Jedi character flaws

Recently I've been trying to improve my characters. For this I've been reading articles on Mary-Sues, thinking about Jedi philosophy, and going over details from the movies. However, I have come across a problem.

My main question is this, what flaws is it possible for a Jedi to have?

By our standards some flaws are normal and insignificant, but in a Jedi, are they too destructive? For instance, one of my characters (Seamus Junaid for anyone who knows of him), is judgmental and obstinate. Do Jedi take compassion and compromise too seriously for this to be possible?

Phobias for instance, can a Jedi have one without being fundamentally against Jedi philosophy?

In the movies, what flaws do the Jedi have? Some, we know, are arrogant. But Obi-Wan for instance, he is critical of Anakin, but then not unfairly so.

Where is the balance between being well-rounded and conforming to Jedi philosophy? I think it's possible we see becoming a Jedi as an almost simple task, being born Force-sensative and not turning to the darkside. But what more is there to it? Must Jedi be free of certain flaws? If so, what flaws can they have?

 

My take on this is that Jedi are only human (or maybe mortal is the best word so as to include those who are non-human beings.

In other words, they aren't perfect. Even the Gods and Goddesses of Greek Myth had their flaws. Jedi can be no different.

As for phobias, I think if you were to emphasize the character using the calm of the Force to attempt overcoming the fear it would be fine.. perhaps the character might fail at pushing that phobia aside one or more times.. and later succeed at "letting it pass through them".

A Jedi might would have some sort of mantra they repeat silently or even aloud. Something like the one in Dune:

"I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is he little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain."

or may like the phrase Yoda tells Anakin - Fear is the path to the darkside. Fear leads to anger.. anger leads to hate.. hate leads to suffering"

Ok, that's all I can think of for now..but great questions.. I needed to think abou the answers to some of them myself

 

I suppose it's not so much that Jedi aren't allowed to have weaknesses, it's that they're expected to work to overcome them. Kind of like the transcendental philosophy of working toward the ideal - I'd imagine that this is also like reaching enlightenment or becoming one with the Force. Anakin, for example, probably wasn't treated any differently from the other Jedi because his weaknesses, like his emotional instability, were simply things he needed to learn to overcome. I'm not sure he really wanted to overcome them. As a ten-year-old, he probably didn't realize exactly what becoming a Jedi entailed.

*reads above and realizes that that was quite a tangent* Sorry about that. Interesting questions, though - I'll have to check in on this thread again later.

Mel

 

In a short story I wrote that from the normal citizen's point of view, Jedi are often arrogant and something located in the higher spheres of society, not in the shadows.

I think, a kind of arrogance towards poor people *could* be a flaw in a Jedi's character.

In the movies, for example, we see Jedi only in high circles, the Senate, Kings & Queens, Aristocrats, I wonder whether some Jedi might simply loose contact to the "normal" folks.

 

I suppose they have character flaws like any other person. Some elements taken to the extreme, but not to the point where it would jepordize them being a Jedi.

I have one character (Davin) who is the most laid back character I've ever created. He basically would let anything happen because "It is the will of the force". He doesn't struggle for anything, but lets things either happen or not happen. Then whether they do or don't he will accept it.

It might be very Jedi like....but it's also a character flaw. There is a point where you can be too accepting of things, and Davin often surpasses that.

Kithera

 

hmmm.. this is intersting, you know that explains why jedi-OC are so prone to marysueism, its difficult to know how far to take a jedi flaw before it becomes a 'dark side' tendency.

But there are ways.

One jedi I wrote was very quick tempered and judgemental. He manged to control it mostly, but for instance if it was a case of justice, he would carry it out, and his he had to penalize someone it was often rather harsh. A bit of a overreaction, not inclined to be forgiving. And the person usually deserved it, like if he was tracking down a murderer or something. But even if they did deserve it, he had a tendnecy to take it a b it far.

Heres another one I've used. A jedi who suffers from a severe indepedent streak, even if he/she is in trouble, asking forhelp is the last thing he'd think of. Or even if he'd think of it, he'd keep saying to himself, I can handel this, I don't need to bother people, I'm fine. Often when he finnaly asked for help it was to late. This particular jedi was on a darkside plunde, and he knew it, but refused to ask for help because he thouht he could pull out of it himself. He did succeed, but only when he asked for help. So although the darkside was envolved, the flaw of being overly independent isen't nesscarrily a darkside trait, although in this case it did contribute to it.


Take Ganner Rhysode for example, he wasn't a dark jedi, never fell to the darkside or anything like that. But to say he was without flaws is impossible. He was attention seeking, wanted to be a hero, had a ego, rather vain...these are all flaws, but in the end he did die a hero,even though he wasn't immenssly poweful.


I think thats one reason OC jedi are often mary sue's is every one wants to write a 'amazingly powerful jedi'. Never just average one.




hehe, sorry I sorta went off on several tangents...but I hope I was helpful.

 

Or the character of Tahl, who was not only arrogant, but a bit of a hypocrite: she criticized Qui-Gonn's handling of Obi-Wan, but refused to take criticism on how she treated Bant.

I tried very hard to make my OC Trett as "average" as I could, but he has flaws. He has a reputation for being impulsive and acting without considering the consequences, and he has something of an inferiority complex. He also occasional uses bad language, and drinks coffee (kaff), which (in my particular version) is forbidden to Jedi because the caffeine is regarded as a mild "mind-altering substance!"

His second apprentice, Milo, is a klutz. Which isn't really a character flaw, it's more of an obstacle. He's a fast growing thirteen-year-old, who hasn't quite sorted out his arms and legs yet.

I can see Jedi as being "human" (even the ones who are alien) and getting impatient, bored, irritated, etc. and recognizing those faults.

Pride and arrogance would be two of the biggies, though. They are, after all, what lead to Anakin Skywalker's downfall. In the dialogue of the movie, Mace & Obi-Wan kept saying "if he is the Chosen One," but no one in any book or film has ever asked "But what if he isn't?"

 

Hmm, interesting. Thanks for your insights, everyone, they're very helpful.

 

Bigotry? They've been set apart from childhood for being "special," and have special skills that no one else can even dream of...mix in a little arrogance, and many a young Jedi would probably struggle with this (think Magneto and his cohorts in X-Men as a parallel).

In the opposite direction, I could see insecurity as an issue, for much of the same reasons: being set apart, being different, and suddenly being thrust into this big galaxy you've barely experienced firsthand.