Lightsaber Forms

I've seen so much on the subject of styles of lightsaber combat, and so much of it contradicts the first ever post I saw on the subject. This is what I recall the styles being, and have seen reinforced by some sites. Anyone better-versed on the subject and I, please correct me.

Form I - A 'training form'. Quite basic, and something of a foundation for every other style, but deceptively simple--a true master would be able to trick an opponent who looks down on the style with relative ease.

Form II - Essentially, lightsaber fencing--thrust, parry, riposte--whereas all the others are some type of swordsmanship, utilizing slashing and cutting. Elegant and efficient. Not as good against ranged weaponry, but nigh-unbeatable against another lightsaber. The favored form of Count Dooku, who could beat anyone but Yoda with it in practice.

Form III - Originally started as an anti-blaster style as the weapons came into prominence. Eventually developed into the supreme defensive style--a practitioner might never win, but a true master would be invincible. A lot of the Jedi who survived the Clone Wars only did so because they were well-versed in this style. My Additional Interpretation: As I understand it, victory in Form III without alternating into another Form's offensive maneuvers requires waiting out your opponent, getting him impatient and frustrated so he does something stupid, and then you stike. Obi-Wan's favored style, post-TPM.

Form IV - High-energy, rapid attacks, lots of movement. Practitioners of Form IV use acrobatic maneuvers and complex footwork to outmaneuver and overwhelm an opponent from multiple angles. Yoda's and Qui-Gon Jinn's style. Obi-Wan favored this style as well, until he saw its weakneses when Darth Maul held off both him and Qui-Gon, at which point he switched to Form III.

Form V - Similar to Form IIO in the anti-blasterfire department. However, whereas Form III became defensive, Form V focused on offense and counterattacks, including reflecting blaster fire back at its point of origin. Practioners skirt the Dark Side due to the aggressive basis of the style. This form is favored by Anakin Skywalker.

Form VI - Taking points from Forms I, III, IV, and V, this "diplomat's style" is less of a true Form of its own than a way for less combat-focused Jedi to have a well-rounded education in using the lightsaber. My Addtional Interpretation: Practitioners also learn to use body language and short, soothing words, phrases, and sounds to use in battle as an additioanl way of perhaps talking an opponent out of a fight after weapons have been drawn. Supposedly, no practitioner of Form VI survives the Clone Wars without switching to another style as their primary.

Form VII - Possibly the most advanced and deadly style. Still in development as of the Clone Wars, there is perhaps one master of the Form, Mace Windu. Form VII in use appears random, with strikes and blocks sometimes seeming like basic, uneducated flailing, coming in no discernible pattern. Form VII is as much a philosophy as a style of battle, students learning difficult concepts such as paradox and potentially coming close to the Dark Side. The style calls upon the Force to directly and instinctively direct strokes and parries, rather than a set of practiced offensive and defensive maneuvers allowing for more accuracy and explaining the seeming randomness described above.

 

Form VII is Vaapad, and it was completed before AOTC. Sora Bulq, who turns to the Dark Side weeks after Geonosis, is also proficient in it. Mace Windu and Sora Bulq trained together in it.

 

Okieday.

So aside from Vaapad, are than any Forms that have names aside from "Form n"? Would characters refer to them like that?

 

Form VII is Juyo. There were more people than Mace who used it. Darth Maul used it. Vaapad is an expansion of it. It's more than just a lightsaber form, it's a state of mind. Depa Billabe, Mace Windu and Sora Bulq have mastered it, though Mace was the only one who didn't fall to the dark side.

 

What is Obi-Wan's form in ANH? What about the Sith's style?

 

Luke Skywalker was also Form V, correct?

 

Vaapad is pretty good nonsense, I have to admit. Simply because it's not physically possible.

It's based on the premise you launching high speed random blows.

Okay . . . just how fast can one land a punch? Windu landed six in a few secs against Vastor when they first went Matrix. Even with Force enhancement, you can't move so fast. It doesn't look credible.

Secondly, how can blows be random? You see that saber blade coming at you, you fend it off, or not. It's that simple. Does a blow come at you, then beocme another move midmove? Sounds fancy, perhaps, but vapaad is more comical than realistic. And it's realism that I'm looking for.

 

6 blows in a few secs is perfectly possible.

 

If it's realism your looking for, then why are you reading Star Wars?

 

"Luke Skywalker was also Form V, correct?"

I'm under the impression that Luke doesn't have a true Form. Obi-Wan and Yoda only taught him what was required to defeat Vader, so they might have skipped lessons in lightsabre Forms. I assume he crafts his own Form; as of the NJO, he's created a totally unique and immensely powerful form of his own.

Obi-Wan still uses Form III as of ANH. Vader continues to use Form V.

All Younglings begin with Form I, though this first Form isn't limited to learners; Kit Fisto uses an advanced version of Form I in The Cestus Deception.

