Jedi Sexuality

I hope I don't get in trouble for this, because I'm honestly not trying to be prurient, but I'd like to bring up the issue of Jedi sexuality. Maybe this has been discussed before, but bear with me.

Anakin says the Jedi are allowed to love, right? And Lucas says that Jedi are not celibate, but they can't get married or form meaningful attachments.

It sounds to me like Lucas is making a parallel here to Plato's Symposium, in which Socrates argues that it's ok for an older man (such as himself) to be in love with a young boy for aesthetic reasons, but the love is ruined if the older man actually has sex with the young boy (hence the term "Platonic love").

We know that in ancient Greece, it was common for an older scholar to take a young boy as an apprentice, and that this apprenticeship usually entailed a sexual relationship as well. So Socrates is saying that it's ok for him to love his apprentice sexually, but it's vulgar to actually have sex with him--that the relationship can't be "ideal" if the sexual desire is actually consummated.

Now the Jedi have a similar teacher/apprentice relationship--an older Jedi takes on a younger student to teach. And the Jedi are allowed to have sex, but not allowed to marry. And there are definitely sexual implications in the master/padawan relationship. So is Lucas trying to say that ?ideal? love is the opposite of what Socrates argues? That it?s ok to have sex, but that the love cannot be connected to that? And isn?t there an implication that the master/padawan relationship is ideal because the union is beyond marriage and totally within the Jedi order?

So maybe Anakin?s transgression isn?t that he got married, or has sex, but that he fell in love outside the master/padawan relationship? And that his relationship is outside the Jedi order and therefore outside their jurisdiction?

Personally, I think Lucas?s ideas about love are a bit muddled, but I?d like to know other people?s opinions.

Hope I don?t offend anyone by bringing up this topic...

 

lets just face it...jedi's fornicate.
and they are not real.
and if they were, they would fornicate...just like all the catholic priests who dont get any.

 

hmmm. O---k---a--y

Lucas is in Nambla?

so are you saying Anakin and Obi-wan are haveing sex and lucas hides this.

What are you saying?

 

There is no implication that the Master/Apprentice relationship is a sexual one. A Master trains the Padawan in the ways of fighting, anything else implied is speculation/projection on the part of the person suggesting it.

Jedi not allowed to form attachments shows how stifling it is to Anakin. His sexual, emotional, and personal relationship is with Padme, no one else.

 

It's Star Wars. I don't think there is any relation to Socrates or Greek history there. Let's keep it simple people.

 

You never know man.

Look at Lucas. He had all those kids and he's not the birth father. No wife right?

I think something Kinky is going on in the GFFA and in Lucas bad room.

I don't trust that horrny wookie

 

hehe!

 

I've always thought that a master/padawan relationship is more like that of a parent/child relationship. A young padawan's master, I think, assumes the role of a parent figure in the absence of the child's real parents. I think the only instance of Jedi having sex that George has ever thought about was Anakin and Padme's marriage, and even then not too graphically.

 

The ONLY Padawan/Master relationships which are of a sexual nature are the ones in those slash fics you find all over the net. Do not justify Jedi having sex so it can be written into a fanfic and be canon

 

No, this is like Batman & Robin...
Batman gets mad because Robin has a chance to be with Poison Ivy and he's jealous because only he's allowed to date the women in the movies! Robin's the sidekick, he can't score!

On a deeper level, if Robin waters Poison Ivy, then he's destroying the relationship he has with Batman!

WOW! [face_shocked]
Maybe that $5.00 I blew on Batman & Robin in 1997 wasn't a waste!
I felt so ashamed over that!
Now I see that if a film like Batman & Robin has the ability to teach, maybe others I felt stole hours away from my life at the time, might have too... [face_shocked]

So many movies... so much time... must justify seeing the Crow: City of Angels...


In all honesty, I can see the point of the topic... I just don't think that the Jedi were supposed to marry due to Jedi commitments and potential for their offspring to be corrupted by the Dark Side.

It's not really due to some unspoken relationship between Master & Apprentice... if a Padawan has a family, how can they devote their time to learning about the Force?
How can a Master devote his time to his Padawan if he has family concerns?

Marriage and commitment would be a problem.

 

It's not about the Nookie...

It's about focus and Commitment...

If a Jedi is focusing on someone/thing other than the Master and/or the lessons...

 

The padawan/master relationship is more like a father-son, mother-son, or mother-daughter, or father-daughter relationship depending on who the master is, be them male or female. Lucas said that Jedi have sex, but don't have attachments like romantic relationship. They don't because they have to fulfill certain needs while at the same time direct their minds and attention to what they are about, so anything that interferes with that like marriage is not permitted. Anakin stated twice that Obi-Wan was like a father to him.

