Keira Knightley in The Phantom Menace

This has always bugged me. Was she Amidala in all the scenes were she's wearing the clown make-up, or was she Amidala in a few clown make-up scenes, or was she..... man this is confusing!

Does anyone have a list of all the scenes she appeared in?

 

If you see Padme and the Queen together, she is the queen. Notably the scene when they agree to escape outside the Naboo hanger("we are brave, your highness") and the scene where Padme reveals her identity to Boss Nass. There might be others but these are the ones I noticed.

 

The "We are brave your highness" scene was a bluescreen shot, I thought.

 

Keira Knightley was never Padme in any scene. She was Sabe.

 

Thats definitely possible. It would also explain the horrendously-timed pause the Queen takes when she looks to Padme ("danger...to us all" or however it goes). She's defintitely there for the reveal scene to Nass, since there are stills of her together with Portman there.

 

Yeah I don't think there is anything other than fan guesswork as to who is who when.

 

It isn't guesswork; I know their faces and voices so well that I feel extremely confident in my ability to tell the difference between the two. Zombie is correct that the hangar scene on Naboo, early in the film, in which Padme says "We are brave, your highness," has Knightley as the Queen; also the revelation to Boss Nass clealry features Knightley as the Queen and Portman as Padme. Another is the scene in which the TF is escorting the Queen and her entourage down those massive steps; Portman is Padme and Knightley is the Queen. They look alot alike, it's true, but Knightley has a smaller mouth than Portman, and her face is more oval-shaped. The white make-up disguises these differences to a degree, but they're still perceptible if you look closely.

 

The girl who looks and sounds like Knightley is Knightley (Sabe); the one who looks and sounds like Portman is Portman (Padme).

For example:

SABE: Viceroy, your occupation here has ended.

 

My point was that Lucasfilm has not come out and said "this is Knightley here and this is Portman here." It's been left deliberately ambiguous. And however confident you are in your guesswork, it's still guesswork.

 

This is not one of those "unknowable things" simply because Lucas hasn't made an official statement about it. As Vortigern pointed out, the two actresses look significantly different, and their voices are distinguishable.

 

But she portrayed the Queen in a few shots.

 

And your point is?

 

Let's watch the tone there okay?

In several scenes, they dubbed Portman's voice over both Padmé and "the Queen".

 

Is that your personal opinion or is there an official source ( book, special feature, etc. ) which states as much?

 

Well, it is not quite as easy as it seems. You can tell by their facial structures if you really study what Knightley and Portman looked like back then, but the Queen's makeup and head-dresses are decieving because they alter what the facial structure looks like. For instance, in the hanger scene--Knightley has a smaller mouth, but the Queen's makeup has a design that changes the appearance of the mouth by the lip makeup that makes it appear smaller. And while Knightley has a slightly rounder face, the Queen's head-dress in that scene envelopes the head in such a way that it makes it look round no matter who is wearing it. So the "clues" are somewhat invalidated. To top it, all of Knightley's scenes are probably dubbed by Portman--and then Portman's voice is altered electronically to make it lower. To me, the Queen in those scenes sounds exactly like any of other scene she is in as portrayed by Portman--which, incidentally, does not sound like her anyway since they pitch-shifted her voice in post-production so that the "reveal" would be a surprise.

At the same time though, I'm pretty sure people on the film have pointed out "in this scene its not really Portman, etc." While the hanger scene could be a bluescreen, it makes much more sense that Knightley would be playing the scene, since its more than just that one shot, Portman is Padme throughout that whole rescue sequence, and you really cannot tell the difference. Thats why my basic understanding is: if they are together in a scene, Padme is herself (Portman) and the Queen is Knightley.

 

What zombie said. That's all I am trying to say. Nine years and we're still debating it. That means it's not quite as easy as it seems.

 

That is not accurate. It's Knightley's voice; it's recognizable from her other films.

On the other hand, if an official source ( like a making-of book or doc ) could be cited which actually established that at some point Knightley was overdubbed by Portman, then that would be great. But I suspect no such source exists.

 

I'm sorry, but all of zombie's and Strilo's insistence to the contrary cannot convince me to disregard my own senses. I am not imagining things when I see and hear Keira Knightley in the stairway scene, the hangar scene, the Boss Nass reveal scene and the throne room/"occupation here has ended" scene. Saying that it's all "guesswork" is like saying it's guesswork as to whether the color red is visible on-screen. It either is, or it isn't, and no official statement is required to figure it out. There is no guessing involved.

 

I don't know about that. To me it sounds pretty much the same as any of the Queen's scenes. I think what might be happening is that Knightley has a much deeper voice, so when they lowered Portman's dubbing it just coincidentally sounds like Knightley.

 

Why is it so hard to accept that Keira Knightley spoke her own lines?

Don't forget the R2-D2 "what is its number" scene. That's pure Knightley!

EDIT: and the Coruscant landing platform.

 

Yes, the "Ah-too Detoo" scene and Coruscant landing are also "pure Knightley" as Arawn says. Even her white make-up has a slightly different tone than when it's used on Portman; whether this is a result of each actress' individual dermatology, or of a differently-based make-up being used, is an open question.

BTW, I've been arguing for Knightley's visible presence in each scene, with mostly her own voice accompaniment. IMO this question is somewhat less clear-cut than the visual presence, and here I believe Strilo and zombie have a point regarding "guesswork". There is at least one instance in which I opine that Portman dubbed Knightley's lines: the hangar scene (but not throughout the entire scene). I could be mistaken, and again Strilo and zombie have a point here, IMO. But for the most part it's Knightley-speaking-Knightley whenever the actress can be seen on-screen.

 

Obviously the scene where Palpatine and Valorum greet the Queen off her her ship on the Coruscant landing platform is Knightly, as Portman/Padme is clearly visible in that scene.

 

Well thats basically the point I am making: its really too close to say just by your ears and eyes alone, because Knightley's appearance is decieving in some costumes and the voice may very well be dubbed anyway. But if Portman is in the same scene/shot as Padme then pretty much its safe to say that Knightely is playing the Queen. While you could do bluescreen/splitscreen work, that kind of defeats the entire purpose of casting an actor that looks exactly like Portman to play her double.

 

I agree about the voice, but not about the visual presence. I don't mean to seem like I'm boasting, but I've worked as a portrait artist and have a keen eye for proportion and the millimetric differences between facial characteristics. Most people are born with this ability anyway -- to recognize distinct faces at a glance; but in my case it's an art I happen to have studied, and to me recognizing Knightley in a scene is the same as spotting, for example, the color red.

 

For anyone that doesn't think it's Knightley, I would advise more watching of TPM. The two are easily distinguished.