Is the relationship between Anakin and Obi-Wan lacking?

First of all, I'm very fond of AOTC. But I was thinking about Anakin and Obi-Wab´s friendship, or lack thereof, as in A New Hope, Obi-Wan talks about Anakin, saying:

LUKE
You fought in the Clone Wars?

BEN
Yes, I was once a Jedi Knight
the same as your father.

LUKE
I wish I'd known him.

BEN
He was the best star-pilot in
the galaxy, and a cunning warrior.
I understand you've become quite
a good pilot yourself. And he was
a good friend.

Now, my problem with this is that in AOTC, Obi-Wan and Anakin don´t seem to be especially good friends. They´re always arguing with each other and most of the time Anakin is disobedient toward Obi-Wan, and Obi-Wan is annoyed at his padawan´s refusal to follow his commands. In The Phantom Menace, the relationship between them, Anakin and Obi-Wan was being formed, so we didn´t get to see the friendship there. And in Episode III, things will only get worse. So I ask; are Anakin and Obi-Wan good friends, because I can´t see it. I feel that their relationship should have been (at first, anyway) resembling that of Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon in The Phantom Menace. That way it would have become more compelling when Anakin would turn to the dark side and they would become enemies.

All comments are welcome,

Thanks, Helgi

 

I think the elevator scene and the scene in Padme's apartment where they talk about Anakin's dreams established that they're good friends.

 

As Ewan McGregor described it, they're good friends who've spent a little too much time together.

Personally, I think the relationship worked and was much more interesting and dynamic than a simple "buddy buddy" type friendship would have been.

 

I loved their relationship. Ep2 did a great job of establishing both the "old buddies" they were and how they still have rifts from time to time. It will only get worse...

 

Your points are well made, but however I feel that their relationship would have been more interesting if it would have evolved from good, to bad to...worse. I really can´t see why Anakin has to be so hostile and unruly toward Obi-Wan for almost the entire movie. It´s as if during the ten years between TPM and AOTC their relationship went sour, but we don´t know why. I can understand that a relationship can go bad, but for something to go bad, it must have been good at some time. And I feel that this facet of their relationship (the friendship) is not shown enough. That´s why I feel a bit perplexed; why are they so annoyed at each other...it almost feels forced. According to Ben in A New Hope, they were good friends. That is not evident in the prequels so far, in my opinion of course. And of course when discussing the story, one can only really use the films as reference, if it´s not in the films it´s not part of the story (this story, that is, Ep I-VI, not the EU).

Thanks, Helgi

 

I think we should keep in mind that Obi-Wan's comments about Anakin to Luke should not be taken at face value. We do know that Old Ben has a history of lying to Luke.
I don't it would have done Luke good if he said: "You know, you're father was a bratty, pain in the butt who turned to the Dark Side."

Also, Obi-Wan's turbulent relationship with Anakin is a great indicator of his future relationship to Luke. In retrospect, he realizes that he was too hard on Anakin, without enough positive reenforcment, and so he's learned his lesson and is more compassionate and patient with Luke. Notice that he doesn't scold or berate him, even when he makes mistakes (like when he goes to the homestead, putting himself in more danger).

 

I thought they came across as good friends who disagree all the time. You know, like brothers who can't seem to get along but still love each other.

When he talks to Luke, Old Ben is reminiscing about the good old days and remembering Anakin the way he wants to remember him. Remember, to Ben, Anakin is dead. It's like a veteran talking about a war buddy who didn't come back; he's probably only going to talk about the good times.

 

As Ewan McGregor described it, they're good friends who've spent a little too much time together.

Couldn't have said it better. Even Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan have their disagreements, but we see a contrast in that relationship and the one between Obi-Wan and Anakin. I believe this is because Obi-Wan is a little more unsure of his training of Anakin, and of Anakin's future, and maybe resents Anakin a little bit because of the brew-ha-ha he creates.

