hooded Jedi and trained both Revan and Malak or of course that Alek simply isn't Malak. This is perhaps what makes the Kreia idea interesting as she claims she was cast from the Jedi Order due to her training of Revan, the Council then went on to blame her in some part for the War because Revan led the Jedi into the war and also because several other Jedi that she taught followed Revan - Malak perhaps?

Though looking at the Hooded Jedi again I noticed that he/she wears gloves not disimilar to those Revan is seen wearing in KoTOR, also in Duron Qel-Droma's vision of Revan from Shadows & Light Revan appears both wearing gloves and hooded.

KoTOR II is a bit vague about exactly what Kreia was doing after she was cast out and it doesn't actually state explicitly when she was cast out of the Order. Though you get the sense that it was during, if not before the Mandalorian Wars, as she says it was because of her philosophies and the way she trained Revan. Having been cast out at some point she began to blame herself and her teachings for Revan's fall, I assume this has to be at least after the end of the Mandalorian Wars as Revan had fallen by this point. She then traced Revan's footsteps after he fell and ended up on Malachor V and we know the rest. However, where and what she is doing in the period after she is cast out until she goes in search of Revan after he returns as a Sith is left pretty much untouched.

 

Well, Malak wasn't Revan's apprentice -- that's fairly well-established. But he was a Revan-fanboy, and there's nothing that says he didn't consider Revan a "Master" worthy of address as such. I agree that several notable points are "off" in the Alek/Malak theory, but that line really made me wonder if JJM doesn't have retcons in hand for all of them.

 

At the point in time where the "Master" comments have been made, the war hasn't TRULY broken out and the Jedi probably do not have military type titles quite yet. Typically, the Jedi do not have a chain of command amongst peers (If 10 Knights go out on a mission it isn't one giving order unless killed, at which point the second in command gives all the orders and so on down the line). Of course, the Jedi crusaders are in a quite extraodinary position that may have caused them to lay out a more "Military Style" chain of command....only in lieu of calling the leader something like "General", the leader is just called "Master" as an honoriffic indicating that the mission is under his (her) overall control. That would be a rather quick and painless way to retcon that statement if Alek were to equal Malek and cloaked figure were to equal Reven.

My hope is that everything isn't a red herring and SOME of the characters turn out to be the ones that are pointed to as of now. Maybe cloaked figure = Reven, Alek/Malek, Kreia/Krynda, Lucien/Scion do not all completely add up, but leading us by the nose with that many characters and turning around and saying "Nope, they were just Cloaked guy, Alek, Kreia, and Lucien" would seem a little irritating.

The only true hope I have is that Zayne=Zayne. The theories that Zayne = Nihilus lead down a path that is pointless to me. Stories are abound of Jedi falling despite efforts to keep them in the light......Zayne would be a nice foil to that by staying in the light despite every reason to turn dark (Hunted by the order, being Gryph's second in command of a Crime Syndicate and such.)

As far as Hazen goes....anyone else get a little feeling that he may actually be Lucien's father? With the amount of mechanical parts and his ravaged body, perhaps Krynda is referring moreso to the death of significant force powers in him and no longer views him as the same person or something like that.

 

I don't really understand, I never like Darth Talon Karrde much because she's so full of herself. Like she always thinks she knows better than me. And I tell her, "No you don't." but to no avail.



Alas.

 

Yeah I think that the Master statement could be easily retconned any number of ways without too much difficutly. I agree with the potential identities thing as well, I think at least some of the characters we are seeing will become some of those they are being speculated to be, else as you say a giant red herring would be frustrating.

I go along with the Zayne not being Nihilus idea too, for starters it would almost justify the padawan massacre and secondly Zayne is such a good character, something really twisted would have to happen to turn him into something like Nihilus. Then if Nihilus, like the Exile, was created because of what happened at Malachor V then anything is possible.

 

I remember while playing Kotor2 when you(the Exile) confront the three masters, Vrook, Lamar and Zez-Kai-Ell(sp?) Kreia comes in and Lamar or Vrook say that they thought that she had died during the Mandalorian Wars and tell the Exile that if Kreia is her teacher then she will surely fall as Revan did.