 

Where do all the Force-sensitive kids come from if Jedi don't make with the lovin'? I thought it was a genetic thing? And Jedi have sex without commitment? I guess the Jedi don't just dress like 60's hippies...

 

It's Star Wars. I don't think there is any relation to Socrates or Greek history there.

Maybe not, but the name "Skywalker" comes from the Hebrew Bible.

 

Force sensitives don't need to have jedi parents.

 

Jedi don't need sex to make more Force sensitives, it's all in the midichlorians, all in the midichlorians...

 

So can non-Force senitive parents have a Force-sensative child, and can a Force-Sensative parent have a non-Force-senstive child? I realize that it is midichlorians that allow Jedi to access the Force, but why does one person have more than another? I always assumed that it was heriditary...

 

One thing I have to say about this topic

What the hell?

 

[edited]?
Eeeeeeeeeeeeewwwwwwwww! Masters and Apprentices falling in love? *suddenly feels dirty*

I've heard of that gay Greek thing before.

YJ edit: That acronym isn't allowed here.

 

LOL! Well, I give this thread about 2 seconds before it has to be locked

Anyway, ever since TPM I have always assumed that Jedi CAN have sexual relationships. When Qui-Gon asks Shimi "Who was the father?" I took that to mean he was EXPECTING to know Anakin's father personally. Which to me means Jedi can endulge in the pleasures of the flesh! What they can't do is fall in love, form an attachment, or get married.....

Which is another exapmle of the upside-down world the Jedi are living in. They can have sex, but can't fall in love. They take babies from their parents and don't let them ever have any cotact with them (I assume if a baby is detected as being force-sensitive at birth, they are taken, WITHOUT the Parents permission. They then train these children to become killers, when they are as young as 5. The Jedi-Padawan relationship is a little like father and son, but again the Master can't show love or attachment to his apprentice!

The Jedi Kinghts are a cold, emotionally incontinant bunch! Which is a HUGE surprise to me, because I always thought the Jedi would be like Saints.....

However, I think by the OT, Yoda and Obi-wan have realised their error. Look how much warmth they show Luke (Obi especially) in comparisson to Anakin. It also seems to me that Qui-Gon Jinn had much more affection within him, and I suppose he learned this (along with his insolence) from his Master, Count Dooku!

 

Huh.
Jedi's cant get married or have "commited" relationships, but they arent celebate.
That is kinda screwy.

So... they're players?

Cool.
hehe, I bet Qui-Gon was trying to get with Shmi.
"Come on baby, its a hard life..."

EDIT- Wow. This IS really weird. I mean, I understand the concept of staying focused (& everyone knows that "special someone" can mess with your focus) but this really does point to the Jedi being players, One-nighters, lovers & leavers, whatever you want to call them. I guess its kinda funny, but, really...
Thats just weird.

 

I don't see a reason to lock this thread unless people are too immature to discuss something like this.

 

[edited]

YJ edit: Inappropriate.

 

Lets hope so YodaJeff, because it's actually a rather interesting subject.

Not the sexuality side, as much as they overall morality of the Jedi Knights.

 

I think it's really weird, even inconsistent...Here GL keeps saying these are family-friendly stories and that's why we don't see any graphic sex (not that we don't WANT to, heheh)and yet he puts the jedi in a position where the only way they can be sexual is in an emotionless context, a context outside marriage. He also has Anakin & Padme marry. They did not HAVE to marry in order to get Luke and Leia; in fact I had assumed they didn't, and was really, genuinely shocked that they did marry at the end of AOTC - in fact, that was the single biggest surprise for me in the movie.

It would have made way more sense if the Jedi were supposed to be celibate, like Catholic clergy. One could understand that better, and there would still have been the forbidden aspect of Anakin and Padme's relationship. I could also see the logic in forbidding sex altogether, as it fits into the whole idea of a commitment to the Order, living an austere lifestyle completely focused on the Force, etc. Making love forbidden, but not sex, would seem to point to Jedi being completely emotionless where sex is concerned - they'd have to be VERY certain that their partners be emotionless about it too. I mean, can you really imagine OB1 or Mace just getting it on with strangers "4F" style? That's so callous, so cynical, so...tasteless. It really compromises the elegance I have always associated with the Jedi.

Don't get me wrong, I am not a prude about sex and I'm OK with purely casual sexual relationships. But I also appreciate consistency, and GL is NOT BEING CONSISTENT! He's also making the Jedi Order look totally foolish. Maybe that's part of why so many people hate the prequels: because the Jedi are looking worse with each one.

I'm no EU buff, but at least Luke apparently had some sense about re-establishing the Order so Jedi can fall in love and marry. Probably he figured, look how much the no-love rule wrecked my old man, I'm not going there.

Yeah, this is just too weird.