-sj loves kevin spacey

 

Anakin twice stated that Obi-Wan was like a father to him. That speaks loud volumes how great their relationship was. I think the problem is one of interests. Anakin is irrational, hot headed, emotional, and is too ahead of himself. Thing is Anakin Skywalker has tremendous, tremendous potential. Obi-Wan on the other hand is the teacher, the mentor. His abilities is not as great as Anakin's, and by not knighting Anakin, he feels he's doing what needs to be done by taking his time with Anakin's training. Anakin feels he's ready. Obi-Wan feels differently. Anakin thinks potential is all there is to being a Jedi, at least that what I see when I watch AOTC. Obi-Wan knows that potential is only a small percent of being a Jedi. Anakin feels Obi-Wan is holding him back.

But in reality he's not.

 

I suppose we have to bear in mind the film happens at a dramatic time in their friendship and that the friendship also encompasses a ten year history. Perhaps, up till AOTC and meeting Padme again, the Jedi life was enough for Anakin and so the cracks wouldn't have started to show until he discovers someone has been trying to kill Padme, who has been his unrequited love since he was a small boy.

 

I think the relationship between Obi-Wan and Anakin is lacking a bit, but not because of what's presented in this film. For all the complaints of fart jokes and yippes, I think TPM's biggest failure was in establishing a relationship between Obi-Wan and Anakin. The purpose of TPM was to introduce the characters and build the groundwork for the saga. Originally Obi-Wan was to discover Anakin. The lines, "No one can kill a Jedi." "I wish that were so." were originally supposed to be between Obi-Wan and Anakin. The 3 main players of this trilogy are Obi-Wan, Anakin, and Amidala. I believe a connection between Anakin and Amidala is firmly established in this film, but Obi-Wan and Anakin have only 2 scenes together and in their introduction, Obi-Wan doesn't say a single word to the boy. Obi-Wan and Anakin's relationship is lacking because of The Phantom Menace, not Attack of the Clones. Anakin says Obi-Wan is the closest thing he has to a father in this film. I bought that Qui-Gon was like a father to Anakin in TPM. If the roles had been reversed and Obi-Wan was that father figure, the prequel trilogy would have much more resonance. As much as I like Qui-Gon's character, I don't think he's important enough, maybe Episode III will prove me wrong, to lose all this wonderful development between Obi-Wan and Anakin. And it's not like Qui-Gon has to be scraped to get this to work. Just have Obi-Wan discover Anakin and Qui-Gon stay on the ship. Qui-Gon could even mention to Obi-Wan that he believes he's ready for a mission on his own, despite what the Council might say. This would explain why it took so many years for Anakin to be allowed to go out on his own, establish that the Council is very protective of its students, and it'd also be cool to see the first solo missions of Obi-Wan Kenobi and Anakin Skywalker in the first 2 episodes. Just my 2 cents. Love the PT, but this is its biggest flaw.

 

Well their relationship is quite interesting. I mean friends don't have to be buddy buddy and see eye to eye all the time. The scene in on the elevator showed that they joked around sometimes.
Those two had an interesting friendship, there would be arguments but you have to understand that they're Jedi, Obi-Wan is a Master, and he has his duty to do, as Anakin's does too.

 

I thought their relationship was perfect in Attack of the Clones, as they really did seem like very good friends, but as Ewan McGregor said, they're too people who spend far too much time together. I just wish more of it had been established in The Phantom Menace, that's all.

 

Their friendship is shown in the elevator, in the "dreams pass in time" scene, in the bickering during the speeder chase...

And that's BEFORE we hear Anakin mention to anyone how much he looks up to Obi-Wan as a person, a Jedi, a surrogate father of sorts.

They may not have a "beer buddies" kind of friendship, but rather, one of a very close teacher-student relationship. Like you might have if you had the same teacher from elementary to high school. There is deep respect and admiration and caring for each other demonstrated.

