Jedi Grand Master during KOTOR Era...

Who do you think it was? There is a possibility it was Vandar, but there is no conclusive proof. So, who do you think was the Grand Master during that time?

 

Why would we have met the jedi grand master of that era yet? I would think he or she would be at the jedi temple and not Dantooine. Vandar could be it, but i doubt it.

 

Surely the Grand Master would have been on the Council that sentenced the Exile?

 

Was there a Jedi Council on Coruscant at the time? Wasn't Dantooine just a training camp?

 

The Council that sentenced the Exile was indeed on Coruscant, if I remember rightly.

 

^^ Ok cool. That definately makes things easier.

And I agree: the Grand Master (unless there wasn't one) had to be on the Council that booted the Exile.


EDIT:
Wookiepedia's article on the Council lists: Atris, Zez-Kai Ell, Kavar, Vrook Lamar, Lonna Vash (but maybe there were others? - I don't remember the screenshots of that scene).

Of those I'd go with Vrook, but despite Vandar's absence, I'm not so sure if I can rule the little guy out - perhaps he likes to stay on Dantooine. He seemed to have a lot of authority in KotOR I.

 

The Enclave was like the Jedi Praxeum actually.

 

A) The High Council at the time was on Coruscant, and it was that Council, consisting of Vrook Lamar, Zez-Kai Ell, Kavar, Lonna Vash, and Atris, that banished the Exile. However, those were only five people and the Council was a twelve-member body, so we're missing seven members.

B) Grand Master is a courtesy title earned by exceptional individuals. There's no necessity that there be a Grand Master at all times. There may have been one, there may have been none at the time. We have no way of knowing.

 

EDIT: Agreed, though I think the Jedi Council was probably smaller at that time due to the circumstances, with half the Order away with Revan and the Jedi in crisis. A five member council isn't so much of a stretch.

 

I seem to recall the flashbacks the Exile has in KOTOR2 to her trial showing quite a few empty seats but I may be mistaken. It stands to reason Vandar was a member as Vrook hung out on Dantooine too and was a High Council member so I would assume Vandar was.

That said, I can't remember Vrook's position at the Jedi Enclave in KOTOR1, was he senior or lower than Vandar? I've got this feeling at the back of my mind that he may have been the "head" of the Enclave, if so that may have been why he was on the High Council, so Vandar possibly wasn't. On a more practical level, the reason we didn't see Vandar in KOTOR2 was probably because the dark side ending of KOTOR1 had him die, so they didn't want to include him as it'd have complicated the plot... easier just to leave him out.

If we assume Vandar wasn't on the High Council if I had to pick out of the ones we see in KOTOR2 I'd probably say it was Vrook, as he seemed to be "leader" when the Jedi Masters met on Dantooine at the end, although that may have just been because he was the one with the biggest mouth. The Grand Master (if there was one) could also easily enough have been another Jedi Master we never see who died during the war or on Katarr.

 

Nomi. If not the Grand Master than clearly the first among equals.

 

The balding ruby? I doubt it. I wouldn't mind Thon though . . .

 

I'd wager it was Vandar as well.

 

My money's on Nomi Sunrider.

 

I forgot about the sentancing of the exile, that was on courescant, but with all of thsoe empty seats, who knows how many other masters their were out on missions and stuff. Also, since many jedi were going rogue at that time, the exile's actions wmay not have been so uncommon as to warrant he grand master's attention.

 

My bet is on Master Kavar. That is assuming there even IS a "Grand Master" during that time.

 

From what I recall, it was in the Power of the Jedi book that the title "Grand Master" was defined as pertaining to one individual alone, above all the others then sitting on the High Council, at least during the pre-prequel era; despite this never having explicitly been delineated during the prequel-era movies, Yoda himself was referred to as the "Grand Master" of the High Council there. Also, wasn't there that flashback in Courtship of Princess Leia where Short Stack reports back on the Dathomirian Chu'unthor rescue-bungle to some Supreme High Jedi Dude? sitting far above the other masters in that scene? Unless this was simply his liaison back to the greater council as it stood at the time, maybe.

Vandar was definitely the de facto leader of the Dantooine academy during the Mandalorian Wars (per Wayne's discussions with him), but during the Second Sith War, it seemed that the first KotOR game defined Vrook and Vandar's standing on the Dantooine council as being virtual near-equals, despite Vrook's inherent "seniority" there. (Such as you could be with one of Yoda's species.) Likewise, we see Vrooky as having sat on the council there as far back as the Great Sith War, yet also having apparently served on the Coruscant High Council during the not-too-much-later Mando Wars.

Back in late 2004, when the second game was released, I posted a theory that Vrook was -- in effect -- "dragooned" into sitting on the High Council in order to fill out something like a rough quorum there, despite his investiture on the Dantooine council...it's possible that the war cut a great swath through the Coruscanti masters, and/or with others still out serving on the front lines (the war wasn't entirely finished when that historical record was made, IIRC). And this might very well turn out to have been the case in some future source-to-come, since KotOR II was released *before* "Shadows and Light," where we later learnt that Vrook was in fact burning the candle at both ends even prior to the Mandalorian Wars -- ultimately sitting on both councils between the decades.

During the immediate post-Sith War era, possibly, though we don't know whether or not they were even handing out "Grand Ma

 

There probably wasn't a "Grand Master," just the Council. There were no Grand Masters around during the PT. That title is just an honourific given to Luke by the other Jedi Masters of the new Jedi Order.

 

Wrong. Yoda was the Grand Master of the entire Jedi Order during the Prequels.

 

No others, just these five, however odd it may seem. And this Council was indeed on Coruscant.

I think there was no Grand Master in the KOTOR era. For what we know, this rank may have been introduced during the Ruusan Reformation.

 

So theres like a million little yodas running around with lightsabers and we still dont know what species they are. Is anyone else bothered by this? Theres 3 of his race that i know of who held extremely imortant positions in the history of the Jedi. Are they the Whills? Were they the first users of the Force? Did they assemble the Corellian system and the Maw? Are they the Yin to the Siths Wang..i mean Yang? Or are they just another species bumbling around the galaxy? If it was just Yoda running around i would be satisfied for him to remain unexplained...but now that theres a bumch of em i want an answer.

 

Lucas has kept it a secret for a reason...and no they aren't Whills.

I've been looking into the Grand Master issue actually. The nearest person I can find as sort of a Acting Grand Master after KOTOR is Lord Hoth because hes kinda the defacto leader of the Jedi at that point.

 

And that reason is???? Im gonna call bullsh** on this one. George lies.

 

Lucas has said publicly to fans that Yoda is not a Whill and his species was going to stay a secret.

 

I think it is presumptuous to assume there even is a Grand Master at all times of the Jedi Council.

I would argue that a Grand Master would only be neccessary in cases like we see in NJO, when discord divides the jedi and single voice must unify the order.

To begin a retcon to go into all times of the Jedi and pull out one "Grand Master" in each era only belittles the Order.

If Yoda is in fact the only known "Grand Master" of the Old Republic era...let it be with him for now...let's avoid making assumptions and automatically creating a lineage of good guy "bosses"...which it what this line of thinking will lead to.