Jolee Bindo out of character?

According to the Revan novel, Revan decided not to take Jolee and Juhani with him because they were too close to the Jedi Council and the order. Did they screw up? Juhani I can believe that from, but Jolee? Jolee said the Order left him, and even when Bastilla Shan was going to give him the "come back to the order discussion" he wasn't interested, he was a in self imposed exile, he said the order failed him. His view of love which clearly Revan came to believe, makes it very hard to imagine he would willingly declare his loyalty to the Jedi Council. Unless post Battle of Lehon, he just dropped his view of love in favor of position and his view of the council and the order did a total 180? Because of what exactly? Anyhoo, I felt that it was just an excuse by the author for Jolee not to come along with Revan to Rekkiad.

 

I agree, Jolee was out of character.

 

Dingdingding! [face_alien_1]

 

Last time I checked, in the Knights of the Old Republic 1 game, Jolee's backstory was revelaed that Jolee left the Jedi because he fell in love or something where he didn't agree with some of the Jedi ways of life or whatever and then lived in exile on the woookie planet

 

It really would depend on how the Order was handling things following the Jedi Civil War. I mean, Atris and he ilk are around, so it presents issues but perhaps Jolee's experiences with Revan sort of led the Council to court his input on some things, maybe in a very vague advisory capacity.

 

Isnt he supposed to be on some sort of Rimward mission?

 

Mical mentions those during KOTOR II but I don't think that we ever get a definitive date for those IIRC. For all we know, those happened before Jolee split with the Order.

 

It would be a better explanation for why he is not around.

 

So would plenty of other things. It's sort of hard to say without knowing much of the details. A single sentence doesn't really give a lot, now does it?

 

It would certainly would be more in character.

 

You know all the unwritten background context then? You know the nature and depth of this supposed connection to the Order?

 

Do you?

 

It doesn't matter. I'm not making a claim.

 

This is a very, very, very stupid thing to get one's feathers ruffled over. If you two can't play nice, perhaps it's best if you dropped the topic. We don't need people fighting to get the last word in.

 

I haven't read Revan yet, but I struggle with the notion of a character's creator writing them out-of-character.

 

David Gaider didn't write Revan.

 

I think we don't really know enough to judge whether or not he was "out of character" in this situation or not. This is still a failing of the book, however, as it makes a point to show as few of the KOTOR characters as possible, therefore we have no way of knowing exactly how Jolee's character may or may not have changed in the time between KOTOR and the novel. I do tend to agree that it was just a lazy excuse in a lazy book.

 

I think we definitely have, as has been discussed to length in other threads, a fair bit more information to judge characters like Bastila than Jolee. And even then, in Bastila's case, the discussion is (in my opinion) mitigated more by evidence in TOR that shows she maintained more connection to the Jedi than the book seems to imply. Enough that she imparted a holocron to the Order at some point.

That's not to say that Karpyshan didn't misstep in a lot of things. He absolutely did. The book's an average read at best even if you don't really come in with too many preconceived notions. In regards to characters like Jolee and Juhani, I'd be interested in a bit more detail to be sure. It's safe to say that Juhani stays with the Order but her fate is still pretty much unknown if I'm not mistaken. Particularly in light of the Dark Wars. For Jolee, the interesting thing would be the extent of his connection to the Order. I definately say that it probably isn't anything too official but I don't think it'd be too much to suggest that Revan's redemption might have given the old grouch a bit of the optimism that he'd lost. But that's just my own hope for him, really. If anything, it's less of an inconsistency and more a case of lazy writing. Though still not as bad as the omission of Carth.

 

That whole joke of a novel by DK was out of character.

 

I don't believe Drew Karpyshyn created Jolee Bindo, though I'm not entirely sure.

I think the simple truth is that DK didn't have feel he had time to go into why the whole Ebon Hawk crew couldn't come with Revan, so he gave very short explanations: the one with Jolee just doesn't seem to add up. There's probably more to it. Am I misremembering, or isn't Revan just guessing himself? He may have not spoken with Jolee in two years, and wouldn't know how to find him.

 

It sounds fairly definitive in the book "Not everyone," Revan countered. "Juhani and Jolee are Jedi; they still answer to the Council. They might feel obligated to say something about this." (pg. 74)

 

This is exactly what I'm talking about. Jolee answers to the council? That doesn't make any sense. He's a grey Jedi with very radical views. His character must have changed drasticly for that statment to be true.

 

Then again, it could be that Jolee decided that the Order needed some sense knocked into it and took a more active role. I haven't picked up Revan, but it's a plausible explanation (I agree it could have been done better though). Having finally gotten around to playing through KoTOR I will say that while Jolee is a "gray" Jedi not beholden to the Council, he was also keeping a pretty close watch on Revan's behavior throughout the game.

 

Well, "might" could be the operative word; Revan doesn't know for sure, and he doesn't want to take the risk. In actuality, I imagine all of his former teammates would have jumped at the opportunity to come and help him, save perhaps Carth, who had responsibilities elsewhere.

 

When Revan says "might" in this context, he isn't refering to the whereabouts of Jolee or Juhani. What he is saying is that, if he went to either of them with his plan and asked for help, they may tattle on him to the Jedi (because they belong to the order and have close ties with it) and get him in trouble. Therefore Revan's reasons for not telling these two are rather self serving, and they do point to Jolee being a full fledged member of the Order.


Then again, it could be that Jolee decided that the Order needed some sense knocked into it and took a more active role. I haven't picked up Revan, but it's a plausible explanation (I agree it could have been done better though). Having finally gotten around to playing through KoTOR I will say that while Jolee is a "gray" Jedi not beholden to the Council, he was also keeping a pretty close watch on Revan's behavior throughout the game.

This would be a pretty good retcon, but it probably shouldn't have happened like this to begin with.