What more SHOULD we have seen? Maybe it should have been OBI-WAN and Anakin who go on a picnic!



Rick McCallum loves you!

 

they were close friends, however the lack of harmony between the two was caused by Anakin's defiant nature and desiring for independence. Obi-Wan really cared for Anakin a lot but Anakin got a mind of his own.

 

hmm...
Yet I feel that their relationship isn't very normal. They go from being merely acquaintances in TPM to being teacher-student in AOTC, and we hardly ever see them as friends, agreeing with each other, being supportive, smiling at each other. I see your points, there are a few scenes where their relationship is shown a bit, but, I feel that although I love Qui-Gon, the relationship he had with Obi-Wan in TPM is something that should have been reserved for Obi-Wan/Anakin. Therefore it would have been stronger dramatically when in AOTC Anakin starts disobeying and being difficult. We don't really get to see Anakin's character develop, nor his relationship with Obi-Wan. We just see him as an innocent boy in Ep I and a difficult, disobedient young man in EP II, but we don't see why he has changed, or how. I mean, already in the second Obi-Wan/Abakin scene they're arguing vehemently, in Amidala´s quarters. My question is why? I feel we don´t get to see the way their relationship has developed, and why it has become so strained.

Helgi

 

They go from being merely acquaintances in TPM to being teacher-student in AOTC, and we hardly ever see them as friends, agreeing with each other, being supportive, smiling at each other.

Obi-Wan: You seem a little on edge.
Anakin: Not at all, Master.
Obi-Wan: I haven't seen you this tense since, since we landed in that nest of gundarks.
Anakin: You fell into that nightmare, Master, and I rescued you.
Obi-Wan: Oh, yes.
(Obi-Wan chuckles and Anakin smiles)

I think that scene in the elevator is a great example of their relationship and how much they care for each other.

 

It's because they're not good friends in that they go out to parties, play games, have fun, etc. They're good friends because they know each other so well. Obiwan knows the strengths and weaknesses of Anakin, and Anakin knows the strengths and weaknesses of Obiwan. They continue the theme of symbiotic relationships. They need one another.

Cometgreen

 

people can remain good friends while having differing opinions. It's that difference in opinions that gives respect to their friendship as it keeps each other even on the scale.

 

I think they're friends, just not that good. But I don't think they have a good partnership, with Anakin misunderstanding the reason why Obi-Wan doesn't want him to face the trials yet. The evidence why they are friends is at the beginning of AOTC, when Obi-Wan and Anakin are talking about the time when they fell into that nest of gundarks or something. I think Anakin was a pretty good friend to Obi-Wan when he was younger than in AOTC. Anakin sounded friendlier in the Jedi Apprentice Special Editions and the Jedi Quest books.

 

One thing is that there was 10 years between TPM and ATOC. Qui-Gon Gin was the person Anakin got most attached to. Obi-wan agreed with the Jedi Council on Anikins training.

I think they did do a lot of bantering in Coursaunt chase scean. Most of it, I assumed was good nature. Only near the end was there some tension. Even then, one could see that Obiwan was trying very hard to be patient.

I think the friendship is there-we just saw a time when they were not at their best.

 

My friends and I spend alot of our time insulting each other, mocking, being all around jerks to each other. Most guys do that

 

One problem was that...Obi-Wan did not choose Anakin as his apprentice. He just agreed to train him on Qui-Gon's dying request, and I'm sure that Obi-Wan was pretty reluctant in taking Anakin as his Padawan Learner.

 

Well just think of Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon's relationship. It was a little hard to see their friendship until Qui-Gon gave Obi-Wan a compliment saying that Obi-Wan would become a better Jedi than he was and all. It's a teacher/student friendship as someone said before.

 

I think that they are good friends, they just don't share their friendship with other people. I think that if Anakin and Obi Wan were not friends then the impact of Anakin turning to the darkside would be wasted. We want to see the split between them and how horredous it is.