 

Form I - Shii-Cho
Form II - Makashi
Form III - Soresu
Form IV - Ataru
Form V - Djem So
Form VII - Juyo
Advanced Form of Juyo - Vaapad (Mace, Sora, Maul)

There are three additional forms that are rare amongst the Jedi. They were presented in the WotC's third Web Enhancement for Hero's Guide. Here they are:

Sokan is a style that focuses on mobility and evasion as a part of lightsaber dueling. Originating during the great wars with the Sith Empire, the style often led to lightsaber duels that spanned large amounts of terrain as they ran their course. In the time just before the Clone Wars, Sokan warriors integrated many elements of Master Yoda?s highly kinetic use of Form IV into their own ancient techniques to create a blend of styles that relies on mobility and agility. The style encompasses everything from quick, darting movements to smooth tumbles and strikes that arc toward the vital areas of an opponent?s body.

The variant form known as Shien is a rarely seen style
that, while effective, is almost a topic of controversy among lightsaber masters due to the drastically different grip taught by practitioners of the form. The style calls for the Jedi to hold the lightsaber horizontally with the tip of the blade out away from the body, and all strikes are made by sweeping the arm forward as though throwing a punch while whipping the blade forward quickly in a broad arc. Adi Gallia was one of the few Jedi around the time of the Clone Wars known to actively practice the form, as was the Anzati Jedi called Nikkos Tyris.

Another uncommon form called Niman is a style often
taught in the Jedi Order but rarely mastered by more than a few Jedi each generation. Niman teaches the use of two lightsabers simultaneously, which can be used as a pair of offensive weapons, or as an offensive weapon and a parrying blade. Many Jedi study the basics of Niman, and such rudimentary training has often been the edge needed to prevail over a foe.

 

Maul is a Juyo user not Vaapad.

 

Why do we go over this every 2 or 3 months?

 

Shien sounds a lot like a sorta Tai Chi type of swordplay, just reading the description makes me think of Mai-Bu in Crouching Tiger, lots of thrusts and quick 'arm waving'

what about the reverse grip style where the hilt is held at about head leve with the blade pointed downward? (i think i, jedi calls it reverse Y or some random thing like that, it's seen in Halcyons memories and also in AOTC)

 

I wouldn't worry about the lightsaber forms too much. Episode 3 will pretty much throw all of that out the window.

 

"Why do we go over this every 2 or 3 months?"

Because we go over it every two or three months. And every time, people come out and offer fifteen different opinions on the same subject, so someone just skimming the subject while bored remembers it a few months later and comes back for an answer.

In my case,

Another question: how much of this lore survives to the NJO? I have heard that discovered Holocrons instruct Luke in the old ways, like calling apprentices "Padawans".

 

Well, Luke doesn't use the word padawan even though he knows it, so it's safe to say that he's tossed a few things from the old Jedi order out the window .

On lightsaber forms, my guess would be that they're either gone or not in very widespread use. Most of Luke's new Jedi students seem to be encouraged to develop their own skills and styles, both in the Force and in lightsaber technique. Aside from basic instruction that lays down the fundamentals of lightsaber combat (such as that we see in I, Jedi), most of the NJO's lightsaber practice seems to come from mock-duels or actual fighting (against blasters, Dark Jedi lightsabers or amphistaffs). Also, as far as I can remember there's never a thought from one of the NJO Jedi that goes "He/she favored form X because of personality trait Y". That may just be because most of the books are written before the information on lightsaber forms came out, though.

I'd lean towards the forms being gone, but can't say for sure.

 

"I wouldn't worry about the lightsaber forms too much. Episode 3 will pretty much throw all of that out the window."

I don't see how. Nick Gillard doesn't use the Forms to base his stunts on, but that doesn't mean they should be disregarded. In fact, the Ep3 Visual Dictionary confirms Mace uses Vapaad.

 

Excellence...

You have a lot to learn. Human beings in traditional martial arts can learn to simultaneously strike and block, effectively turn six movements into three.

As well one second is a long time in a real fight. A heck of a long time.

 

read vaapadmaster's essay on the difference between vaapad and Form VII.

There's also a Form Zero, the art of using a lightsaber without turning the blade on. It's not really an actual combat form, but Yoda tells students that it's supposed to teach the appopriate times of when force is necessary or not.

Or check the TFN.net encyclopedia on "Form," very useful tool.

 

I'd also like to know who uses what form. Here's a list so far.

Obi-Wan: Form III
Anakin: Form V
Dooku: Form II
Mace Windu: Form VII Vaapad
Yoda: Form IV
Qui-Gonn: Form IV
Kit Fisto: Form I
Luke: Mishmash of Form V and/or Form VII (not Vaapad)
Sora Bulq: Vaapad
Depa Bilba (Mace's former Padawan): Vaapad
All the Jedi that died in AOTC: Form VI

 

In the end of TUF Luke uses a compeltely different form - not actually vaapad, but something that he created on his own, something that's actually a force use with a lightsaber than a style/form.

 

Eh, all the bunk about "lightsaber forms" always seemed kind of lame to me. Same as that "Sith crystals can break the blade of a Jedi saber".

 

really? more incentive to pick up TUF then.

EDIT: In LOE, there's something called Lus-Ma. Anybody know what the heck is that?

 

I'm sure the sith use a few specal forms of lightsaber combat. It will be interesting to see how palpatine fights. Also i think that a sith using a double bladed saber may be philisophicaly using one of the 7 forums, but not the actually movements from it. Why would you be using a 1 bladed combat form when you have a double bladed weapon?