Anyways, I do remember that "I'm a bit, taller" line and chalked it up to nothing more than a torture rack. I still don't believe the Alek=Malak theory. I prefer Alek=Sion or Nihilus theory, more so Sion because of the bald head and torture but the relationship between Lucien and Krynda reminds me so much of the relationship between Sion and Traya/Kreia... all so confusing.

 

One more thing I wanted to add...it seems that there are some that are thinking Haazen is a possibility for Sion. I think that is completely off base. While Sion held his body together in a gruesome fashion.....I am pretty sure his entire body was actually there. Haazen is "More Machine than man" at this point and is not likely to staple appendages to his body to have fleshy features that can later disintegrate and be held together by the force. Lucien, in my mind, is a way better Sion candidate if Krynda is Kreia. We see Sion being pretty insubordinate (The hacking off of Kreia's arm), and a sort of "I want to impress my mom/master" attitude from the both of them. Lucien has been a pretty sad human up to this point.....always being made to feel inferior and seemingly wanting recognition of his abilities from Krynda.

I actually wouldn't mind if the Exile and Nihilus were by and large left alone in the comics. I think to truly believe Nihilus to be capable of devouring worlds (No matter if it's really a weakness.....) a person eventually able to do such a thing is probably better of remaining faceless and enigmatic. The Exile really did not serve as important a part in the actual war as she did in the aftermath, so seeing what she is doing at this time is probably not necessary. Out of curiosity though, is the exile Canonically human female or just Canonically female?

 

Seeing as you can only play as a human, I'm gonna go with canonically human female.

 

Ha. Forgot that detail. It's been awhile since I played and couldn't remember if there were any other species to choose from.

 

Hmm... I had never thought that the Alek=Malak theory could work, but this line from #8 does cast a new light on it all.

When it comes to 'a person from the comics might become a person from the books', I don't think that is necessary to happen. It is possible, but JJM said himself on the C4 video: "then again, maybe not."
Still, I think that Haazen might have something to do with Sion. Either he will become Darth Sion, or he will somehow creat him...

Concerning Krynda=Kreia, I'm not so sure. Kreia is said to be Revan's master, one he learned most from. Yet Krynda talks about her most prospective students (the Covenant seeres), yet there is no mention of Revan.

 

My biggest problem is that Malak wasn't a padawan, was buddies with rather than apprenticed to Revan, and was named... Malak.

 

"Why don't you creat an alternate reality where you don't have to spell correctly and I talk like this. And your name is Watered Down!"

 

[duplicate]

 

Well, on the name issue, i could see Alek "becoming" Malak when he goes all Sithy, as it would fit with the cheesy-name-quality of many Sith:
Alek: "Hey, maybe i'll call my self MAL-ak, Revan! You know, like Alek, but with MAL for bad in front! It's so clever! I'M so clever!"
Revan: Um, yeah. Whatever. Oh, hey, you've got something on your chin there. No, don't worry, i'll get it. SNAP-HISS ...

Anyway...

Keeping in line with my insane-yet-plausible theories, after recently reading KotOR's second TPB, i started to think maybe Alek isn't Malak, but is actually Revan. We assume that Revan was always his name, but strictly speaking we don't know that -- he may have taken it later, or it may just be his last name. I can't point to why i got this idea without the comics in front of me, but there were some things in his dialogue & behavior that boarded me on that thought-train. Any thoughts on this concept?

 

Someone mentioned the possibility of the "Cloaked Figure" being Kreia. Alek being Revan would fall pretty well in line with that.

 

That's the impression I get reading KOTOR so far, and from what little we know is going to happen in the future issues. And if Alek ends up being the red-clad warrior everyone's afraid of, it might make sense on two levels: Alek was wearing the red spacesuit from Lucien & Co.'s vision at Flashpoint station, and he would later wear red after he steals Mando the Ultimate's red mask (Revan was always kinda red anyway).

KOTOR #19 also appears to be leading up to a confrontation between Squint and Mando the Ultimate, judging from the cover.